ZYMOL AUTOGLYM SWISSOL CROFTGATE

I will choose ZYMOL....

 

Plus 1 for Zymol

 

I use Zymol.

 

I use Meguiars and I really like it! I also want to try Zymol since that's what "Paul Dalton", the best car washer use!

 

Swissol!

 

I just used a hodgepodge of Maguires and Mother's stuff on my 328, and it looks fantastic. Now I have no delusions about winning any shows, but it's mighty hard for me to see how the Zymol is worth the premium.
I noticed that there is something on their site that sells for $7K/tub. It would probably be cheaper to run a dab of it through and HPLC + Gas Chromatograph + Mass Spec + IR Spec etc, and reverse engineer it. You'd be ahead by the second batch (especially if you can use the specs for free).

 

I swear by the Autoglym stuff - use it almost exclusively, got the best finish out of it (and have used everything from Meguires to Zymol).

For leather cleaner (cleaner, not conditioner), the best stuff I ever used came in that overpriced Schedoni Ferrari cleaning kit. I finally tracked down the name of the company that made the cleaner (used with a natural sponge), it's an Italian company, but I've had no luck getting in touch with them, and I'm not spending another $200 for another kit just for a small amount of leather cleaner.

 

Zymol for me.

 

Zymol rules - it's the best by far.

 

yep yep, need to hit up the carnuba store in newport to stock up again though.

 

The 7k zymol comes with a free lifetime resupply.

They also make a $1000.00ish wax that comes with free lifetime resupply.

 

That would make more sense. I saw both products and had just finished cackling at the 1K "Atlantique" when I toppled over after seeing the $7K stuff. If the deal is that you pay them what essentially ammounts to a licensing fee and then they keep shipping you the buckets of goo for no or a negligable price (do you have to send back the old tub?), then it's not quite as ridiculous. I guess I wasn't paying attention, but I thought that the "Atlantique" price was per tub.

In general, what makes this stuff so much better than any other decent wax?
Has anyone tried putting the various products in unlabeled bottles and then applying them to a set of essentially identical cars?

 

i prefer the search button

 

Of those mentioned I would probably choose Autoglym or Swissol (Swissvax). Zymol is nice, but here are some interesting facts about Zymol and Carnauba wax in general.

1) Zymol started in the 1980's by relabeling Meguiars' products. In fact, HD-Cleanse is still made by Meguiars, and Zymol Cleaner Wax is made by Turtle Wax.

2) HD-Cleanse features a high level of long chained silicones, which most would agree to is not the best product to use on metal (it can leach into bare steel)

3) Most high end carnauba produced tout their wax as having "#1 Brazilian White Carnauba wax". This is fine, except ALL carnauba wax is yellowish in natural state. It is actually bleached and processed to remove the color (yes bleached).

4) Most high end carnauba producers also use the "#1 Brazilian Carnauba wax" statement. 99 percent of all carnauba wax that is harvested is "#1". It can usually be bought in bulk for about a dollar a pound. This is the same exact wax that encases gummy bears.

5) Since carnauba wax is cheap, it is generally the least expensive product in a wax. However, most companies charge more for higher carnauba content, so they charge more for the least expensive product.

6) Carnauba wax is harder then concrete in natural form. It needs to be "cut" with solvents to soften it and make it applicable. The solvents used make up the bulk of the cost of the product.

7) Carnauba wax is very dull naturally. Gummy bears are encased in close to pure carnauba and are not glossy. It is the oils that are blended in with carnauba wax that give the famous "wet" look.

8) While Carnauba has very strong protecting abilities, it also melts at 139 degrees, which means a couple minutes in the hot sun, and the wax itself is gone. What are left behind are the oils and solvents, which are responsible for the look anyways. Unfortunately, the protection is gone.

9) The actual cost (in the bottle and labeled) is close to $2.00-$3.00 dollars per can (more for Zymol because of the larger sizes and glass containers), but the actual ingredient cost is less than a dollar.

10) Meguiars' has stated that anything over 17% percent carnauba wax in the blend is marketing, because that is as much as can be expected to bond to the pores of the paint. The rest is wiped away with your towel.

I worked with a product engineer (I was working on my own blend) which is why I know this. Take it for what its worth, its just information from somebody who had considered coming out with his own line of waxes and did the research.

The most important thing to remember is that 90-95 percent of the gloss in your paint comes from the preparation, not the wax or sealant.

 

Let me add to this some more...

If your car is frequently waxed and not exposed to the environment often, then a carnauba wax will work great.

If you absolutely love the shine of carnauba wax (the wetness and depth of the oils) then stick to what works for you.

I offer several carnauba waxes for my clients, so here are my opinions on some of the ones I use often/offer.

P21S- Great looking wax, esp. on silver and lighter colors.

Pinnacle Souveran- Amazingly deep shimmer on darker colors, very wet looking.

Collonite- An insulator wax with small carnauba content will last 5-6 months. Very bright and glossy (not deep and dark).

P21S 100%- Newest offering, the only wax in the world (to my knowledge) that uses only carnauba wax in the blend (most others use a blend of other waxes in small concentrations). Looks amazing.

Zymol Royale- The big daddy, 8000 dollars a tub. It is the best looking wax I have ever seen (again the differences are small) but I have clients who wish for this product to be used exclusively.

 

Paul actually has sworn off Zymol because of the high silcone content, and now uses his own waxes.

