WOLFGANG.....WHERE ARE YOU??

Why english Wlfgang? i think that you are german, isn´t it? German and French are the most spoken languagges in continental Europe, next italian and Spanish, i think that the great difference between Europe and USA is our History, our old monuments and all our different languagges, please not surrender, our languagges are very important for our cultures. regards.

 

When the issue of different language forums war raised, I was definitely against. For a while I thought I could have been wrong, but facts proved me (and many others) right. Patrick put this in the correct terms: no more general threads worth reading in the "European" section since a while
It cannot be a community if someone cannot understand the language spoken by others. And English has been THE language of this forum since the beginning.
I think I am a minority but... I liked this site better before.
Ciao
Eugenio

 

The reason is in your answer. You speak English, Wolfgang does, I do etc etc.
We can interact in English, we cannot do it, say, in German...
Ciao
Eugenio

 

Alex... SO well said...
But a lot of you guys allready know my oppinion on this matter!!!

The new language sub forums is like this:
In Denmark we get a lot of people moving in from e.g. the middle east.... they get together in small groups or gethos.... that way they feel comfortable and secure within their own language...
But what happens??? they won't get together with the Danish people... and a lot of missunderstandings grows.....

Hmm sort of the same here...

I would LOVE to meet you guys out there... Deil or somewhere else...
A lot of Fchatters knows that in the past, Carsten and I often did a 800+ km trip for LESS than a weekend... just to meet great people....

But somehow it has stopped... now we only meet with those that we have known since good old "bonkers" time!!! Because... and only because that we don't know you guys and don't know what you are talking about

It's like getting to a party where you know NOBODY!! or where everybody speaks russian.....

You guys talk a lot in your own language in here.. share stories... share meetings etc etc etc.... so when you guys finally meet... you remember back during a year of talking in here... but in YOUR language...
So when I arrive... your'e all like strangers

That's why I personally miss old days with less language threads... we all knew eachother... we shared a lot... both Fcar related or private... and there was never a problem to get enough people for at driveout or a weekends arrangement!!! Just ask old bonkers people!!

This was just my 25 cent I really miss a lot of you guys and would wish that I knew what was happening in Ferrari- Europe at the moment... but I don't

 

I have to agree with most others from the old "European" section I guess.......noone want's to go that far for only one day to meet people who almost "only" post in their native language in their "native language threads"!!! If everybody posted in English like in the "Good old days", everyone would know each other better, and would be more tempted to show up at an event in Holland to meet with people they knew from here! Tina and I also joined the first meeting at your place Henk, but except from Mark Pautz, Simon and ourselves, I think we were the only ones who did not speak or understand Dutch at that meeting!!! It's just no fun to be with a bunch of guys who speak fluently together in their own language, and then a small group who does not!!!
In the "good old days" we all knew how to have a fun time together either here at Fchat, or at some event without speaking other languages than English......those were the days......and I miss them!!!!
For the future, I guess we will only go to Holland and Belgium to see our beloved personal friends from the good old days when this place was a true European community!

 

You're sooooo right!!!

 

Well, things are not exactly as you people think.

With the huge growth of the dutch forum things became a mess.
Over 100/120 posts a day in the cold winter months. People were blaming that it was a mess, not a line in the story, all different things mixed up etc.

So what also happened, someone started fchat.eu, a copy of this site built with the same Vbulletin programm. This made me and other people more consious that we needed to do something as we didn't like to see the people/friends disappear.

I am about 2 years here now and I can remember the days with "zero" posts in the dutch area in 24hrs. And there were A LOT of those days. Really nothing happened.
Slowly by slowly the community was growing until the group we have now.
Don't blame some of them that their idea of Ferrari Fun is more like driving with a group of Ferrari's in the weekend than making a post in an international forum about some matter. If I look in the French and Spanish threads there is a lot of activity also. Not all of them will have time left to go abroad either..?

Someone just made clear that is has been a long time ago since there was an interesting post in the Europe forum. Well, I guess we're ALL guilty about that and we can ALL do someting about it, nothing to do with a dutch forum.
Hey, did you look at the map of Europe ? We're about the smallest country !

I remember now the nice posts from Hedge about his new 512TR and our polish friend with his 328-trip to Poland, everybody reacted from everywhere

All dutch people speak english and german, but for a lot of spanish and french people it will be tough to write in english I think.

Some of you always refer to "the good ole days" when nothing was happening here (1,5/2 years ago), is it now really worse ?

I love Ferrarichat.com, I log in 25 times a day....

 

Now and then this topic comes up.

Allways F-chatters with quite some history who remember 'the good old days'. Fact is that you couldn't persuade enough members with the contents of your topics in the Europe section to stay out of the language threads. They simply liked the language threads more. Now the oldies even admit that they themselves can't keep the europe section interesting for themself.

I guess it's, like always, a matter of supply and demand.

As for me, it's easier to express yourself in your native language, much faster aswell. I made some friends over here that I see very often. Nothing beats meeting people that share the same passion IRL. Mere distance makes that more difficult with other european enthousiasts.

