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488 [Advice Requested] About to pull the trigger on my first Ferrari

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by 8th_Sin, Apr 6, 2020.

  1. 8th_Sin

    8th_Sin Rookie

    Apr 6, 2020
    9
    Full Name:
    Sean Busby
    Hello!

    As the title suggests, I am about to pull the trigger on a new-to-me '16 Roso Corsa 488 GTB tomorrow, but then came across this forum and read the apparently eternal debate of the 458 vs 488 thread. Openly, I've never driven a 458 and yes, it sounds amazing through videos. The iconic Ferrari sound seems more prevalent in it. I have, however, driven the 488 and it felt as advertised... very fast, tame in the city, and comfortable for how I will be driving it.
    - My main driving will be road trips and an occasional track day

    I am now apprehensive and second guessing everything. I've saved for several years to purchase a Ferrari and want it to be a lasting memory and something I keep for a long time. Came from Porsches (911 992 Turbo S, Panamera Turbo Turismo, etc..)

    Current plan was to have a certified powertrain for 24 months for $4,200 (seemed reasonable)
    - This puts it close to the $229k mark

    I then look and see a few others across the country around this price that are a few years newer, but it's hard for me to quantify the pros/cons between them.

    Example: Ferarri of Seattle has a Certified '18 with 1,900 miles, also Roso Corsa for around the same price once I take into consideration the added powertrain warranty. I don't get to see it in person. The gentlemen helping me sent some photos of the interior of this and saw the seat had some cracks starting to form, making me wonder what else is worn.
    https://www.ferrariofseattle.com/used-Seattle-2018-Ferrari-488+GTB-Base-ZFF79ALA8J0233285

    Local 488 has 4,2xx miles on it and service records look really clean. Options are as follows:
    TWO TONE BODY PAINTING
    RED BRAKE CALIPERS
    CARBON FIBRE REAR AIR-DUCTS
    CARBON FIBRE FOG LAMP
    CARBON FIBRE SIDE AIR SPLITTER
    CARBON FIBRE DRIVER ZONE+LEDS
    CARBON FIBRE WHEELS CUP
    HORSE STITCHED ON HEADREST
    US FUNCTIONAL EQUIPMENT
    INNER COLOUR REAR LEATHER TRIM
    'SCUDERIA FERRARI' SHIELDS
    INTERNAL USE
    PARKING CAMERA
    FRONT AND REAR PARKING SENSORS
    READY FOR PASSENGER DISPLAY
    RED REV. COUNTER
    GOLDRAKE RACING SEATS
    LEATHER REAR SHELF
    SPECIAL FEATURES
    COLOURED SPECIAL STITCHING
    MICHELIN TYRES
    VEHICLE PERSONALIZATION PLATE

    I'm not in a rush to purchase, but was/am super excited. Simply want to make a good choice.

    Questions for you experts:
    1. Would you purchase the 16 over the 18, given it is sight unseen? I also like buying it from a local dealership, as it helps build the local network (events, etc..)
    2. Do you feel the 16 w/ 4,200 miles optioned above is an okay price?
    2. Save 40k and buy a certified lower mileage certified 458, but unsure where/when I will be able to drive one. The only one that drew my eye was 1,800 miles away.
     
  2. gilly6993

    gilly6993 Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2009
    2,038
    Longmeadow, MA
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    Eric
    My suggestion is not to get so caught up on the price....concentrate on the specs you want....the "extra" money will long be forgotten but driving around and looking at options/ colors you wish you had will last forever......

    As far as 488 vs 458 you will get both sides, and quite passionate about their side....I had a 458 for 5 years.....loved every minute of it....Drove a 488.....no comparison on the sound for me....BUT, the 488 is more refined and the 458 did seem "dated" when compared....looking at your previous vehicles I would say go with the 488.....
     
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  3. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    May 21, 2006
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    If you want your first Ferrari to be a memorable love affair, then buy either a 458 Italia or perhaps an F12.

    That's the long and the short of it.

    A good 2013 and later 458 is about as bulletproof as they come. I drove mine constantly and loved every second of it. Bought a 488 GTB was not impressed; sold it as quickly as humanly possible. The 488 GTB was so awful I declined my F8 allocation - and I had one of the first allocations too.

    There's a growing trend of people going back and re-buying the 458 Italias for a reason. There's a reason their prices are holding so firm, given the introduction of so many new models. 488, F8, etc. and yet the prices on the 458 hold firm... I've owned Ferraris for 20+ years and this is the first time I've seen that happen.

    Also, when it comes to taking advice regarding which Ferrari is best, keep in mind the info you get online will vary quite a bit depending on if you're talking to a gear head vs. just a "rich guy" who doesn't change his own oil and/or is scared to take the car out of auto mode or drive it in the rain. At the end of the day, try to drive both cars yourself and see if you can get a feeling for them.

    My vote goes to the 458, all day long.

    Ray
     
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  4. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    May 21, 2006
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    A guy with a screen name of "8th Sin" is clearly a 458 owner...

