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Wisdom of trading 308QV for Mondial T Cab

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by kdross, Oct 20, 2004.

  1. kdross

    kdross Formula Junior

    Feb 10, 2002
    872
    NJ
    Full Name:
    Ken
    I currently have a 1985 308QV. Since purchasing the 308QV, my wife and I have had 2 boys. I am now considering a 2+2 Ferrari so the entire family can attend car events. There is a red/tan 1989 Mondial T cab with 30k miles for sale that I am considering. The owner wants to do an even trade for the cars. While I would love getting a 2+2, I am concerned about getting a first year Mondial T. I am also concerned about having a cab. The car has a recent belt change, updated alt, and the ecu 2.7 update. I have heard so many problems about the early 348/Mondial cars that I am concerned I will go from a trouble free car to a money pit. What do other people think I should do?

    Finally, what is the current price for this Mondial T?


    Ken
     
  2. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    If it was my car, I would hold out and get a 3.2 cab and some cash back. The t will cost more in the long run on maintenance.

    Mondials are great cars and much better GT cars than their 3x8 cousins.
     
  3. hank sound

    hank sound F1 Veteran

    Jan 31, 2004
    5,786
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Hank Garfield
    Hi,
    Sounds like a good trade upward.
    (1) involves the whole family (think of spousal harmony - so cool!).
    (2) Motronic 2.7 upgrade done
    (3) no mouse belts
    (4) big belt service done
    Lots of folks like the 89t better than the newer years. If its been properly cared for, it could be a great deal for you.
    The $ numbers probably start with a 4.
    Cheers, Hank
     
  4. 308GTS

    308GTS Formula 3

    Dec 27, 2001
    2,220
    TN
    It sounds like it has most of the updates if not all so getting a newer Mondial T wouldn't make any difference. You said it is 2.7 Motronic, Nippon Alt. Those are 2 of the major changes. Last important on is single disc clutch. Does it have a single disc clutch? Sounds like a good trade for you.
     
  5. flyingboa

    flyingboa Formula 3

    Nov 27, 2003
    1,551
    Italy/India
    Full Name:
    Eugenio
    I have made a different choice. 328 is and will be my ferrari, even if I have now 2 kids. When I want to go somewhere, it is just my wife and I so I try to leave the kids with relatives. If it is not possible I use the wife's car. I would stay with the QV, perhaps the best looking car of the 3x8 serie.
    Ciao
    Eugenio
     
  6. jharkercfduc

    jharkercfduc Karting

    Sep 4, 2004
    133
    riverside california
    Full Name:
    jonathan harker
    went to crystal cove last saturday and saw three black convertible mondial's. I took my wife with me and she got to see a family get into a mondial, mom, dad, son, and daughter, all had big smiles, I'm trying to get my wife to let me buy a ferrari and that helped alot. my son is due in january and I can't wait to have my boy next to me in a ferrari. two boys with me would be even better, imo the question is which mondal to get. I'm looking at the 3.2 and the 89t's also. good luck.
     
  7. 308GTS

    308GTS Formula 3

    Dec 27, 2001
    2,220
    TN
    3.2s are known as the most reliable. T have more power and better brakes but require engine out services and to many are less reliable. The big plus to the 3.2 is that services are performed with engine in situ. Also look at the T has EFI and Direct Fire where as the 3.2 is CIS FI and has distributors. When you get into Ts or 348s you need to make sure it is 2.7, Nippon Denso alt, single disc clutch etc.
     
  8. milstanselnino

    milstanselnino Formula Junior

    Jan 8, 2004
    573
    MN
    Full Name:
    Jon P.
    As long as your children always remain very small, you will be fine. Seems to me that the back seat is not designed for anyone to actually occupy.
     
  9. sparta49

    sparta49 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Mar 3, 2001
    7,794
    LA
    Full Name:
    Frank
    Go for the mondial , after getting my 348 ( same engine as Mondial t) I got rid of my 308QV because of the lack of power, I was also considering the Mondial T Cab at the time . I know the Mondial is heavier and handles differently than the 348 but the diff in power between the engines ( 3.0 or 3.2 to the 3.4) is noticeable.
     
