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Any Ferrari techs on here? Tech to tech help needed.

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by ChrisKing, Mar 6, 2020.

  1. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK
    As above - I've an issue with a LaFerrari that is proving to be very frustrating. It's a long shot, but I'm hoping there is a Ferrari tech on here that can help a small independent out. Thanks in advance!
     
  2. RedNeck

    RedNeck F1 Rookie
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    Jul 8, 2016
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    Matt
    Yes, there are several on here. May want to give an indication to what problem you are having.
     
  3. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK

    Thanks, that's good to know.

    We had a LaFerrari bought to us with a dead 12v starter battery. This has now been replaced. We have the 12v battery warning light illuminated in the warning lamp display above the AC controls (an alternator light on an older vehicle). The vehicle also has no PAS at idle, but cuts in once vehicle is moving.

    We have Leonardo with LaFerrari software, and have no fault codes in any system.

    I've accessed the workshop manual, and have carried out the calibration of the Stop/Start sensor by means of charging the vehicle until the charger shows a full charge.

    The vehicle is charging at 13.7V, as shown on the dash display, and multimeter.

    I've checked the wiring for the battery sensor circuit.

    The battery fitted was a Mercedes part. Its made by A123 Systems, and aside from a Mercedes badge is physically, and rating wise the same battery. This is also used by McLaren in a lower amperage. I has these faults with the old battery when I got charge into it, but it won't hold a charge. I've also seen people use Braille batteries with no issues so i'm happy the battery is ok.

    I've spoken with our closest main dealer, who said they'd experienced my issues, but became vague when I asked what the fix was. They also said the steering system was HV, so I don't have much faith in them.

    Any advice would be brilliant, no matter how small.
     
  4. RedNeck

    RedNeck F1 Rookie
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    Jul 8, 2016
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    Matt
    @MerlinTech
    @tbakowsky
    @Rifledriver
    @voicey
    One of these folks may have seen the issue
     
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  5. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    26,949
    Austin TX
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    Brian Crall
    I do not work on those nor will I ever.

    One of the advantages of becoming self employed is I work on cars I like and that car is not on the list but thanks for thinking of me.
     
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  6. NoSpeedLimit

    NoSpeedLimit Karting

    Sep 6, 2013
    184
    I am not a tech, but as far as I know the charging voltage at! the battery should be between 13.8 and 14.4V (lead).
    13.7V seems to be a little too low.
     
  7. MerlinTech

    MerlinTech Formula Junior
    Sponsor

    Mar 5, 2010
    498
    Georgia
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    Wade Williams
    I am not one to work on that vehicle. Sorry I can't offer any assistance.
     
  8. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    10,717
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    Jimmie
    No disrespect to you but why on earth would an owner give something as sophisticated and valuable as a LaF to you
    - are there any independents anywhere who can fully look after these in a way that might not compromise either value or operation ?
     
  9. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    Brian Crall
    I have no doubt there are. And yes, actually it was quite disrespectful and shows a great deal of ignorance on your part. Ignorant of what motivates people to work in or operate an independant and assumes a great deal. There are many in and running independants who are far more capable than their counterparts in dealers.
     
  10. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    10,717
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    Jimmie
    Brian ( if I may) I appreciate your taking the time to reply and my intention in no way is to query the use of independents generally (that discussion was last month as I recall) for almost every tipo - it is specifically relating to LaF and more from an owners point of view - hybrid technology is legendarily challenging to maintain for low use vehicles and must therefore present abnormal challenges for maintenance outside the main dealer network (where I suspect even with all the kit & training many are not truly competent on LaF)
     
  11. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    26,949
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    Brian Crall
    #11 Rifledriver, Mar 9, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2020
    The cars are 7 years old. I have every confidence there are independents who have people very qualified and equipped to repair them at this point just as there is for every other model ever made. I know a number of guys in or own independents with electrical engineering degrees with impressive backgrounds who can probably bring some very good insights to the issues involved. Insights that seem to be lacking in Maranello. So yes, considering the history if I owned one I can think of several people outside of the dealership environment I would be seeking out.
    I have chosen not to because I don't like the cars but the same cannot be said for others.
     
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  12. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK
    Brian - thanks for the vote of confidence! I've no doubt I'm more than capable of fixing it. We can't know every issue with every Ferrari made, and I'm hoping there is a small golden nugget of information I'm missing.

    Jimmie - I feel that's quite a blinkered view of independent specialists. We've an excellent reputation here in the UK for working on low volume vehicles like the LaFerrari. We're one of 2-3 here that work on McLaren outside of the network, and the same for EB110. I am HV trained, so am aware of how the system works. We've just spent over 4000 Euros on the LaFerrari software - quite a commitment. We repair FF PTU's, again something that I believe we are the only UK specialist to do.