 

I saw this wax. Since it comes with a lifetime resupply, I think we should do a group
buy and share the supply! Only 280 fchatters and we can get the stuff for $25 each.

 

Todd, What are your thoughts on these two? I like Swax but as it is a polymer like Klasse ( correct?) is its finish different to a wax?

 

Hi Mike, if I understand the question, you are asking if it looks different then a wax?

In general, most sealants tend to be glossier, clearer, and more reflective. The older sealants used to look almost "plastic" in appearance. I would classify Klasse as an old sealant, it is very glossy, but even with multiple coats of KSG, it still looks sterile compared to modern sealants.

In general, most waxes tend to be deeper, and have almost a shimmer to them.

In general, once again, sealants tend to last longer then waxes, and hold their look much longer as well. There are exceptions to every rule, but long lasting, great looking sealants like Zaino last 6-9 months (longer on garage kept cars, with no degradation of appearance) where as a great looking wax like Swissvax Concorso would be hard pressed to garner more than 4 weeks in a similar climate.

Now as sealants have become more popular, many companies started to "chase" that deep carnauba look. Products like Menzerna FMJ, Meguiars NXT and #21, Wolfgangs, etc all are sealants that have a very wet look, but suffer in durability. These products are heavy in some of the very same oils that make carnauba waxes look so deep, which effected the linking of their polymers and thus shortened the life of the product.

Meguiars NXT is a perfect example of a store bought sealant (although Meguiars labels it as a wax) that really looks amazing, and can compete with any product in terms of looks. But because it is so oil heavy, it has been prone to streaking, and its durability is rather poor. So it is a sealant that performs like a wax, with the pros and the cons of a wax.

Now, on the other hand, if you remove the oils from carnauba wax you get products similar to sealants. Meguiars #16 and Collonite #845 are two old school carnauba waxes that are extremely durable. However, they also have a glossier, more reflective finish as opposed to the deeper, more traditional carnauba wax.

Now from a marketing perspective, carnauba waxes, despite their short coming are easier to charge more for, then a sealant. There is something more romantic about hand rubbing your fine vehicle's finish with a coat of natural wax and drinking a glass of fine wine as you admire your effort, as opposed to applying a sealant, which is in comparison, sterile feeling. This is the problem, with Deep SWAX.

Deep SWAX lasts twice as long as any high end, oil based carnauba that I have use, and looks just as good, if not slightly better. However, it doesn't have the longevity of super sealants like Klasse/Zaino, it still lasts much longer then a wax would in a similar climate. However, people will spend the money (up 8gs for a tub of Zymol that cost probably $3.00 to make) but will not spend more than 30 dollars on a more expensive sealant, because it lacks the romance. Even if the sealant performs better, which Deep SWAX does in my view.

So it’s a product that is far too good for its price range (based on its performance) but suffers from a stigma. We all like to "make love" to our cars, and its hard to with a synthetic based product.

Also, another benefit to Deep SWAX is that you can layer it, one coat is good, two coats are better, and three coats are beyond amazing. You cannot do this as well with a carnauba, because the solvents in the carnauba act to soften the previous coat, and the mechanical action of applying remixes the a majority of the previous coat back into suspension, which is wiped away after the product has hazed.

I have spoken with and have agreed to test several products for Scott Kennedy (who is the formulator behind Deep SWAX but is no longer with the company). He is working hard on several different, new sealants AND carnauba waxes that he has told me will blow Deep SWAX away. Should be interesting though...

 

Interesting information about HD Cleanse. I have been using it and it is a great product.

Please explain the problem with silicone and how it gets through the paint and "leaches" into the metal panels.

 

Hi John, to my knowledge, silicone cannot penetrate paint (though I could be wrong). However, certain silicones can leech into the metal's pours. This was explained to me by Sal Zaino, who at one time was considered amongst the best painters in the nation and has had several cars on the cover of Hot Rod in the mid '80s.

In an area prone to chipping (behind the rear wheels, front end, etc) or anywhere where bare metal is exposed is where the greatest risk of this happing. When the painter goes to repaint the car, he will not be able to remove the silicone from those areas, and the paint will "fish eye" or bubble over time. This was a common problem in the late '80s and early ‘90s as many of the car care products featured harmful silicone. Armor All was actually famous for this (even though it was on interior dressing vs. wax) and many dashboards cracked because of the silicone they used. They long changed formulas, but are still stuck with that stigma.
Many companies moved away from silicones (including in their waxes/sealants) because of this.

The mid to late 90's saw a boom in car detailing with the advent of the internet amongst enthusiasts (who could now share information). This has led to car care companies popping up all over the place to get an edge in an industry where the net profits are close to two billion dollars, yearly. With the sudden increase in competition, many companies reintroduced silicones back into their products to keep up with the upstart companies which where using silicone (since it is cheap and produces a great shine).

Regarding HD-Cleanse I can site my source directly from Meguiars (in PMs) and its actually common knowledge amongst pro's and enthusiast. I can also tell you my personal experience with trying to remove certain silicone based products from paint (including HD-cleanse) or trying to polish out defects in the paint on cars with silicone based products on them. The compound will actually hydroplane (for lack of a better term) on the silicone, which makes defect removal an extremely long and costly job. Its like washing Vaseline off your hands, you think you have it all, and then you realize it’s just smeared around.

 

As usual your expertise and threads are always so informative - I was betwixt and between Klasse and Swax but I think I'm going to stay with Swax particularly as you think that a 3rd coat will make the finish even better!