[VIDEO]: Alonso Hunts down Schumie in the Wet, Hungary GP 2006

Schumacher in his prime frequently had over a second in the clear over his (highly regarded) teammates.

Alas, this is an unwinnable argument so I don't know why I contribute.

 

Like who? Piquet who was past his prime? Perhaps Patrese who was a number two driver most of his career? Irvine wasn't in MS's class and RB was contractually obligated to give way.

PS I know it's unwinnable, I'd rather debate something I'm passionate about with like minded people even if I disagree than be bored at work.

 

About the starts with safety car, some weeks ago a driver (Vettel IIRC) said that nobody trusts the Pirellis in the wet, so maybe it´s not all Charlie´s fault.

 

Wrong again..Prost was ahead, it was a chicane, he had every right to defend his position.

 

Did you actually read the story or watch the link? Prost turned in early. Video showed it and he admitted it at one point. His turn in point was way earlier than the lap before. Case closed.

 

Case closed, your wrong, it was senna's fault. I saw it back then, everyone did, an some of the most respected f.1 journalists of all time like Nigel roebuck agree with me, so, no need for me to change opinion.

 

Some fine examples of senna driving

This will be funny..hummm, let's see....
1-Pushing Prost against the wall in estoril 88
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lf_AwV66ss0

2-taking naninni out at Hungaroring
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGDGxEbhMo0

3-Senna screwing everyones lap to secure pole at Monaco (ups)..Alboreto gave him a lesson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbNLHGJUGTQ

4-taking ou Mansell at Spa after being overtaken
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNG9lNuXyHU

 

Sure, because you opinion is fact. Prost turned in early which the video showed. Case closed.

A quote from Nigel Roebuck about the 89 collision;

"And another reason we should admire Alain Prost is that, not unimportant in my book, his on track conduct Prost was as clean as they come. In an age when on track ethics took a conspicuous dive, Prost resolutely stuck to his principled standards. Yes, it's probable he knew what he was doing in the collision with Senna at Suzuka in 1989, but I for one can forgive him one aberration over a long career."

Doesn't sound like he agrees with you.

 

The fact remains...

They could never prove it was used. There are many examples of MS getting poor starts etc that arent indicative of TC use and Verstappen was nowhere that year. MS was just that good, it is what it is. Again, the only reason there was an FIA inquest is Senna complained about it because he couldn't accept he was getting worked and down 30 points already in the WDC to Schumi.

This is one of the reasons Schumacher was a better driver. Senna was weak mentally, emotional and couldn't handle someone being faster than him. That's why Prost was easily able to rattle him. Schumacher was a machine and did not fall for such games, he was less emotional.

Not really, he catches criticism for some incidents just like Senna but is widely regarded as the best ever. Top 3 at worst. Usually people that make a big deal out of it are butthurt British (lots hated Schumacher after he handed Hill, Williams and McLaren their collective asses for 10+ years) and hardcore Senna fans (mad that someone came along that was superior. He was taking it to Senna far before he ever peaked in his own career - it would have only gotten uglier for Senna from there)

Many examples of Senna pushing others off track or crashing if others did not yield to a pass. I suggest you do some research. Senna is well-known as an extremely dirty driver. Not as dirty as MS, but still dirty so I don't understand your holier than thou stance. Most of the greats have been ruthless.

 

Oops, you just exposed yourself as a MS hater by insinuating that RB was fit to hold Schumacher's jock, team orders or not. Irvine, Barrichello, Verstappen, Herbert, etc. were all hyped drivers before MS crushed them. You're right, they weren't in MS's class. No one was.

 

+1

Won't be long before Verstappen is on the Britons ****list

 

Exactly. All these drivers had great reputations before they where Schumachers teammate and he wiped the floor with them and anyone. The vastly superior Williams in 97? Schumacher was the only one giving them absolute hell.

