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Daytona Values

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by 328KNB, Mar 8, 2005.

  1. 328KNB

    328KNB Karting

    Jun 14, 2004
    59
    Hi All

    What is the current state of the Daytona market and where is it going? I have a potential deal on a plexi which is currently undergoing ground-up restoration. I would very much appreciate informed views on what one should expect to pay. Thanks.

    Ken
     
  2. Ken

    Ken F1 World Champ

    Oct 19, 2001
    16,078
    Arlington Heights IL
    Full Name:
    Kenneth
    A true frame off example would likely have an ask of $125k or more. I'd be very careful about laying down that kind of cash if I didn't have my homework done and an outside Daytona expert to look over the car.

    Ken
     
  3. shaughnessy

    shaughnessy Formula 3
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    Apr 1, 2004
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    Wolfeboro NH
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    Thomas E Shaughnessy

    Which world are you in???? This is 2005 not 02 or 03
    A running driving car is 125,000 and I know (and was involved) of 2 low mileage US coupes that have traded hand, well north of 200,000

    Tom Shaughnessy

    Everyone is entitled to an opinion , I have comps!
     
  4. cmparrenzo

    cmparrenzo F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 3, 2002
    2,685
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    Chris Parr
    WOW! I wish!

    I just lost out on a 15,000 mile 2 owner Daytona coupe, books, records everything correct at $165,000....

    I thought I had it "bought" but I guess a handshake is not worth much these days..


    I running car is $125,000, but it will need alot, Tom is right, a PERFECT Daytona can fetch over $200,000 these days!
     
  5. 328KNB

    328KNB Karting

    Jun 14, 2004
    59
    Thanks for the responses. So that would mean that an SA price of R1.6m (around $265k) would be a tad high in the US? What is the situation in the UK and EU? Are the values comparable? By the way the folks doing the car down here do a world-class job.....the car would be able to stand any scrutiny when complete. Thanks
     
  6. Tspringer

    Tspringer F1 Veteran

    Apr 11, 2002
    6,155
    #6 Tspringer, Mar 8, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I am very glad I bought mine when I did. I paid $125K in 5/02. I am the third owner and when I bought it mine was a very nice driver, great paint, decent but mostly original interior and fantastic mechanicals. I ended up dropping a good bit of $$$ having the interior totally redone and I have done some serious detailing and other niggling stuff. I still have an ongoing list including currently replacing the incorrect rubber door seals with the correct items so the doors will have perfect shut lines.

    When I bought mine, there seemed to always be something like 10 - 15 cars on the market through the usual sources. FML always had at least 6-10 listed. Now the market seems to only have something more like 4-6 cars available at any given time. I remember reading in SCM a Sheehan article about how dealers seemed to agree that the Daytona market was good for about 10 real sales per month across the US and he didnt think prices would increase until the average number of cars on the market declined to under 10. Seems he was pretty much right on target!

    I see prices continuing the up trend, but mostly for really top condition cars. I am sure the asking prices on the rougher cars will go up as well, but the issue there is they usually stay for sale forever or until the owner decides to stop trying to sell. Paying $115K for a real dog that needs everything is just tough to justify when a perfect car can be had for $200K. Unless you just love restoring the car yourself and you view it as a hobby costs, it just doesnt make sense to buy the dog.

    Last summer I had a Canadian guy who called me because he really wanted an early plexi nosed car and he has seen photos online of mine. He was apparently willing to pay a high price, something north of $165K at the time (though discussions never went as far as a firm selling price) which I thought was more than the car was worth on the market at the time. I was briefly tempted, but the problem is if I sold it...... then I wouldnt have it!

    Getting a car to the point of being in truely top mechanical and cosmetic condition takes TONS of ongoing effort. I agree with Tom S. when he has said in the past that ALL vintage Ferraris have some need no matter how low the miles or how fresh the ground up total restoration. So, when you do get to the point of really knowing your car from bottom up and you have it "right" its very difficult to contemplate selling it because so much time, effort and money will have gone into getting to that point. This is why truely nice top condition cars just dont come on the open market very often.

    Posted some pics of mine purely due to vanity..... an excuse to look at it!