So stop crying about the good old past. And show us the advantages of a european community. If you can't convice us, that's because our tastes differ, you can't change that by closing the language threads.

This is internet not the former sovjet union ("we know what is good for you").

 

Sorry, I find this letter quite dumb and offensive.

First: I am not crying: I am only expressing an opinion. A Community, just to exist, must share a language.
Second: This was a place where meeting new people, even from distant places. Andermatt, Scotland and Tuscany Rally is the proof of this. In order to be able to do that, you need to interact and, guess what, in order to interact you need to speak the same language.
Third: It seems to me that to prevent other people from understanding what you are writing is more Soviet Union than sharing your thought.
Fourth: I do not know what the level is in the dutch forum, I cannot understand what is in it, but in the "Italian room" the level is going down hill, and on this you must perhaps trust me as, likely, you do not speak Italian as well as I do not speak Dutch.

So, I am just expressing my idea, in English (not my native language), because I am happy to share it with everyone. If many other people want to keep their thoughts restricted to group of "friends", cutting everyone else off by the means of language barrier (very nice, not at all like soviet Union...), well that is their privilege. Just do not ask me to say it is the better way.
Regards

 

I agree! I also remember (Tina; Carsten!) the great meeting at the Hockenheim Ring... lot's of Ferraris, Lamborghinis and... a lot of non-owners from FerrariChat.com all together... I remember it very well and still love it ... the day that we all sat together at diner; Denmark, Norway, Belgium, Holland, Germany and more all at one table, speaking in English...

btw I was the original starter of the 'Dutch' thread. At those days some chatters just wanted to express themselves in there own language. But... it used to be a 'fun' thread, just like the Bonkersthread. All Ferrari-related items were put in the 'normal' English section. And that is how it supposed to be at an English (American) forum.

just my 0,02 cents, I'm not crying, just hoping the good old days return!

 

Excactly right Waldo!!!
The reason I joined Fchat in the first place, was that here it seemed that everyone who shared their passion knew each other CROSS the borders, and all and everyone having fun sharing the same poor English, and actually this shared language gave everyone sort of a mutual feeling of being friends or brothers sharing also the passion for their Ferraris or other automobiles!
This forum is IMHO supposed to be a meeting point and a place to share your passion with people in an international forum, and not just in a Dutch or German or French or whatever community! There would be no reason for me or for anyone else to join a forum where you don't know or understand the spoken language.....it just wouldn't make any sense! Imagine 12 or 13 different nations meeting at some event, without understanding each other........it would make no sense at all! I for one do not go to a meeting just to see other cars......I want to meet the owners, and to have a nice talk with them, and to do that, I need to understand the owner or the guy to whom I wanted to speak! There is a lot of nice guys in the Dutch forum that I would love to meet (I think) but I just don't get to know them good enough to want to meet them, as many of them almost exclusively post in their own language.....a language that I don't understand! When I joined the forum this was not a problem, because it was not a Dutch or french or german forum.........guess what, it was a "European community" where everybody shared their thoughts and passion in "THE SAME LANGUAGE"
I don't mind the different language threads at all, they just should not take over on the cost of the international "English spoken Foums"!
I would have a lot easier to explain my thoughts if I posted them in my native Danish language, but then they would make no sense to you guys, now would they????

 

Modena Days 07/2004!! I'll never forget that meeting!!!
Meeting Tina, Carsten, Wolfgang, Paul, Merete and others for the first time IRL! Me and Alex driving up there all those kms for just one day (in Alex his Bravo at that time, we were awake for more then 24 hours! Even Bart, Bel360 joined us in his 360), but it was worth it
I made friends for life!

@ Henkie: this doesn't mean i'll ever forget the Deilmeeting! In fact they are also international especially the first! But i wonder why the next meetings didn't attract people who speak other languages......
Again: the Deilmeetings are awesome, but if there weren't language threads, would you think there wouldn't be any Deilmeetings?? I have a feeling they would still exist and even attract more international people Reading Carsten's and others posts here says it all

Guy

 

As this item comes up again in my email (reply of someone) I feel like giving a response again. But for the last time from my side (who cares?)

Guy, I only invited everybody to my house from the EU forum because I want to share the fun to all. As you know I do it all for charity, it only costs me money. Don't think that I feel bad because there are no people from certain countries. It is or "yes, please!" or "no, not for me". Full is full. And I am full as you know with the 32 cars and over 50 people ! If there is someone who was trying to get the EU people r e a l closer together then it was me !

For me the dutch forum is an additional forum to the Europe one. And if there are people who think that the quality of posts in the Europe forum is poor then do something about it.
But like most people you think that the thing you want to post has no "european value" so you don't go further than your small group of people in the so called bonkers thread.

My experience with the other language threads is that if you jump in with a question on a German / French / Spanish topic in english everybody is responding in english right away, like it should be.

