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1982 Mondial 8 restoration

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by Dr-Boost, Feb 17, 2021.

  1. Dr-Boost

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    Jun 21, 2018
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    IAN THOMPSON
    Hello All

    Long time listener, first time (technically second) caller.

    My name is Ian Thompson and I am based in Holywood, Northern Ireland. I’m a mechanical Engineer with a PhD in Turbocharged engines. I own a small (very small, only me) company, TSV Cars Ltd. I set it up to do some Engineering consultancy and restore old Ferraris and Porsches.

    I thought I would share my latest build with the community here as I know I love seeing pictures of restorations and hopefully I may be of help to some.

    For the attention of Admins, I’m not here to promote my business, I mention it so as not to break any rules, I will of course help the community with advice and parts info etc and would love to get to the stage where I could sponsor a forum but I’m not quite there yet. Please get in touch if there is a fee or specific rules I should follow, Thanks.

    So, on to the latest build.

    The car is a 1982 RHD Mondial 8 in Rosso Corsa over Crema. This is quite a rare car as far as Mondials go as there were only 145 (reportedly) made in right hand drive…and I bet there aren’t many left…hence my desire to save it.

    I'll be carrying out what I call a 'Class B' restoration, by that I mean somewhere between a 'Class A' full nut and bolt restoration and a 'Class C' (full service and cosmetic correction) restoration/renovation.

    Throughout this restoration, I’ll share the running totals of money and time, a bit 'Wheeler Dealer-esque'. This will give a good idea of the true cost and time should you be contemplating your own restoration. I’ll also aim to post weekly.

    This is how the car looked when I first got it. It looks a little rough around the edges but on the whole, the car is very solid, it seems it was cared for quite well and there is only superficial rust in the usual places. The underside and frame parts are very solid with little to no rust.
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    I think the poor car had a little identiy crisis...the quattrovalvole badge is now redundant.


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    Someone had started to remove the interior and remarkably, all the pieces came with the car. Nothing a good clean won't fix, mostly dust. The car was well stored.


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    Here you can see the mileage, pretty low for such an early car and definietly worth saving.

    On the righ tof this image you'll see a glimpse of the tacho. Hands up if you can tell me which side the tacho should be on on a RDH Mondial 8 from 1982?

    So, that is an introduction to my latestest restoration and so far I’m at £11,175.32 and 6.5 hours. See you next week.
     

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  3. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
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    #2 theunissenguido, Feb 17, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2021
    Picture(s) of the engine ...maybe it has already the QV in it !! :p
     
  4. Dr-Boost

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    Hi theunissenguido,

    There will be more pics to follow, plenty more!...someone did give it a go with red paint though...still a 2 valve though!
     
  5. 2cam

    2cam Formula Junior

    Aug 28, 2014
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    I'm glad that you're saving her and can't wait to see the progress!

    2cam
     
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  6. paulchua

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    Jul 1, 2013
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    Hello sir! Welcome, and thank you for posting. We look forward to following your progress and I will personally be cheering you on!
     
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  8. Dr-Boost

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    @2cam yes, I'm glad I can save her and I too look forward ot seing progress!

    @paulchua, thanks for the welcome and I'll need quite a bit of encouragement, plenty of tasks need doing!
     
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  9. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    As the adage states, it's often the journey itself, not the destination..
    Keep up the great work.
     
  10. 350HPMondial

    350HPMondial F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2002
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    Super Rare car,, worth saving.
    ❤️
     
  11. afterburner

    afterburner Formula 3
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    Welcome Ian, looking forward to seeing the progess!
     
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  13. Jaroslaw

    Jaroslaw Rookie

    Dec 30, 2010
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    I'm looking forward to your restoration. I also own a 1982 Mondial 8, European specs, federalized in US. I believe it is only one of 7 such cars in US. And just over 30,000 Km (not miles). Very original and in good condition.
     
  14. Dr-Boost

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    Hi All, as promised here is the next instalment.

    When I got the car, someone had already removed the engine so I thought it best to start there. There is very little history with the car so it is a total unknown. I’ve no idea why the engine was removed (we likely find out later on) but it did turn freely and appeared to be in good condition…even though a little dusty!

    These engines are very similar to the 308 GT4 engines and some were known for having hollow valves. It is unlikely this Mondial 8 had or even still has hollow valves but a complete strip down and inspection was the best option I thought. This way we know exactly what we have, plus, at 30k miles, the exhaust valve guides will probably need replacing anyway…along with various rubbers seals that have probably hardened over the last 40 odd years.

    On to the strip down.
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    All in all, everything came off pretty easily and the belts don’t look that old, the engine appears in good shape.

    I’m still at £11,175.32 for parts but now 10.25 hours for labour. See you next week.
     