    :)

    Ray
     
  5. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Nuno
    Ray has just summed up my personal opinion too, although in a more eloquent way than I ever could, as always.

    I would just like to add that you should really test drive a 458. Not trying to change your mind here, I just think it’s good policy: when choosing between two things, if you don’t know them both, you’ll not be making a fully informed decision. After trying out the 458, if you still prefer the 488, then by all means go for it. But you should definitely take it for a spin. If not, you’re only giving yourself room to regret it later.

    Buying these cars is a very emotional experience based on fun behind the wheel. Not trying out the 458 in the process is, imvho, a big mistake. As you say, you’re not pressured by time. There will always be time to buy a turbocharged car or hybrids. Naturally aspirated engines, part of what made Ferrari a lifelong dream along the iconic red color, are dead and buried. And cars with that unmistakable sound that rev all the way to 9.200 rpm are stupidly rare and special, even by Ferrari’s standards and history, which are both already pretty special to begin with. Just my two cents anyway.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
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  6. BlueFerrari458

    BlueFerrari458 Karting

    Feb 24, 2018
    60
    Buy what you love if this Covid should teach us anything it's there is no your life 2.0 there is no sequel.... Ferrari's 458... 488 are all expenses not assets it's a passion purchase buy the dream spec you want 488 is faster but to be honest 458 is all I need and can handle... unused potential is a akin to using a 747 to get to the end of your driveway to get the mail... it's about disposable dollars and passion not investing


    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
     
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  7. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,139
    France
    I would try to balance (although it's an almost impossible mission here ;) ) the opinions of the 458 support group by mine, which is that if you are interested in performance (which could be the case if you want to track your car, even occasionnally) rather than in noise, you should consider that the 458 will feel seriously underpowered.
    The 458 chassis is very good (actually it's only marginally improved on the 488, which is almost the same car with a different engine) so that the lack of power across the rev range does not do it justice. Unless you prefer listening it screaming to driving it (I'm also biased because for me a V8 noise, no matter the volume, is always unimpressive compared to the true music of a V12).
     
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  8. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Nuno
    A fair point that is frequently pointed out by owners who prefer the 488, as is their right of course. However, I’d like to take the contrary position:

    - No lack of power. No lack of torque. You mean LESS torque than the 488, which is only natural because a 488 has twin turbochargers. Not everything that has less torque than a 488 is automatically underpowered.

    “Less” and “under” are two different concepts.

    - No lack of power and no lack of torque, once the 458 and the 488 have similar top speeds and similar 0-60 times.

    - I keep bouncing off the rev limiter on a 488, its redline being turbo is low. Few things in this life are more annoying.

    - Too much power and torque to have an engaging or fun drive on a public road or every else other than a clear racetrack.

    - And yes, sound. I’m sorry, but you can’t dismiss sound as secondary on a car that is all about emotion. Color, smell and sound are paramount. We’re humans. For sure you can live without it if you don’t have it, but I think what you can’t say is that it’s not important just because you don’t have it.

    In any case, I think the best advice to the OP we can give in all fairness, is to try them both. Conduct a PPI and buy condition, history and spec. If all checks out, for the love of God just don’t go worrying about mileage, regardless of your choice.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
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  9. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,139
    France
    0-60 is more about traction than power, because 60 is still a low speed; top speed is more about gear ratio than power for such cars.
    Anyway the official Ferrari numbers in kph are as follow:
    0-100: 458 Italia less than 3.4s, 488 GTB 3s (that's more than 10% difference)
    0-200: 458 Italia 10.4s, 488 GTB 8.3s
    0-1000m: 458 Italia 20.3s, 488 GTB 18.7s
    The lack of torque results in a lack of mid-range power, which is actually worse for real-world driving than for drag racing - because to get the maximum power you must always be in the right gear, easy to do in a straight line but when there are corners it's better to have some flexibility about when changing gear.
    Personnally I do not understand how the 458 would have exactly the proper power for road use - my take is, if one is not interested in power, better to go for an older car with more specific charms, and if one is interested in power, the 488 is better.
    I agree on one thing though - one should drive both to decide which he prefers.
     
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  10. Graz

    Graz Formula 3
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    Oct 15, 2012
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    Both great cars. You can’t go wrong with either but if you drive both and then decide no regrets later.
     
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  11. RaceMX-M3

    RaceMX-M3 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 15, 2010
    488
    Frisco, TX
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    Scott
    If you are on the fence go drive both cars and see how you feel. Listen to your gut - you will know which one you want. Best wishes in your search and post some pics when you get it home.
     
  12. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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  13. Jorligan

    Jorligan Karting
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    Apr 23, 2007
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    Tim
    Go drive the cars. There is an interesting YouTube video comparing the 458 and 488. Since you previously had Porsche, I would compare the difference to that of a 911 turbo versus a GT3. In regards to 0-60 times, you only get those times if you use launch control and quite frankly, I feel like an idiot with your engine bouncing off the limiter. You’ll always lose to the Tesla beside you. I have a 458 and 991.2 GT3
     
  14. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Correct me if I’m wrong, but I seem to remember you were a 458 owner in the past, before taking delivery of your beautiful 488.