  10. hank sound

    hank sound F1 Veteran

    Jan 31, 2004
    5,786
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Hank Garfield
    Hi - I just bought a 92t Cab. and I can truly say that the back seats had more room than I expected.. A 5' 1" lady friend who likes comfort, rode in the back to check it out and didn't complain once!
    Cheers, Hank
     
  11. Michael B

    Michael B F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Apr 28, 2004
    3,601
    US of A
    Full Name:
    Michael
    This seems to be a great trade offer for you. The Mondial t is a fabulous car, and the cabriolet is a super bonus.

    A couple of notes:

    Lets start off with the Motronic 2.5 of the 1989 vintage. The 2.5 system is absolutely fine. No need to "make sure" that it changed. There are very few (if any) reasons to upgrade. The 2.7 system can be considered more defined, but it is not a necessary update. If it has the update, then great. But the 2.5 system is no reason to pass on a car. That is spoken from experience by the way. I actually prefer the 2.5 system.

    The seats in back of a Mondial t are plenty for occasional passengers. They are most excellent for small adults or children. Additionally, the Mondial t offers shoulder belts for the rear passengers. A safety plus.

    Handling is much improved over any Mondial with the Mondial t. The engine is set very low in the chassis (t only for Mondials), and of course - it goes without saying that the 300 HP is a real kick in comparison to the 3.0 or 3.2 models.

    Reliability does not seem to be much of an issue with the Mondial t. Like any Ferrari, you just need to stay on top of maintenance. These are mostly very reliable 3.4 liter cars.

    If I were to trade for a Mondial, it would most definitely would have to be the Mondial t. I like them all, but the t has so much to offer with very little down side.

    It seems that low mile '89 Mondial t cabs are in the $42,000 - $47,000 retail bracket @ this time. Great car for the money.
     
  12. 308GTS

    308GTS Formula 3

    Dec 27, 2001
    2,220
    TN
    I don't know. There is a difference. Engine out service IMO isn't a plus. Also unless you work on your own car diagnosing a Motronic problem can take some skill. Parts are more for a 348/T (price a dual disc clutch), etc. The point being is that it isn't all fun with the same in the end. Performance up yes but now you have the problems that go with trouble shooting EFI, Direct fire, etc. (if you pay for service) Plus what about the climate control. Has anyone priced or found one of those ECUs recently? Not cheap and that is if you can find one. Anyway, I sold my 348 and kept my 308. Nice car but the interior build quality wasn't the best and I prefer the 308QV over the 348. You have to look at both sides. You can't just say power is up, reliability great, better brakes etc. What comes with that are more expensive services, styling no where close to the 308, climate control issues, IMHO 2.7 is much better than 2.5 (one TPS ) etc. I guess it depends on what you like but you can't say it is a win win completely. There are ups and downs to each different car. Yes the Nippon Denso alternator is a large improvement. I have seen 348s eat the Delco alt. in 3 months. So I don't see how you can say these improvements aren't updates. Personally I am not a huge fan of the grease packed flywheel either. However, I will say I enjoyed my 348 for what it was. It was a very fun car. I just think he needs to be aware of the differences in ownership between these 2 cars. If that is what you are after the trade sounds good.
     
  13. gil308

    gil308 Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2004
    1,957
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Gil
    KEEP THE 308!!!!! If you want to enjoy a ride with your family, get a Chrysler Sebring convertible or something and go to a theme park.

    I think history will prove that the 308 will be more valuable than the Mondial...look that the 250 vs. 250 GTE. The family can enjoy the 308 one at a time. Plus the 308 is styled better.

    Just my opinion ('85 308 GTS owner).
     
  14. AR!

    AR! Formula Junior

    Apr 8, 2004
    974
    Berlin, Germany
    Me. At my local Ferrari dealer. 900 EUR.

    I would prefer a Cabriolet over any GTB or GTS.

    The styling of the 328 is better than that of the Mondial 3.2 or t, but the 3.2's and t's look much better than the 308 with its slightly awkward front bumper.

    And the t looks better than the 3.2 (more curvacious).

    WRONG :)

    Today I took three adults with me in the car for lunch. Not overly comfortable, agreed, but noone was hurt.
     
