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2017 488 GTB Rotor replacement already?

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Ferrari415, Feb 13, 2021.

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  1. Ferrari415

    Ferrari415 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2020
    4
    I just bought this car on 9/15/20 with 13,500 miles on it. I’ve put on about 2000 miles so far. The “ccm” light recently came on and the car shows “CCM Disc brakes wear”. I took the car in for its annual service and the service advisor mentioned I needed to replace all four rotors and brakes. He said the rear rotors were gone almost 100% and the front rotors have about 60% left. I called another Ferrari mechanic and mentioned this to him and he doubts the carbon ceramic rotors needed to be replaced. He said brake pads maybe. He said the dealer just loves to reccommend replacing everything. The job from Ferrari was quoted about $30,000. The brakes feel fine, they squeak a bit at a stop but I don’t hear rotors grinding or anything. Has anyone ever been through this dilemma? If so I would appreciate hearing about it. It would be a bummer to have spend $30k already as I just bought the car.
     
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  3. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    May 23, 2013
    5,996
    AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    ANGELO
    Didnt you get told how much was left when you bought the car ?

    The better price you must of paid for a car with 13.5 k miles just took a hit ?

    Take it to the other mechanic if you please but i wouldnt skip the brake department as thats what keeps you alive.
     
  4. Ferrari415

    Ferrari415 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2020
    4
    The car was inspected by a third party inspection company when I bought it. The brakes checked out on the report and there wasn’t any issues reported. Not sure if he was trained to look at carbon ceramic rotors or not. I bought it from a Toyota dealership of all places.
     
  5. FFan5

    FFan5 Formula Junior

    Jul 7, 2018
    342
    If the previous owner tracked the car a lot, with race mode or below on, then you really might need new rear rotors. Don't spend $30k though. Cheaper alternatives can be found with the search button.

    Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  6. Ferrari415

    Ferrari415 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2020
    4
    I drive the car with on race mode all the time. Is that not good for the rotors?
     
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  8. Condor Man

    Condor Man F1 Rookie

    Sep 8, 2006
    2,838
    Los Angeles
    Race mode has nothing to do with the rotors.

    If the previous owner did many tracks days he may have cause premature brake wear.

    However, 15,500 miles is very early.

    Perhaps the Miles may have been played with??


    May the Horse be with you
     
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  9. Ferrari415

    Ferrari415 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2020
    4
    I don’t think the miles have been tampered with based on the carfax. The mileage seems to match up with owners. I’m starting to think the car has been tracked from the previous owner. I’ll take it in for a second opinion soon.
     
  10. GoHardGT3RS

    GoHardGT3RS Karting

    Jan 1, 2015
    68
    Germany
    Tracking the car with ESC on will generate high wear on the pads and rotors since micro-braking is applied to stabilize the car.

    If you track your 488 regularly, you should consider buying rotors from the UK-based manufacturer SURFACE TRANSFORMS. They have a different compound for their rotors which is much better heat resistant > less wear + the rotors can be resurfaced twice at a moderate cost.
     
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  11. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Rookie

    May 29, 2019
    4,522
    Hopefully some place nice.
    Full Name:
    A.B
    I call b.s.
    Ferrari unfortunately uses an algorithm to determine brake wear. This is as reliable as the average politician.
    They can get away with this because there is a lot of mysticism surrounding brake wear on CCM rotors.
    Here's the short of it. If your rotors on the back is as smooth as those on the front, they are fine. As long as they are kind of glass like smooth, they are fine.
    Your pads have wear indicators that trip when worn, so that's not even an assesment. That's just a yes/no deal.
    The second guy is correct, you have pmenty of rotor meft.
    Now here's what is going to happen once your rotors are worn down. They will become noisy and performance will diminish, that's it. The car will not blow up, the world will not come to an end, cats and dogs will nkt start living together...
    You can finish a race on worn discs. You won't win, but you can.
    It is not voodoo, it is not "invisible", it is simple.
    Get the guy that gave you the correct advice to reset your disc wear as it is worthless. If your pads are close tobworn, i.e about 3 mm of pad material, get the sensible guy to install a set of Pagid. RSC1 pads.
    Then once your rotors are gone, consider Surface Transforms discs. Cheaper than OE and lasts longer - and they can be resurfaced.
    30k. Forvthat you can get ST rotors, four resurfacings, and enough pads to last you a decade or more. Idiotic.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  13. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,627
    France
    In France the OEM brakes replacement is EUR 16K which is just less than USD 20K (not 30K), but I still elected to switch to ST discs for slightly less (I should get my car back around the end of this month).
    My brakes were toast after 15,000 km (not even miles), a significant part of them being on track.
    There was no light for brake wear but the surface of all discs had become rough instead of smooth, which is a visible sign of wear and will translate into even faster eating of pads.
    There is a common belief that when driving on the track in race or sport mode the electronics will cause faster wear on the rear because the system may apply brakes on the rear to help the car turning, however this also depends on how the car is driven (like ABS, the fact it may happen does not mean it does happen) - I mostly drive on track in race mode and my front brakes have always been wearing faster (the pads are eaten twice as fast on the front, and the four discs were now in about the same state).
     
