QV steering behavior | FerrariChat

QV steering behavior

Discussion in '308/328' started by Alex Rogo, May 5, 2018.

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  1. Alex Rogo

    Alex Rogo Formula Junior

    Jan 2, 2004
    273
    California
    Steering response is "heat dependent". If I drive short distances steering is relatively consistent, although with a tendency to wander over expansion strips on the roadway, etc. But on longer drives (over an hour, more than 100 mi.) the steering becomes somewhat erratic. I have difficulty keeping the car in a straight line as it is constantly pulling left then right. And when turning I hear what I can best describe as a "groaning" sound which seems to be coming from the upper part of the steering column under the dash. Is there some type of bearing or bushing that needs replacement? It seems to be related to heat as well but since the car does not have power steering it's not that. Tires are OEM type Pirellis in standard sizes for '85 QV but they are old (hard). Anyone experience similar conditions? And what solutions have you tried?

    Thanks
     
  2. Alex308qv

    Alex308qv Formula Junior

    Jul 1, 2016
    379
    PA
    Full Name:
    Alex
    Sounds like wear in the system in one or more places like the rack & pinion, tie rods, or column U-joints. Worn column U-joints are easy to diagnose as they are plainly visible under the dash. If nothing obvious there, put the front on jack stands, get a partner to hold the steering wheel, then grab each wheel and move it left and right and you should be able to locate the "play." It's a simple system. I assume the wandering aspect is not caused by wheel alignment. No clue about the heat aspect!

    While off the ground, also good to check strut, ball-joint, and sway bar link wear. Routine methods for these.
     
    Alex Rogo and 308 milano like this.
  3. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 7, 2012
    3,322
    Tallahassee, FL
    Alex (OP) - if I didn't know better, I'd think you were somehow borrowing my car without my knowledge. I'm currently chasing exactly this issue. Every sentence you typed is identical to the behavior on my QV. Even the mysterious "seems heat related" part.

    Let me take a guess: The steering groan is at it's WORST when you make that final slow-speed turn into the driveway/garage? The "wandering" is really noticeable around 30-50mph on a straight road? (At 70mph freeway speeds, I don't notice it much.)

    I can tell you what I've done so far:

    - I've greased (zerk fittings) the U-joints under the dash (no change)
    - My steering rack was rebuilt about 2K miles ago, before I bought the car. Hopefully rebuilt correctly, but I've no idea yet. This problem started about 700 miles ago.
    - Inspected the tires. They are around 7-8 years old, and worn enough (but still safe & usable) that I'm planning to replace within the next 6-12 months. They show no abnormal wear.
    - Briefly inspected ball joints. They aren't showing obvious problems like cracked rubber, but I plan a more thorough inspection as some of these symptoms are classic ball joint problems.
    - Bushings look a bit worn, but I've seen far worse on other cars.
    - Replaced the all the front wheel bearings 2 days ago. I found the right-side retention washer tab to be broken off. The previous mechanic should have replaced this $5 washer instead of reusing a broken one. So far I've seen a slight improvement, but I don't believe the problem is gone (haven't driven it enough).
    - I plan to do an alignment on the car in the next week or two. I'll let you know if there's any change as a result.

    I'll be interested in what you find out on your car as well... best of luck. :)
     
  4. maurice70

    maurice70 F1 Rookie

    Jan 25, 2004
    4,319
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    maurice T
    I would start with replacing the tyres..
     
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  5. 308 milano

    308 milano F1 Veteran

    Jan 15, 2007
    5,257
    Montana
    Full Name:
    Kim
    Different tire sizes/offsets front to back will cause this wandering issue. Had an older Corvette years ago that I had deviated a slight bit from what the manufacturer called for in tire size/offset. Damn thing would wander all over the road depending on surface. Finally went to the same size tire all the way around and issue vanished.
     
    thorn likes this.
  6. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    12,314
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jimmie
    As post 4: is it possible you are looking for the complicated solution when the simple one is to replace old tires ?
     
  7. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 7, 2012
    3,322
    Tallahassee, FL
    The potential for tire issues makes sense to me in terms of wandering, and possibly heat related. However, I don't hear the groaning after the 15-20 minutes it takes to heat the tires... It takes about an hour of driving for that noise to present itself.

    Would an older tire account for the groaning noise that I hear turning the steering wheel sharply at very low speeds?

    (I'm more than willing to spend six or seven hundred dollars on new tires if this would solve the problem - and the tires are indeed nearing EOL, I just don't want to throw parts at it.)
     
    Alex Rogo likes this.
  8. 308 milano

    308 milano F1 Veteran

    Jan 15, 2007
    5,257
    Montana
    Full Name:
    Kim
    Could the groaning Be from the front shocks as the vehicle Sideload changes while making a slow turn? Old rubber seals on the shocks?

    Guess simple test would be to spray a mist of deep creep or other penetrant up into the shock and see if the noise goes away?
     
  9. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 4, 2001
    35,350
    Birmingham, AL
    Full Name:
    Tommy
    Make sure the correct tires are on the correct wheels.

    I had a shop mount tires for me and didn't realize they were different sizes - don't laugh, it happens.
     
  10. Alex Rogo

    Alex Rogo Formula Junior

    Jan 2, 2004
    273
    California
    Symptoms are exactly the same, as is the condition of the various components. I had a rebuilt rack installed about 3k miles ago, tires are about the same age but still lots of rubber and no visible uneven wear patterns. Bushings are also a bit worn. I suspect, as noted in another post, that some type of bushing in column is to blame, but I can't determine what. My mechanic (ex Ferrari dealer service) attempted to adjust the rack end play and it made the steering lighter but did not resolve the issue. I might have another mechanic take a look. I probably need an alignment as well and will see if that helps. Thanks for your comments and let's hope we find some solutions. I will keep you posted of any outcomes.

    Cheers
     
    thorn likes this.

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