    Terry

    PS: yes, the stickers missing in the engine bay are on the way to me and I do have slip on air filters that go over the brass screens whenever I am driving it. I do drive it..... on the street and track as BigTex can attest!
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  7. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    Sep 30, 2003
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    Terry your Daytona is STUNNING keep it forever! :)
     
  8. xs10shl

    xs10shl Formula 3

    Dec 17, 2003
    2,017
    San Francisco
    So is the Daytona train finally leaving the station, after 15 years? Will we start to see Daytonas regularly trade in the Mercedes SL300 range? (Apples to oranges, I know. I was going more after the production #'s, and the "Iconic Car" similarities).
     
  9. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Consultant

    Jan 20, 2004
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    Loveliest Daytona I have ever laid eyes on.
     
  10. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Apr 28, 2003
    43,138
    Texas!
    Damn! Der are dos bloody eggs again! Aren't they hard boiled yet? :)
     
  11. Ken

    Ken F1 World Champ

    Oct 19, 2001
    16,078
    Arlington Heights IL
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    Kenneth
    Well, I can see Daytonas are really taking off! Sorry I've been cave bound for a bit...I'm surprised $125k will no longer get a good, restored example. Does this mean my TC Europa is worth $$$? LOL

    Ken
     
  12. Tspringer

    Tspringer F1 Veteran

    Apr 11, 2002
    6,155

    I knew you were going to say that.

    Just cant let the golden eggs lay, can you?


    Terry
     
  13. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    43,138
    Texas!
  14. JTranfield

    JTranfield Formula Junior

    Dec 29, 2003
    665
    NYC, London
    Full Name:
    J Tranfield
    Terry I was just over in London and saw 2 US registered Daytonas at a dealer that had just been imported. If this is happening due to the falling dollar then I see the prices in the US increasing further.
    By the way you car looks much better than last time I saw it, interior is fantastic, what polish are you using?
     
  15. geltman

    geltman Rookie

    Aug 8, 2004
    21
    Boy, am I glad to see these comments.
    I bought a particularly nice '73 Daytona last September (#16519) and thought I was paying through the nose for a very complete and original 15,000 Km car with Boranni's at $140,000. The pre-purchase inspection revealed that I would need to spend maybe another $10,000 to fix some small rust behind the rear wheels, (hidden underside) and a few minor leaks, moldings etc. That money was spent wisely (gratified my estimate was on the money), so I now have a superb, low milage example that only needs an engine detail. I can drive to local club events with pride and not feel foolish for paying up for the right car. Can you ever pay too much for the right vintage Ferrari? The market on Daytona's has been on the move for at least 18 months. The price guides are not yet up to date. I challenge anyone to buy a decent 275 GTB for what the books say should cost around $225,000 to $275,000. If Sheehan and I are right, Daytona's will routinely trade over $200,000 by next year and really nice ones will be north of $250,000. I wish I had bought a Lusso at $150,000 a couple of years ago. Now well over $250,000. Etc.Etc.
     
  16. Tspringer

    Tspringer F1 Veteran

    Apr 11, 2002
    6,155

    Good to see you here!

    I have heard that a fair number of US Daytonas have been getting exported and I am sure the low dollar is helping to fuel this. Still, much of it is also that European vintage tours and rallies are getting more popular and many allow cars up to 1973 with the Daytona being a popular mount that will get an entrance to the events with limited spots.

    I have been using Griots garage clay and polish and they Swissol scuderia wax. The Swissol stuff is expensive but really does give the best deep shine of any wax I have ever tried.

    PM me if your still thinking of selling the 308 or if you want a Boxster in trade!


    Terry
     
  17. ralfabco

    ralfabco Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Mar 1, 2002
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    Israel Beiteinu
    Terry nice looking wheels. Beautiful car.


    One of the club members in Houston, just picked up a very nice low mile red/tan car.
     
  18. JTranfield

    JTranfield Formula Junior

    Dec 29, 2003
    665
    NYC, London
    Full Name:
    J Tranfield
    I am now staying in Atlanta for another 2 years so am definitley keeping the 308, will try to be on the run in a couple of weeks. It is running great and am presently doing the rear susp bushings then its off to Bos for a tiny bit of paint.
    As a matter of fact I was thinking of getting a Dino as I feel if I don't soon they will also become unaffordable. Hoping to find a blue one to match the 308..................unless an affordable 330GTC comes up (fat chance).
     