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  15. Mechanical Dad

    Mechanical Dad Formula Junior

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    I hope mine is one of the 7 !
     
  16. Mechanical Dad

    Mechanical Dad Formula Junior

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    Please keep the pictures coming, I plan to do similar work to mine this year.
     
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  17. JLF

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  18. Dr-Boost

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    Hi All, next episode...

    Next step was to remove the valve covers and camshafts.

    Care is required when removing the valve caps as they are machined in placed, i.e. matched to the journal they are on. Ferrari helped me out here by stamping the camshaft bearing caps and the head with corresponding numbers! Very kind of them. However, is it still good practice to be organised.

    Again, the cam lobes, valve spacers and camshaft bearing journals are all in great condition. Their condition is congruent with the 34k miles that the odometer is showing.

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    All good so far, next step…head removal…watch this space!!!!



    I’m currently at £11,212.40 for parts (I bought inlet manifold gaskets to make a puller) and 13.25 hours for labour. See you next week.
     
  19. Dr-Boost

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    Next step is to start removing the heads!

    For those of you that have tried you will know the pain involved. By far, the simplest method is to use a puller plate. This is basically a big flat steel plate (10mm thick) that ‘jacks’ the head off by way of bolts pressing down on the head bolts. Care must be taken to jack the head off ‘straight and true’ (as not to bend/warp/break it) and also to ensure the jacking bolts press on the head studs and don’t ‘run off’. To avoid this, I used bolts with a point on the bottom that align nicely with dimples on the end of the head studs.

    Care must also be taken when attaching the plate to the head, I used as many attachment points as possible (cam cap and valve cover studs) so as to spread the load.

    Here are the pictures.

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    Above is the puller plate in place



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    Above is what sucess looks like!!!!


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    This is the condition of the block. It isn't actually that bad, most of the 'gunk' will clean off with most of the rust silt coming from the cooling system (a littel clue as to why the engine was removed by the previoous owner)


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    This picture shows the aluminium corosion that 'sticks' the heads to the head studs. This corrosion is the reason they are so hard to remove. When rebuilding I'll be putting copper grease in the studs to prevent this from happening again.


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    Again, this looks worse than it is. The piston crowns and cylinder walls are very clean indeed. Most of the 'debris' you see is from the aluminium corrosion and the cooling system.


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    Again, the valve heads (and seat) are all in really good order. The head gasket surface is in really good condition also.


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    This picture shows a littel rust around the valve head that can indicate a coolant leak. Usually the leak comes from a blown head gasket or a crack in the head. (small spiler alert...the heads were pressure tested and were fine, the head gasket was inspected and was also fine...more on this leak later...)


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    This shot shows the good condition of the cylinder sealing surface and the cylinder wall.

    All in all and all things considered, the engine is in pretty good condition and will clean up really nicely.

    So, to date im currently at £11,242.57 for parts (new nuts, bolts and washer were bought) and 26.25 hours for labour.

    Still loads more to come, keep watching.
     
  20. Dr-Boost

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    Hi All,

    This next post comes with a disclaimer! If you are squeamish…look away now…

    Once I got the head off, it was time to remove the inlet manifolds…simple I hear you say…but alas, anything with old cars is very rarely easy.

    The manifolds were stuck solid, I even made a puller to try and remove them, it was a sturdy puller (10mm plate) but was beginning to bend so I thought it best to leave that route.

    Heat was tried, very hot heat but nothing, penetrating oil, diesel and even acetone were tried but nothing would shift them.

    This is where it gets a little ‘messy’. The only option was to cut them off. I know this is poor engineering but it truly was the only option.

    I used a fine hacksaw blade and tried to cut the gasket between the manifolds and the head. Boy was that gasket hard! I mean as hard as a diamond in a snowstorm! I couldn’t understand why it was so hard, yes I had to cut through the studs but the gasket itself (and other ‘stuff’, you’ll see later) was so hard. I went through over 20 blades!

    As you can see from the pictures, I ended up cutting into the manifold and head faces slightly but they will clean up with some machining. What the pictures also show is some sort of ‘deposit’ in and around the water jacket.

    This is where I believe the plot thickens and this is what I have been eluding to in previous posts. I believe the previous owner(s) had an issue with cooling (no thermostat installed). I think there may have been a leak in the water jacket that is between the manifold and head and they tried to seal it with all manner of concoctions. There is silicone in there and I believe the deposit is some sort of ‘steel seal’ or ‘headgasket sealer’ that you pour into the coolant that hardens around the leak to seal it. You can see the gasket is badly warped and the entire waterjacket was blocked.