 

How these gems from MS;

1 Trying a failing to take out JV for the title
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPo7wXjgiDE

2 Taking out Frentzen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ip9dRArIurI

3 MS trying to screw everyones lap to secure pole at Monaco
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWwNU79-tZA

4 MS taking out Hakkinen at Macau in 1990
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhJj-B3VqcU&list=PLXbrFamH0heMVRrA2M91SF_smcdpEv0rb

5 Blocking and almost taking out Brundle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLtBr61hAS8&list=PLXbrFamH0heMVRrA2M91SF_smcdpEv0rb&index=6

 

I think you're right. The Brits are spoiled after 3 straight years of Ham planting his ass in the most dominant F1 car of all time. Prepare for the media to turn against Max quicker than quick once he starts beating Hamilton.

 

No, sorry. I don't hate him, I just don't think he always drove fairly. I mention RB simply because of the many times he was made to move over, even when the title wasn't on the line. Otherwise it would have been a closer fight between them. MS still would have won but the fact still remains. MS never had another WDC as a teammate while Senna had the man widely considered to be the best of that time.

 

Lol, I remember when everyone got all hysterical and dramatic when MS did the same to RB at Hungary 2010 "HE TRIED TO KILL HIM!"

This is known as hard racing, if he wanted Rubens in the wall he would have been in the wall.

 

Many? Please name how many times Rubens was genuinely quicker and moved over please. It rarely, rarely, ever happened. Plus MS handed a race victory to Rubens at Indy 2002.

As for the whole teammate angle, I see your point, but MS did something Senna never had the balls to do. Go to a bad team and build it from the ground up. Senna was a team jumper, had no loyalty and always wanted to go where the fastest car was. Schumacher was the opposite, moved to crap after leaving a top team and worked tirelessly until it was a monster.

Speaks volumes to me.

 

So it was in MS' car for ****s and giggles then? It's funny how a guy who was noted for being not the greatest starter was suddenly flying off the line in 94.He was better than Verstappen but that isn't saying much. As far as MS being better than Senna, again, your opinion. There is no way to really know. The closest year would be 93 when they had the same engine but McLaren had better electronics.

Widely? By whom? Most lists I've seen either have Fangio or Senna as number one. Usually MS is third or fourth depending on who wrote it. Road and Track had him down in 8th. (way too low, I think, BTW)

So wait, first it's Senna was one the dirtiest drivers of all time to he wasn't as dirty as MS? I never said Senna was always clean. I think Senna was hard nose and occasionally dirty while MS took it to an even higher level.

 

I could probably count that on one hand.

If I had 3 fingers.

And I'm still struggling.

 

Huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTU4BsZrXWA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yv413XU_zWY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ore8HpzpDIs

Better is selling him short, he literally destroyed Verstappen. My point is, if there was TC why wasn't Verstappen more competitive if there was TC? Do you think they put it only on Schumi's car just for ****s and giggles? Just doesn't make sense.

Also, TC makes a very distinct noise, especially rudimentary systems back then. Other drivers or teams would have heard it and questioned it, but to my knowledge only Senna ever did.

Schumacher took everything to a higher level. Testing, working out, racing hard, winning and smashing records.

 

Austria 2001 and 2002. A couple others but I'd have to look them up.

Senna was a team jumper? Out of ten years in Formula One he drove for McLaren for six years. That's a team jumper to you? He stayed with McLaren for three years even after Williams had the better better car.

 

Don't forget he also moved over when the situation called for Irvine in Malaysia '99, his first race back after breaking his leg, a race he surely wanted to win. The consummate teammate.

 

McLaren had the best car all but 2 of those years. Once he realized Williams was the new power in '92 he was actively campaigning to go there the next season in 93 but Prost wouldn't have it. So he went in 94 after Prost retired. He had no loyalty and would have never had the guts to build a team from the ground up. These are just facts, like it or not.

 

MS forgot to hit the button?

The rumor is it was only on MS's car. Not totally sure though

Motor Racing: The tarnishing of Benetton: Grand prix's leading team show a united front, but more trauma awaits on the road from the podium to the pits - Richard Williams explains the fall from grace of Formula One's audacious high-flyers | Sport | T

Niki Lauda did as well. Senna was the first to notice, I think.

 

Again, your opinion not facts. It was widely known that he had signed a pre contract with Ferrari. He probably would have ended his career there.

Senna wanted to break Williams contract says Montezemolo > F1 News > Grandprix.com