Even at $30K starting that leaves $60K for a $12K paint job, $14K interior, XWX tires at $3K, Refinish exterior trim $1K and lots left over for suspension and other incidentals. You can do a lot with $60K on a running driving ferrari with a fresh engine and gearbox unless its a 250LM.
So far I have read the initial price of the car as $17,500 then $24,000. There was also talk of refunds. So, there are three possible prices for the car if I am reading it correctly: A. $17,500 B. $24,000 c. $41,500 D. None of the above. I have seen no bill of sale, canceled check, or EFT statement to support the correct answer. -sc
Of the initial $17,500, $5k went to Larry. Kurt paid Larry directly another $24,000 at the end. This is somewhere in the first 3-5 posts I think Post #3 does include an email that states it is a BoS after $17,500 was paid but it also states that only some of that payment went to Larry, with the rest of Larry's money coming out of subsequent installments. But we haven't seem the Real BoS yet, if there is one. Gerrit
Note that A + B = C The initial price was not $29K, nor was it $24K. The Sale Price was $17,500, as it sat with new motor, new front bearings, new shock bushings, and "refinished" (with a brush) wheels with fairly new tires that were already on the car **. The rest was to be for work performed to turn this base into what I wanted, with a total all-in budget of $55K expressed, but without telling Brett initially, I realistically expected it to hit $60K. This is all already covered several times within this thread. ** Def. not $3K in these tires!....and when I just looked at the pre-sale pics and zoomed in to see what model they were, I noticed that the SS strip along the rockers was NOT screwed-in through the face of the strip as they are on the car now. There's that "Done by an Expert..." chant coming on again..... There almost seems to be an effort to muddle this information, but the numbers are what they are, and have remained so for almost two years now for the oldest of them. I expected that a good portion of the $17,500 purchase price went to Larry to solve the presented need for working capital, since that pressing need was the whole reason for both the sale and the price. The Dec 13, 2010 and Dec 20,2010 emails (both already partially quoted in Post #1) are quoted in their entirety in Post #3. I don't have the first transfer order scanned (I'll pull it out and do so if Brett's confirmation of receipt of the $17,500 purchase of Dec 21, 2010, also included in Post #3, isn't enough), but I did scan the $24K order to Larry for his piece of mind, and the BOS between Larry and myself (back-dated to around the time I got Brett's "$24k Surprise") for the shipping company (TFX) and Customs. Sensitive info "sprayed over" in PS: Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
I think that after a certain point, even the Inspector said "Screw it. This thing is obviously going for a restoration anyway."
Hey Kurt . Here's my take regardless of Bret being a friend or not which I can say publicly here that he's a good one at that. While your story started out to be very informative and compelling, truth is you have exposed way more than I suggest you may have wanted. You have shown all reading what kind of whiny complaining unsophisticated brut you really are and it would appear I have just joined the ever growing " who really gives a rats ass about his guy or his car anymore" club. Your actions here show there is more to this story than we may ever know. Gary Espada 8394
Post 103 http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=141771952&postcount=103 mentions that Larry received $5k from the initial $17,500 so that makes it $29k total for the car itself in my math Gerrit
I have to chime in and say this post is pretty weak. Any objective person can see that the OP did not get a great deal here. As such, he has every reason to complain and to do so in the manner he has.
...............to folk(not me 'cos I'm in a different hemisphere)who may be wondering who to send their car to for restoration purposes...
From what I can see, this car more-or-less represents $90K down the toilet. It's therefore a bit harsh to tell the OP that he's an unsophisticated brute -- how well would you (or any of us for that matter) respond to such a loss. I wouldn't necessarily have approached this thread in the same way as the OP, but I sure as hell would be sick to the stomach if that pile of c%^p rolled off the transport onto my driveway and I were in the hole to the tune of $90K.