  15. WILLIAM H

    WILLIAM H Three Time F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
    34,891
    Victory Circle
    Full Name:
    HUBBSTER
    I would agree with that, The 308 is a masterpiece, the Mondial, is not

    At least trade up to a 456, Ive heard those can be bought pretty cheap now & its a lot nicer than a Mondial
     
  16. hank sound

    hank sound F1 Veteran

    Jan 31, 2004
    5,786
    Burbank, CA
    Full Name:
    Hank Garfield
    Hi gang,
    Beauty and what is right is in the eye and mind of the beholder. Not to lecture here but, define your priorities - who will drive - who will ride - who will WATCH. Is this going to be a "Me + family experience", or do I want a racing experience?
    The mag articles will give speed ratings that show an 80- 90s' two seater to be XXXXXXXXX faster than mondial t. Fine - Priorities & dollars - - What matters in the scheme of YOUR life?
    If racing is the deal, buy what it takes. But if you want to treat your family to the sound, speed and fury of Ferrari, buy a Mondial (a Cab.((my choice)), it's like having two cars in one).
    Cheers, Hank
     
  17. 348_Spiderman

    348_Spiderman Formula 3

    Feb 16, 2004
    1,409
    Cumming, GA
    Full Name:
    Mike
    I currently have a '94 348 Spider which is a ton of fun. I've also had the priveledge of driving an '89 Mondialt Cab for a three day weekend. Here is my comparison.

    My wife would have a much easier time driving the Mondial t over the 348 for the following reasons: (Same goes for a 308qv)

    * Power steering. I know, I know, there are two sides to this debate, however, from a family perspective, I would like to know that my wife can take the wheel and not worry about whether or not she'll have trouble making slow speed maneuvers. My wife has driven the 348 exactly once. Complaints? Not about the stiff clutch, it was about why is it so hard to turn at slow speeds?

    *Ingress/egress: The Mondial t was way easier to get in and out of. Now, I'm sure this is more of a 348 to Monidal comparison as opposed to a 308 to Mondial because as memory serves, the door sill on the 308 is not as wide as it is on a 348 so this argument may have no bearing on your specific situaton.

    *Being able to drive with the family. It truely is a blessing to be able to put the car seat in the back seat, and mom, dad, and baby can go for a drive. What happens now is my wife and I very rarely get a chance to go for a drive in the Ferrari together. My 1 year old daughter has actually logged more miles with me in the Ferrari than my wife has. I feel kind of silly if I pack my wife in kid in the SUV and I follow (actually, I usually get ahead, funny how that happens!) in the Spider.

    My advice: Do what is best for you and yours. Is the mondial t as beautiful as a 308qv? In my opinion, no it is not. Is it still fun to drive? Yes. Does it still handle well? Yes Can you pack your family in it and put smiles on everyones face? Yes, you can.

    Good luck with the decision. I would feel honored to own either car.

    Mike
     
  18. Michael B

    Michael B F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Apr 28, 2004
    3,601
    US of A
    Full Name:
    Michael
    Lets keep in mind this gent has an opportunity to trade... Right now... For THIS particular car.

    I would not think that he would need feedback on a 456, or a 3.2 Mondial, or some other choice @ this time. He has a car ready to trade today, and its a Mondial t 3.4 Cab.

    With the trade he has presented, it seems that most agree that it would be a nice move.

    Additionally, why not try another style of Ferrari now & then anyhow? Taste the Mondial t - and if you want to try a 456 after that, or even a 612, then do it. Things like this are what makes life worth living. I cant see how you could go wrong.
     
  19. jimpo1

    jimpo1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jul 30, 2001
    21,914
    Dallas, TX
    Full Name:
    Jim E
    The $$ in this transaction don't add up for me. A really good QV should be in the mid $30k's, and most T's should be over $40k. If the T is any kind of reasonable condition, I'd say it's more than a fair trade.
     
  20. davem

    davem F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 21, 2002
    5,720
    Stepford, Connecticut
    Full Name:
    dave m
    Agree. However before you make the plunge. Have your family sit in the Mondial and see if it fits. I know a lot of people talk about it being ok, its not the case here. Granted my wife and i are both 6' tall. But we cant even fit the infant seat in back with my wife in front. I have an 88 coupe so perhaps it would be slightly diffrent in a T cab?? Im thinking small kids out of car seats ok??
     

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