Front page story in major Italian Newspapers today: The Affidavit signed by Mike Coughlan has been provided to the FIA by Ferrari. The Affidavit contains the following: (1) Coughlan statement of admission " it is my responsability " of possessing the Ferrari documents (2) " I showed those documents not only to Jonathan Neale but also to others" and he further states that "almost no one wanted to see them and everyone advised him to destroy them". (3) The documents were acquired through the "Pony System" which means date and time are traceable. The affidavit does not mention Nigel Stepney. Analysis by the italian news: - in statement (1) Couglan tries to mitigate McLaren responsability by assuming all the responsability (trying to protect McLaren) but then in a later page he points the finger with statement (2); - The convocation of McLaren on July 26 by Max Mosley is considered an incriminating act and Max Mosley never expose his head in the water. Article 3.1 states it is the responsability of the team that each member abides by the rules and regulations of the FIA, therefore McLaren will be sanctioned in one form or the other (from a fine to point deductions, to improbable exclusion). - Did Ron Dennis know? The italian press thinks not. Although he is a difficult man to deal with he is a honest person and would not jeopardize the team 's great performance this year. It is interesting to note that Merceds-Benz who is a 40% owner has been completely silent on the subject. - Once the Fia makes its decision, Ferrari will not proceed legally against McLaren in Italy or in England and the matter will drop. That is not the case with Stepney who may be facing 4 years of jailtime in the italian court system. - Ferrari is still investigating whether Stepney had other accomplices.
...if any of this is found true, I mean, no matter what happens...they broke the sporting code, since "Article 3.1 states it is the responsability of the team that each member abides by the rules and regulations of the FIA"... and the real hard punishment (race ban, DQ, or exclussion) are only applicable when called upon the counsil to answer for charges...all others (reprimands and fines) are only unilaterally impossed... ...this is getting really murky for McLaren...
i dont see why they wouldnt be. if everything stated is correct then members of both teams have acted illegally (and in a fashion to bring the sport into disrepute)
This is the most interesting : *almost no one wanted to see them and everyone advised him to destroy them* Who is this Almost no one ?
AHA! I thought all parties (including Stepney) are completely innocent until proven guilty? (Or I guess until they file a contradictory affadavit -)
There's a good open-minded response. I guess Mclaren should be thrown out of the championship at this time as well - "Innocent until proven guilty" is, after all, such an outdated concept around here. In all seriousness, and I certainly haven't seen Coughlans affidavit, the thing that jumped out at me was that he DID NOT name Stepney according to the report above. I *thought* that was the main point of his affidavit - "Naming names" as it were.... Does anyone know if an affidavit is/at some point becomes a public document? Cheers, Ian
I am sure that SF makes their employees sign confidentiality agreements. How is SF responsible for having dishonest employees violate their contracts? That's like saying the bank is responsible because it has money around and employees embezzle it. Your argument makes no sense to me. Sorry.
The FIA goes into action in the Ferrari-Coughlan Affair http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns19401.html McLaren, has "...been asked to answer "a charge" that the team breached Article 151c of the International Sporting Code between March and July by having unauthorised possession of documents and confidential information belonging to Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro. The FIA statement said that this included information that could be used "to design, engineer, build, check, test, develop and/or run a 2007 Ferrari Formula 1 car. Article 151c of the International Sporting Code states that competitor can be punished for "any fraudulent conduct or any act prejudicial to the interests of any competition or to the interests of motor sport generally". ...Much has been made of the details of when Coughlan received the data and whether/when he showed it to anyone else at McLaren. If other team members did see the data and did not report it to either the police or Ferrari (within a suitable timeframe) then they are in the same boat as Coughlan and McLaren must answer for this. Article 3.1 of the Formula 1 Sporting Regulations states that "it is the competitor's responsibility to ensure that all persons concerned by his entry observe all the requirements of the Agreement, the Code, the Technical Regulations and the Sporting Regulations". >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
well Ferrari sacked Stepney immediately when this was discovered, McL just told him to get rid of it and did NOTHING until it came out in the wash. It all came out due to the copy incident according to reports so what could Ferrari do until they knew something ? McL KNEW about it but kept shtum, but I don't expect some people to see the difference
These are not facts, these are allegations made by Coughlan in his affadavit. McLaren insists that neither are true. Do you have specific evidence that McLaren is lying or are you continuing to jump to conclusions no matter what the facts are? I, and most everyone else here, are waiting for supporting evidence before we start calling for Ron Dennis' head.
you have a comprehension problem as well as a credibility problem I suggest you take up some reading lessons, where have I said in my last post that RD head is needed ??!! WHAT HAPPENED TO PUTTING ME ON IGNORE !!???
BTW if this went to a poll you'd see the odds are against you, keep the aluminium hat on tight, the ride gets rough from here on for the McL apologists
sorry but my arguement makes perfect sense its yours that is somewhat lacking. think about it - "the sporting code, since "Article 3.1 states it is the responsability of the team that each member abides by the rules and regulations of the FIA"..." this means that teams are responsible for their staff so if McLaren is responsible for its employees behaviour then so is Ferrari responsible for its own employees. if coughlin received the information and is guilty of something because he didnt destroy it or return that info to ferrari, and because of that McLaren is also guilty due to responsibility for his actions. Then it goes without saying that Scuderia Ferrari are just as guilty for the actions of their man stepney, who it seems is guilty of passing the info on - and both should suffer the same penalties. for example back in the real world :- some goods get stolen and sold/passed on the person who (knowingly) buys/is given those goods will get charged with receiving stolen goods - in our case this is coughlin and his employer McLaren just as the thief will get charged with theft - in our case thats stepney and his employer SF do you get it now phil ?
Who is a McLaren apologist??? All I, and everyone else here, have said is that we do not know the facts...and neither do you. We are not jumping to conclusions based on personal animosity, you however are. I will wait until the facts are known, some here apparently do not need facts before they are ready to reach a conclusion.
The only credibility problem lies with those who insist that allegations are facts and jump to conclusions on that basis. The FACT is that you do not know what the truth is but you are making declarations about McLaren's culpability nevertheless. None of us are making any statements of fact regarding McLaren's culpability, we are waiting for the evidence before we leap to conclusions. You on the other hand already have your mind made up, so you needn't be bothered by such inconveniences as facts or evidence
That is exactly how it was stated on the press release, which can be interpreted as "let me look at them but Mike destroy them after ".
the point is this the sporting code, since "Article 3.1 states it is the responsability of the team that each member abides by the rules and regulations of the FIA"... so its not about wronging another team, its about following/breaking the rules. so in fact Senna3xWC's comment had more validity and value than yours did.
Article 151c of the International Sporting Code states that competitor can be punished for "any fraudulent conduct or any act prejudicial to the interests of any competition or to the interests of motor sport generally". Would sabotaging your own cars constitute an action prejudicial to the interests of competition?