Wow what a load of garbage. This guy has NINETY THOUSAND dollars invested in this rolling nightmare. NINETY GRAND. if it were me I'd be going nuts and probably going to far greater extremes than Kurt appears to be. As much as I would like to give Brett the benefit of the doubt how in the world do you let this car ship to the customer when even the truck driver marks the sheet with tons of physical damage and "red showing" marks?? I assume photos were taken and assurances made that the car was great, and the owner gladly paid the money and eagerly awaited delivery. We've seen some poor quality work done on Ferraris over the years, and this is certainly not the worst we've seen, but most certainly the most amount paid for the least benefit. Perhaps the car is truly mechanically sound and simply needs some expert cosmetic repair, but that's something we simply don't know.
Given what we've seen in the photos, my guess is that it would EASILY cost north of $20K to make the body good.
No reports yet about the state of quality about the engine rebuild and other mechanical work other than the carburetion/fuel mixture issues which are troubling to hear about. As we all know, an engine rebuild is all about attention to detail, quality control and doing things precisely right. With the obvious cosmetic issues on this work, I would be very concerned about potential issues inside the engine, and that could be VERY expensive to fix.
As a local Brett dare not screw over too badly, if at all, and his close buddy, your credibility and objectivity in this matter are already suspect, if not disingenuous. You may have even seen all of the work going into this disaster in person, as it was being done, and figured that "this should be a fine car when it's done", just as I did based upon the pictures I was sent regularly. You're free to come down and look for yourself, to run your fingers into the cracks, try to shut the door, listen to the mystery clunk when the passenger door is closed, try to read the instruments at night when they've gone on break for a moment, note the abysmal quality of the upholstery work, etc. As I've said: "When you've walked in my shoes......." If you think this represents the great value and properly done car that Brett kept trying to convince me of, YOU buy it for not a penny more than I have in it. According to you, you should be perfectly happy. Those shoes will cost you over $92K.
Hard to say... certainly for what we've seen there appears to be LOTS of filler on the body. Without a doubt you're talking bare metal respray here, and from what I've seen of the interior I think several thousand needs to be spent there to bring the car up to some reasonable level of quality. Would love to see some detail of the mechanicals- suspension work, overall condition of the engine compartment etc.
Presuming that the engine was done to anywhere near the same standard as the rest of the car, and the way the too-short brake lines with the wrong ends were handled, there's a reason I'm scared to run the engine near redline so far. It may actually be sound, but the doubt is almost overwhelming.
Many years ago I had a vintage race engine (BMC "A" 948 cc) rebuilt by a guy who had a great reputation with little British car engines. It started up and ran fine until I got it onto the race track and then it would slowly lose oil pressure and I would shut it down before the engine blew itself up. The shop and the engine guy were very apologetic and promised to fix it but they never could despite three attempts. It took me very expensive trips to race tracks for events at New Hampshire International Speedway, Lime Rock and Mt. Tremblant with the same results every weekend, a retirement during the first day practice sessions before I took it to another guy who offered to tear it down and report on the problem for free, he felt so bad about what was happening to me. What he found inside the engine was horrifying. The main problem was that the "expert" had ground the crankshaft journals too much and the overheating was what was leading to the loss of oil pressure. Lots of other problems inside the engine including sloppy gasket sealant inside the valve train, just an absolute mess. We basically had to throw away the engine and start over again. I never recovered the money I had wasted with the "expert" and there are still guys out there who use him for all their engine work. To me it would be like playing Russian Roulette with 5 bullets in the gun.
James was trying to get to the bottom of the Italian Duck Massacre, and as part of the diagnosis, checked the timing. The carb cars have two 6-pointers at the backs of the the heads rather than the injected cars' single 12 cap. Maybe it was "Custom Tuning".
You know, Dave and a couple of others have bypassed the center muffler sections with straight pipes & just used rear silencers (something I want to do). I know this wouldn't fall under a 'new, factory correct' car but it should get more of the clearance you're looking for. Good deal!
Maybe that picture is an optical illusion but the brake pedal typically is closer to the accel. pedal for that heel-toe action Do you think lunch time vino's had anything to do with it? Or Fix It Again Tony? If that's the case guys, don't attempt to perform any maintenance I like the label on that center bottle Dave! More good information!! & that's got to effect your actions/reactions in some way, shape, or form