    We've just spent a further 300 euros for a days access to Ferrari Technical Access, which sadly isn't as comprehensive as you'd imagine. If Ferrari haven't seen the issue, then there is no guided diagnosis for a given fault. This is why I asked on here - there might be one tech out of many hundreds that has seen the issue I have, and can give advice. Sadly most Ferrari techs hold their cards close to their chest, frustrating as I'll talk to the world and his wife in trying to help someone resolve an issue. Sorry to sound blunt.
     
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  13. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    26,949
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    Brian Crall




    Indeed


    Intentionally so. They used to brag about it at meetings how they were going to screw everyone else and yet comply with law.


    You don't
     
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  14. JL350

    JL350 Karting

    Jan 20, 2013
    92
    Is there some sort of reset to tell the system it has a new battery like BMW have? The BMW system uses some sort of ageing function and when the battery gets replaced if it is not reset to full capacity the charging etc of the battery uses the aged value of 75% (?) or something and doesn’t adapt to the new battery, so the faults keep coming up. Just a thought...
     
  15. Jaguar36

    Jaguar36 Formula Junior

    Nov 8, 2010
    368
    Cherry Hill, NJ
    Chris,
    Not to derail the thread, but it would be awesome if you could share your thoughts over in the FF PTU thread on what the issue is, and how much it costs to repair. There is a ton of conflicting information mostly obtained from third hand sources and it would be great to have some first hand information from a knowledgeable individual.
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    26,949
    Austin TX
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    Brian Crall
    Costs of repair in the UK have little relation to the costs for repair in the US.

    I don't know about Chris but I will never talk about my prices in this dump. Half of the people start screaming and calling me a crook, why would I want to do that?
     
  17. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    Aug 25, 2004
    3,665
    Dallas Texas
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    Steve F
    I've been out of the office for the past 2 weeks, I am sorry that I have not been able to reply to our previous PM thread.
    with your permission, I can copy and paste it here for ongoing group discussion?

    While I have heard rumor of using aftermarket and other non-OEM replacement battery options, I cannot personally say that we have been able to make it work.
    My first hand experience with the Mercedes Battery and another from Braille is that while they physically fit , and the car will power up ( run ) there were multiple malfunction messages and errors that occur. All of which do not occur when an OEM battery was ultimately installed.

    What you may be able to do, as have others that have used aftermarket battery options, is a way to "work around" the LIN connector on the Ferrari battery.
    As with the blanket statement that Ferrari Dealerships keep information close to the vest, I have found this to be the same from a few independents and online
    service providers, who do find the work around and do not openly post their solutions. This battery replacement being a perfect example.
    I am hoping as you work through it, that when the solution is found, that it will be posted in this thread.

    As stated in our previous discussions, to go much further in actual diagnosis, we would want the car in house ... which is obviously not an option.
    I am happy to help from a distance , as best as possible, as I want to help all Ferrari owners regardless of where they choose to have their Ferrari worked on.
    Getting it right is most important , so that no owner is on the side of the road , or left standing around when they could be out enjoying their Ferrari!

    Happy to help.

    Steve
     
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  18. 335s

    335s Formula Junior

    Jan 17, 2007
    839
    SF Bay Area
    Full Name:
    T. Monma
    I will look at the car's file this week, later-time permitting....
    If I am correct, this sounds somewhaT VAGUELY FAMILIAR TO A SIMILAR AILMENT EXPERIENCED A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO IN "BLACK BEAUTY"....BUT AM NOT 100% CERTAIN...(DAMNED STICKING BUTTONS-SORRY, CANT RELEASE CAPS, FOLKS...)
     
  19. 335s

    335s Formula Junior

    Jan 17, 2007
    839
    SF Bay Area
    Full Name:
    T. Monma
    this is going to take much longer than expected-no access for at least two more weeks....
     
  20. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK
    I shall do.
     
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  21. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK
    Hi, that would be great! We are still operating in the UK, albeit with limited staff, no customer contact and no sales staff so I've not been able to get back onto the Laf.
     
  22. ChrisKing

    ChrisKing Rookie

    Dec 29, 2016
    46
    UK
    Hi Steve, apologies for not replying sooner - been working still but on more pressing jobs and with limited staff.

    Do you work for a main agent, or use the most current Ferrari SD machine? I'm unsure if our Leonardo is missing something in its software - perhaps an option to tell the car it has a new battery?

    I agree with you that something could be missing on an aftermarket battery, but I still get this fault even with the car running on the OE battery. Sadly this battery is beyond help, and wont hold a charge. This is the only issue I get with the car, no fault codes are stored.

    Thanks for the reply, stay safe.
     

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