  19. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    Great looking car Terry. where did you hear about that Swissol stuff? Is it really worth the money? LOL :)
     
  20. Tspringer

    Tspringer F1 Veteran

    Apr 11, 2002
    6,155

    Dang. Come on Jonathan, dont you fancy a gorgeous arctic silver Porsche Boxster S loaded up with full leather, premium sound, sport design II wheels and all the nifty power options you could ever dream of?????

    I'll make you a VERY fair trade deal! I want my 308 back! You wife could drive the Boxster as well and you could justify the Dino....



    Frank: credit is due no doubt.... the Swissol tip was a good one. It is a very high quality product! Of course the trick orbital buffer and all the polishing stuff I got from Griots has worked like a charm as well. For 20 year old paint, my car looks DAMN good if I dont say so myself! I give that credit to Bo Pirkle. He is slow and he is expensive, but the work he does is RIGHT and it really does last.


    Terry
     
  21. 328KNB

    328KNB Karting

    Jun 14, 2004
    59
    Hi All

    Thanks very much for the views - seems like the asking price down here, while on the high side, is not too out of line. Will keep you all posted.

    Cheers

    Ken
     
  22. synchro

    synchro F1 Veteran

    Feb 14, 2005
    9,096
    CHNDLR
    Full Name:
    Scott
    I lived in the Atlanta area from 1995-1997 and bought a spare set of Campy's for my Dino from Shaughnessy. Bo Pirkle painted them so you are going to the Best! H e knows colors
    He is a crazy guy and wasn't using an air system for painting - just breathing it in the paint booth.
     
  23. mikegt

    mikegt Karting

    Apr 4, 2004
    72
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Mike Gilfillan
    Tom, if you've been involved at these prices, then what do you make of this recent ad in FML for $140,000?

    FML 3/11/05:
    "365 GTB/4, S/N 15303 (1972 USA prod.). Gorgeous red with black leather. Bare metal and interior restorations. Rebuilt transmission and suspension. Detailed engine and undercarriage. Five 8" Borranis and five perfect Campagnolo mags. Tool roll. Many concours awards over last 27 years of my ownership. No expense spared, accident-free maintenance history. Excellent references to support current superior mechanical and physical condition. 24,349 miles. $140,000. 3/05"

    I'm currently doing a complete restoration of a Daytona conversion (13341) and would like to see a solid increase in price as much as the next guy, but what else would the Daytona in the ad above need in order to command "well north of $200,000"??

    Did the cars get bought by foreigners taking advantage of the exchange rate? What's your commission to bring a buyer with that kind of money to the table?

    Regards,

    Mike G.
    Atlanta, GA
     
  24. El Wayne

    El Wayne Global Moderator
    Global Moderator Owner

    Aug 1, 2002
    17,966
    San Marino, CA
    Full Name:
    L. Wayne Ausbrooks
    To save Tom the hassle of asking: No, I've never bought or sold one of these cars and, yes, you have WAY more experience in this field as I do. That said, here are some thoughts from an amateur:

    I've spent some time following price trends and I feel that (at this point in time) for a standard Daytona coupe to pull down $200K+ in the US, it would have to have recently underwent a 6-figure restoration to Pebble Beach standards (though, as far as I know, a standard Daytona coupe had never been invited to Pebble Beach).

    $125K will get you something edgy but driveable.

    $140K-$160K should land something decent.

    $175K and we're talking VERY nice.

    $200K+ in the US? It would have to be absolutely stunning.

    But, read this thread again in 6 months and my numbers will be low. After a year, even more so, meaning:

    Even if someone paid a little on the high side today for the right car (not easy to find), there shouldn't be any regrets later on. The market's moving and $200K "nice" Daytonas aren't far off. Will they go the way of the Lusso (into the $300K statosphere) anytime soon? I don't think so, but they're moving steadily along with the rest of the "vintage" market.

    For what it's worth, here are a few examples of Daytona coupes offered for sale in the US recently:

    13289, asking price $129,500

    14093, asking price $134,000

    16447, asking price $137,500
     
  25. toto70_0

    toto70_0 F1 Rookie

    Sep 14, 2004
    3,722
    NETHERLANDS
    #13829 IS JUST SOLD BACK TO EUROPE.
    IF THERE ARE ANY MORE EURO VERSION DAYTONA'S, PLEASE SEND ME A PM.

    YOURS,
    TOTO70_0
     

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