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348 Injection & Fuel Pump Relays

Discussion in '348/355' started by m.stojanovic, Aug 5, 2017.

  1. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    Dec 22, 2011
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    Miroljub Stojanovic
    Just to share what I found out about the relays for injectors and the fuel pumps. These are the C, D, L & N relays on the step pad relay panel. They have the Bosch number 0 332 014 140 (or 0 332 019 140 if in a plastic housing) and are same 30A and of similar type like most other relays that are 0 332 014 113. However, the 140-s have a special property - they are low pull-in and low drop-out voltage type. The reason why Ferrari use this special type of relays for the injectors and the pumps is to ensure that they engage and don't drop out (switch off and prevent engine fire-up) during engine cranking when the battery voltage drops significantly, especially if the battery is not fully charged. Even though the 113 or another relay with identical pin assignment may work at these positions, it may cause difficult start in certain circumstances.

    So, check whether your relays C, D, L & N are 140-s if you sometimes experience difficult start when everything else is fine (flywheel grease, pressure regulators etc.). The only other substitute for Bosch 140 is Bosch 0 332 209 168 but I have not be able to find either of the two anywhere. I believe the Ferrari parts suppliers have the correct relay for this application (though they don't show the Bosch number).
     
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  3. Tommy J.

    Tommy J. Karting

    Apr 7, 2016
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    Good to know. I have a slow start on one of the banks. It could be a relay.

    Sent fra min SM-G935F via Tapatalk
     
  4. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
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    Bugtussle
    More awesome info, Miroljub! Thank you for posting. If you find a suitable alternative for the factory relays please let us know.
     
  5. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    Found the following info:

    Tyco relays with a coil code 002 are a perfect match for the Ferrari's Bosch 0 332 014 140 (0 332 019 140). Actually a bit better - Bosch 140 has 7V pull-in (Bosch 113 has 8V), Tyco 002 has 6.5V pull-in.

    The full number of the Tyco relay I mentioned is V23234-A0002-X031 (or X032) and it is a GM part number 90491314 (Vauxhall, Opel, Saab and a number of American cars), also known as "the brown relay". Other manufacturers of the same GM 90491314 are:

    Bosch 0 332 209 136
    Hella 4RD 007 794-05
    Siemens V23134-A52-X237
     
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  7. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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  8. FlyingHaggisRacing

    FlyingHaggisRacing Formula 3

    Jul 2, 2013
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    In the injection area....
    I think Ernie suggested some more up to date injectors.

    Any suggestions ?
     
  9. seabass23

    seabass23 Karting

    Nov 6, 2016
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    Bosch part 0332019151 works for my 348s fuel pump and fuel injector relays! Rockauto is your friend.

    Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
     
  10. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    Bosch relay 0 332 019 151 is similar to the relays 0 332 014 113 on the 348 relay panlel but not to the injector and fuel pump relays 0 332 014 140. The 151 (as well as 113) will certainly work for the injection and the fuel pumps but, in the case of somewhat weak battery, they may not switch the fuel pumps on (the fuel pumps are switched on during cranking when the battery voltage drops to below 10V).

    The special thing about the 140 relay is that it has a "stronger" coil, 65 Ohm as compared to 85 Ohm of the 151 and 113. All four 140 relays are controlled by the ECU-s i.e. by switching transistors inside which introduce, in addition to the battery voltage drop during cranking, certain further voltage drop on the relay coil. These conditions appear to be the reason why Ferrari went with the lower pull-in voltage (stronger coil) relays here. The circuitry of the switching transistors has been designed around the 65 Ohm coils of the relay 140 so the 85 Ohm (standard) other relays may cause no-start with a weaker battery.
     
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  12. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Nov 19, 2001
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    Thanks for the heads up Miro.
     
  13. 275GTB

    275GTB Formula 3

    Jan 12, 2010
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    Hi Miroljub, on my 1997 355 I have the 2 relays that work the fuel pump and the secondary air pump: the original Ferrari fitted Bosch 0 332 014 140 (12v 30A)

    The fuel pump relay has got sticky and required a few taps on a rare occasion, so needs replacing ASAP. The air pump one, I am going to replace as it has been working against a broken air pump for years and I have finally found a new air pump.