    Once the manifolds were off, I had to remove the studs that not only had been cut off flush with the head face but were also badly stuck in place. So badly so that I couldn’t remove them before removing the manifold, they all sheared off. The trick I used was to head the head, use penetrating oil and weld a nut onto the stud. They then come out quite easily…well, relatively easy compared to the manifolds themselves. The exhaust manifold studs were even easier, the double nut trick worked for them.
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    Here you can see the saw marks and the remains of the gasket along with the deposits I talked of.



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    Here you can see the silicone I was talking of.



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    All in all, very messy.



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    As I said, all manner of concoctions!



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    Here you can see the cut marks, they look worse than they were and will clean up with a little machine work.



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    Same for the manifolds.


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    Stud removal, here I welded on a bolt but most came out after having a nut welded on.


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    Mor edetail.



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    This is the double nut trick, it worked for the exhaust manifold studs.


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    Ta da! You could almost reuse these!


    In conclusion, I know it isn’t the prettiest work but the heads are off and the manifolds are separated, pretty good win all things considered.

    So far I’m at £11,342.52 for parts (new inlet and exhaust manifold studs) and 32 hours for labour.

    Any questions, feel free to ask.
     
  21. Dr-Boost

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    Hi All,

    Next step, while I wait for a few parts to arrive, is bodywork.

    Knowing what these era cars can be like, this one has survived quite well. In no particular order, I started from the left rear and worked in an anti-clockwise (car viewed from above) direction.

    These first few pics show the areas of rust on the left rear, as you can see, not really that bad.

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    These pictures are of the front lower valence corner pieces, again, not too bad, I’ve seen these totally disintegrate.

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    The area around the boot/rear trunk area was quite bad, I had to add in a new lip seal for the rubber seal as it had totally disappeared!

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    All other areas that have surface rust were treated with rust converter.

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    There are other areas that need repairing, I’ll post pics as and when I get to them.

    So far I’m at £11,478.80 for parts and 61 hours for labour. (bodywork is very timme consuming!)
     
  22. JLF

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  23. Subito Grigio

    Subito Grigio Karting

    Jun 2, 2009
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    This sequence is exceptional! My gut says you will consider becoming a YouTube Video artist similar to “The Art of Boatbuilding.” Take a look! You are doing a wonderful job helping us! Thanks. SG


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  24. OpenAirFan

    OpenAirFan Rookie

    Aug 10, 2008
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    Krefeld, Germany
    This bodywork is very well done! Could you provide some step by step pictures to get an impression how much work that really is to fix such a rusty hole?
     
  25. wilkrod

    wilkrod Karting

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    Nicely done! glad to see you are all in with saving another Mondial
    Testa
    Jeff
     
  26. Dr-Boost

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    @JLF , thanks, plenty more to come!
    @Subito Grigio , thanks for the kind words, I'll be sure to check it out. I may do a video series for my next project, a 308 GT4
    @OpenAirFan , thanks for the compliment. Below is a more indepth descritption of how the two rear holes were repaired.
    @wilkrod , Hi Jeff, thanks, def one worth saving, I can't believe how rare right hand drive 8s are!

    As per the request from @OpenAirFan , below are more images of how the rear side holes were repaired. Any questions, feel free to ask.

    First thing is to identify the area to be repaired...seems easy...
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    ...as ou can see the area to be repaired is usually much larger than is first visible. Make sure to grind the paint/filler back until good, thick metal can be found.
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    The next step is to cut out the rough edges, this leaves a good surface to weld to and makes cutting the repair piece easier.
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    This part takes a lot of trial and error so the fit is 'snug'. Take your time here.
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    Next step is to spot weld in place. Rememebr to leave gaps and move around the panel so as not to build up heat in one area and warp the panel. I came back to this to finish it off.
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    Same for this one.
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    Once you have spot welded the repair panel in place, grind down until join is almost impossible to be seen.
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    Next step is filler and paint...I leave that to the bodyshop guys.

    This is a rough outline of how I do most of the repairs and usually the level of finish of the repair is directly proportional to the time taken...as with most things in life.

    Speak soon,

    Ian
     
  27. OpenAirFan

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    Aug 10, 2008
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    Thank you Ian! It is a pleasure to see this wonderful craftsmanship.
    Gerhard
     
  28. Dr-Boost

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    Hi All,

    The next few steps concentrated on replacing the timing drive pulley bearings and the crankshaft pilot bearing.

    The timing drive pulley bearings are a pain to get at and change so this is the ideal time to change them.

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    Cover off and new bearings ready to go it. (and new seal)

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    Old bearings in engine block

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    New bearings being fitted in block.

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    A line of Loctite 5980 for good measure (and then the gasket)

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    Same for the gearbox mounting face (no gasket this time)

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    Old pilot bearing cooming out.

    So far I’m at £11,977.04 for parts and 75 hours for labour. (the timing drive bearings were a time killer, they had been in there a long time...and the process to get at them is also long winded)

    Thanks,

    Ian
     
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