I agree also as said before that the level of new threads in the EU forum is poor. Mostly I see things like "where to go in Amsterdam" "Where to go in Berlin" "Where to rent a car bla bla bla" Not to mention starting a thread about someone's birthday in big digits with 3 pages, come on....

And I will never bother you anymore with a meeting "sticking" at the top of your EU forum for months. (Will make it "un" sticky right away and it will slooooowly disappear)

So, let's see if we can get that EU forum a bit on the right track again. And stop this endless discussion. Use the energy for an interesting new thread.

 

Good reply, my italian rock!

Just to make it clear again: English language is THE KEY.
It provides access to information around F-cars for all of us.
If we refuse to use it, the Europe section will become meaningless.
Then it's just a part of the technical FChat webserver path-structure.

It' so simple. The FChat board is not the right place for this bunch of national language subdivisions.
The sweet poison of comfortzone language threads makes people drifting apart,
whereas Europe was founded to bring people together.

Do you take your time crawling all the different language threads day by day?
("ale dość rzadko się niestety udzielają. Z bardziej aktywnych" ..... hä? what?)

If you like to chat in greek, swedish, dutch or french etc., please do it somewhere else - not on FChat.
Wonna post Ferrari related topics? Then come back, do it HERE and share it. In english. Move into the center, not to the edges.
This way we'll get more interesting topics back on the surface, where they belong.
Guess this is most important pre-condition to attract great people like Wolfgang. (miss you buddy)
If not, we'll see other great members going too.
One day we would count more language threads than F-cars here.

As I remember, a year ago the discussion about new language threads was going on.
Some people have been fine with them, so they were started. (in good hope they don't hurt)
But I say: It's poison. Close them all.

cinque




PS:

- Sorry for 'polemic' way of expession here and there in advance.
- I don't like to see a huge dutch crowd splitted off.
- Lot of crap should be moved to FChat section "Other Off Topic".
- I've never posted in the bonker's thread.

 

Your idea is not so good as you might think. You have no clue how many people will be gone if the language forums stop. And for a Ferrari forum you need also people with Ferrari's, knowing where they're talking about and sharing their passion and impressions. And there are a lot of people who prefer to spend their time on this site to fellow countryman instead only.

Gladfully Fchat is an open democratic community and everybody has it's own opinion what is the best for the site. More people is more info and more pics etc. I am glad that there are a lot of people WITH Ferrari's in the dutch forum nowadays, there's activity the whole week. 2 Years ago it was dead.

The unique way to get the EU forum on a higher level is to make it interesting, so do your best !

It are always the same 5 people talking about the good old days.
Remember that all threads were closed about the language issues ?
We ALL voted and the big majority wanted language threads. So we voted democratically and this should close the endless discussion. Realize that there are people who simply don't care so much about the other countries than the Fchatters they see for real on a regular base. That's their idea of fun. We all have to accept that.

 

Henkie,
I do not know if you are wright or wrong. I just remind you to look at the top of the page: you will read:

FerrariChat.com the online Ferrari community

Simply this is not a single community any more, there are many, and you and I do not belong to the same. This is sad, and has nothing to with the "old days", it is a today's fact.
Again, I am just sorry to realise that many people that are potentially great people simply do not care to talk to me because I am not their fellow countryman (your words). This simply is the death of the "European" section, giving birth to many national sub forums.
Majority wins, but not aways the majority is right...
Ciao
Eugenio

 

I'm so sorry mr moderator, but Cinque is so dead on right! If you had only been arround in "the good old days" you would know that we are not talking BS here!
What is most important.....To have many posts, pictures etc in numerous language threads that the majority does not care for or understand, or to have many posts and pics in a common language (English)that most or everybody can understand???
If I posted everything in my native Danish, you probably couldn't care less about what it was all about......only the very limited bunch of people that understand my language would benefit or be able to read what I posted!
For "us" (The same five people) this place used to be all about sharing a passion with other enthusiasts internationally(and not just owners........yes, non-owners can be very nice people too!!!) but also to have and to become new friends sharing the same passion! (I guess this must have grown old fashioned by now)
How can it be interesting for the majority to see only threads that is posted in foreign languages??? That's just not the right key to shake people together, but perhaps to drift them apart!!! The only key is to understand each other! I clearly understand that it is interesting to meet fellow Dutch, German or French people who shares your passion, but how come it is not interesting to share with a wider range of people.......like for example the rest of Europe???
Which group is the largest and most interesting and important group......The Dutch group, the German group, the French group......or the European group????
Which group is capable of posting the most interesting and important threads.......the Dutch group, the German group, the French group....... or the European group????
Which group would attract the most readers and replies and the most interest......the Dutch group, the German group, the French group..... or the European group????
Sadly, unlike in the old days, this "Europe" place has been split into a bunch of small groups of "national" people, where all and everybody is living in their own little "national language bubbles" instead of sharing with the rest of the community! It's just such a shame in my point of view!!!

 

Friends,

We had this discussion over and over again in the past! Let's leave it where we left it. Things change over time. So did Fchat!
Forget about it!

Ton