    Just getting an update to the earlier thread, are the above still my best alternatives available on the market, as I cant find the original Bosch relays anywhere?

    many thanks
    Mark
     
  14. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    The original Bosch 0 332 014 140 (0 332 019 140) are obsolete so go for GM 90491314 (superseded by GM 90543014). Some of the Saab parts suppliers that have them:

    Holland: https://www.rendcarparts.com/en/search/search
    Germany: https://schwedenteile.de/p/52669/relay-for-saab-genuine-part-part-.-90543014.html
    Sweden: https://shop.speedparts.se/en/prod/saab-oem/rela-3.html
    USA: https://www.esaabparts.com/saab/parts/90543014?ss=90491314

    You can also check in the UK with Vauxhall or Saab parts suppliers.
     
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  15. 275GTB

    275GTB Formula 3

    Jan 12, 2010
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    thanks again for all you helpful contributions, much appreciated
     
  16. Robbe

    Robbe Formula Junior
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    I do not know if it is important, but there are differences between the original Bosch 0 332 019 140 and the suggested replacement the Brown GM 90491314 Bosch 0 332 209 136.
    I have both on my desk at the moment, and the difference is that when energized, the old one has power on both the 87 pins (=the two parallel pins).
    There is no 87A pin, only two 87 pins that are powered by the relay.

    The replacement brown one however has no power on the middle pin 87A when energized, only on the single 87 pin.

    So the difference is the absence of 12V on the middle pin when the relay is energized.
    I have not tested the new one to see if it is a problem, will report back soon.
     
  17. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Veteran
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    For what it's worth, the wiring diagrams only show one output (on pin 87).

    I wonder if the circuit board puts both relay outputs to the same relay panel plug pin (for load sharing)?
     
  18. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    It does not matter as the middle pin is not used in the 348. On the relay board where the middle pin goes in, there is just an empty slot hole (no female pin inside it).

    Otherwise, relays with 2 x 87 pins, energised at the same time, do not have any stronger switching capability than the relays with a single pin 87, i.e. they do not have stronger or twin contacts inside; it's just two spades connected to the same single pair of contacts inside and this is for convenience of having two wires that receive power from the relay.
     
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  19. Robbe

    Robbe Formula Junior
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    And as I just came back from testing, it indeed does make no difference at all (as it can't , when the middle is not connected, clear! )
    The brown relay is getting harder to find, but RenDcarparts from your link supplied me with two, and they have ordered some more, so they appear to have a source for them.
     
  20. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3
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    I got in touch a while back and they advised me:

    0 332 204 101 is now 0 332 209 151

    0 332 014 113 is now 0 332 019 151

    0 332 014 140 is now 0 332 019 151 (same as above)

    0 332 015 006 -> has stayed the same

    Few pics here including pics of the rold/new relays side by side with the diagrams showing:

    https://www.clubscuderia.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?45388-348-DIY-quot-Restoration-quot&p=718410&highlight=relay#post718410

    Did teh conversion just over 8 years ago and everything has worked just fin electrically :)
     
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  21. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic Formula 3
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    What is special about Bosch 0 332 014 140 is that it is a low pull-in relay (will engage even at at 7V) and its coil is 65 Ohm. Other standard Bosch relays need min. 8V to engage and have 85 Ohm coils. Bosch 0 332 019 151 does not have the said characteristics like the "140" but like other standard relays so it is not really a replacement.

    According to the Bosch catalogues, there were only two Bosch equivalents to the 0 332 014 140: 0 332 019 140 (some later 348-s came with it, black plastic body) and 0 332 209 168 but both are now also obsolete.

    The GM 90491314 (ss. by 90543014) have similar coil resistance as the Bosch "140" and even better low pull-in characteristic of 6.5 volt.

    There are certainly reasons as to why Ferrari uses these special relays for injection and fuel pumps. I believe that one reason is the fact that these relays are activated by the ECU-s (by dedicated switching transistors in them) for which 65 Ohm coil is possibly more suited than 85 Ohm. The second reason is, I believe, the fact that these relays work with rather high current and their connection reliability is important considering the function. A 65 Ohm (higher current) relay coil will "slam" the contacts closed harder and keep them "tighter" than an 85 Ohm one.

    I am sure that Bosch 0 332 019 151, or any other standard automotive relay with the same pin layout/functions will operate fine but may not last as long as the "140"-s. "Long" meaning hours of operation, not how many years they have been in the car. Standard relays may also fail to engage when attempting to start the engine on a somewhat weaker battery.
     

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