  14. MalibuGuy

    MalibuGuy F1 Veteran

    Sep 18, 2007
    5,061
    Since you recently bought the car, do you have any used car warranty agreement?
    If you bought from an authorized dealer, you may have some recourse since the warming light appeared before 6 months and with very light additional mileage (2,000).

    Having said that, a good Ferrari mechanic can tell you the condition of the pads. If you did an inspection prior to purchase, you will be able to compare the pad usage by comparing the thickness of each pad before purchase to today. If there is very little difference, then it would seem unlikely that your driving caused the need to replace the rotors. Since Ferrari (the seller) knows that replacement of the rotors is very expensive, their condition should be reflected in the offering price. Given that the warning light is triggered by vehicle software, it seems reasonable to expect that this "wear/age " data would have been available at the time of sale. If so, and if you did not cause the excessive wear, then that data would have revealed that the prior owner had basically used up the rotors. Therefore, that information should have been revealed to you so you would be able to make a fair assessment of the vehicle. The burden of fairness in sharing this information is shared by both parties, however, since Ferrari is more skilled and knowledgeable, the majority of that obligation rests on their shoulders.

    In terms of a a visual inspection of the rotors, perhaps bring the car to another authorized service center and speak to the foreman to get an experienced master mechanic to do an investigation of your rotors and software. Also the rotors can be weighed to see if they are excessively worn as rotor weight is lost due to the loss of the rotor material.
     
  15. MalibuGuy

    MalibuGuy F1 Veteran

    Sep 18, 2007
    5,061
    "The world is not going to end"
    Obviously you have not been watching enough YouTube. Search End of the World and get back to me.

    "Cat and Dogs living together" Here in the USA that's been happening ever since "Don't ask, don't tell"

    I once had a service center manager advise me to sell the car if you have to do anything with the brakes. He was seriously petrified of having to tell an owner that he needed to sell his first born in order to get the car repaired.
     
  16. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,627
    France
    ... just got back my 488 with Surface Transform discs and Pagid RSC1 pads. I did not drive it much so cannot really tell about the actual performance of the new system. The discs do not have the same look as the OEM ones; I also asked to take back the replaced Brembo parts so I could see that the front discs (as well as the front pads, which is less informative because they were more recent) were noticeably more "damaged" than the rear ones.
     
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  17. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Rookie

    May 29, 2019
    4,522
    Hopefully some place nice.
    Full Name:
    A.B
    I wish they would black anodize the hats. But at this stage they reserve that for the OE world.
    I asked the ST tech staff and was told that I could use Motip high temp satin black paint or send them out for anodizing. I got a set of new bolts and locknuts so all I need to do is mask off the mating surface of the wheel hub and bobbins, and thus can easily get them black.

    Remember that you need to properly bed them. That is not done just by driving around - quite the opposite in fact. You do need to use the proper procedure as per Pagid and ST's recommendations. Do you have the bedding procedure?
     
  18. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,627
    France
    Yes, bedding has been performed by the installer (he's in the countryside, so hopefully could occasionally reach the - unfortunately - illegal speeds required...)
    Regarding the look, I was more referring to the disc itself (as you certainly know), below a Brembo picture and a picture of the new ST disc:
    Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  19. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Rookie

    May 29, 2019
    4,522
    Hopefully some place nice.
    Full Name:
    A.B
    Ah yes. I actually like the look of the ST rotors themselves. And with the silver wheels the silver bells are much less noticeable.
    Give it an extra once over with the bedding to be sure it's on point. I found that it does take a bit more than what they recommend when both pads and rotors are new. Once they start to smell you know you've got them hot enough:)
     

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