    80% torque is available from 3.500 rpm. Peak torque comes at 6.000 rpm. Fuel cut off comes at 9.200 rpm. Lack of medium range torque? How? Has the 488 got more? Sure! Does the 458 leave something to be desired? Absolutely not, imvho.

    The best the OP can do is to drive them both, because it’s a very personal and emotional buy. In the end, the 458 and the 488 are two very different ways of enjoying a Ferrari. Even though they have similar top speed and 0-60 time, they’re very different in nature.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
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  15. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
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  16. 8th_Sin

    8th_Sin Rookie

    Apr 6, 2020
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    Sean Busby
    Thank you everyone for your thoughts! These are great points throughout. The primary reason I'm not going back to the Turbo-S was it felt muted. It was a properly fast car, but just felt disconnected. When I got done driving the 488, it almost had that same feeling. Candidly, I didn't drive it for too long.

    I've been searching locally and haven't seen another 458 to drive to really test it see the difference, but it's clear there is a massive passion for the 458. That has to say something and shouldn't be taken lightly.
     
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  17. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    6,002
    At $230K you are not that far from a brand new base F8 $275K,

    Can you wait for a low miles F8 to pop up, evidently they will tank in the next year already. If not pick up a 458 exactly how you like it.Personally 488 is a 3rd place choice,which is dropping fast.
     
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  18. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,139
    France
    Actually before the 488 I owned a 599 - that's why I was shocked by the (relative, I admit) lack of torque of the 458 - while the 599 cannot match the turbo-torque of the 488 (it's true turbochargers are some way of cheating when it comes to delivering torque), a large capacity V12 can provide a decent amount...
    It's also true that the V8 have gone a long way from the 5-valve engines, so that the 458 is almost acceptable ;)
     
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  19. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    599? Man of good taste!

    I now better understand your point. Your comparison basis is a V12 and then a twin-turbocharged car. Naturally aspirated V8s are very different in nature.

    Kindest regards,

    Nuno.
     
  20. gilly6993

    gilly6993 Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2009
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    There’s your answer. Go with the 458....


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  21. DefunctNeurons

    DefunctNeurons Formula Junior

    May 15, 2018
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    Trevor
    A similar conundrum happened when BMW moved from the naturally-aspirated V8 in the e90/93 M3 to the F80 twin-turbo in-line-6. The V8 is magnificent to hear and rev, while the turbo 6 spanks it in power, acceleration and especially torque. I love the V8, especially on track - very precise throttle modulation, sounds wonderful. But as a daily driver, the turbo is easier to live with and better squirting through traffic (my opinion, of course.) I love my M3 and won’t sell it until I have to. So for my weekend toy, the 458 was the obvious choice. It’s the exotic version of a V8 M3 - precise, instant throttle, revs to heaven and sounds beautiful. Perfect complement to the daily M3 for me.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
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  22. Rory breaker

    Rory breaker Karting

    Apr 17, 2017
    211
    Simplified:

    488 is faster, smoother, better tech, more refined, killer value but still depreciation to come.
    458 is quick but not fast, tech kind of outdated, style is iconic, sound especially with proper mods is uniquely intoxicating, closer to the bottom of the depreciation curve all things being equal.

    Whichever puts a bigger smile on your face, get it. If thrust/acceleration is most important as an example, get the 488. To me, sound is critical, and the 458 is just too special of an overall experience to pass up, vs the 488 which to me isn’t particularly unique, a great car, but so is a 911 turbo, huracan, etc...not special in my eyes. Performance is important to me as well and the 458 goes plenty hard for me, maybe not for others. Therefore it was 458 for me. My advice - don’t skimp on spec, cut no corners, find the car that is perfect/near perfect to you.
     
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  23. 8th_Sin

    8th_Sin Rookie

    Apr 6, 2020
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    Sean Busby
    This is a great comparison and thought. Simply clicks for me

    I think I'll keep my search up. I'm really glad I discussed before moving forward. Need all information to make the best informed decision and simply just don't have that yet.
     
  24. thxelon

    thxelon Rookie
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    Dec 5, 2019
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    bob
    I went through the same exercise 2 months ago and drove both and went for the 488 (both spiders). Main reasons;

    -Better tech/comfort, 458 looking a little dated inside
    -Newer car with warranty (I was coming from a McLaren and tired of paying 10K/year for extended warranty)
    -Honestly I have the exhaust flaps pinned open and the sound is pretty good

    The price difference wasn't that bad and wanted the newer car... less headache.
     
  25. Jorligan

    Jorligan Karting
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    Apr 23, 2007
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    Unless you always with the top down, I would make sure that you test drive the spiders before going that route. I test drove the 458 spider and had roof creek on certain bumps as well as some cowl shake so it definitely decreases car stiffness. This led to me buying the 458 hardtop. For open air, McLaren 650S.
     

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