Why are Mercedes so successful? | FerrariChat

Why are Mercedes so successful?

Discussion in 'F1' started by Igor Ound, Aug 10, 2020.

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?

?

  1. Toto Wolff

    36.9%
  2. Lewis Hamilton

    24.6%
  3. They spend more than the others

    43.1%
  4. Their cheats go unpunished

    27.7%
  5. They don’t work from Italy

    15.4%
  6. Not so much pressure on them winning

    3.1%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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  2. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

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    Went with the first 3 , the last three are sour grapes,whereas Merc have created a kind of fine wine.;)
     
  3. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    Toto is the most talented team principal since Ross Brawn
     
  4. classic308

    classic308 F1 Veteran

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    The reason is they successfully laid the groundwork for the hybrid era long before the formula took effect in 2014. Combine their long preparation time with the testing and development ban and there you have it. Competition was stymied. When Ferrari were dominating the FIA kept changing the rules. Here MB is allowed to dominate with the help of the FIA and Pirelli. Remember 2018 when Pirelli changed the tires to help MB’s blistering issues? It’s ridiculous really.
     
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  5. doug_porsche

    doug_porsche Karting

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    like the old saying.
    Luck favors the prepared.

    I, yes even for the last 5 years, am a dedicated Mclaren fan.

    Mclaren is getting better prepared, but have some distance to go.
    I have seen Ferrari, in recent years, hand the race to Mercedes-Benz due to questionable race strategy.
    I have seen Mercedes-Benz win races because they had the people in place (prepared) to adjust their race strategy.
    This week I saw RB win because they were prepared. They knew they didn't have the fastest car, but started preparing (for example) during qualifying by using a different tire.
     
  6. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    How bout ALL OF THE ABOVE???
     
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  7. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Very good organisation with competent management, superior engineering, strong budget, mostly faultless operational skills, strong strategy, good choice of drivers, quiet atmosphere, some political weight at the FIA, all that makes a very good recipe for Mercedes to dominate.
    I don't think that will be the case if some key personel were to move.
    Other teams could do well to analyse the reasons of Mercedes success.
     
  8. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

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    Toto Wolff is a top team manager.
    During three years Ross Brawn has build deep strong basis , an efficient way of working.
    On top of this efficiency I suspect a financial investment at least twice more than the others top team since the beginning.
    Add a dominant political power and you have more than 80 percent of victory since 2014.
     
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  9. Frank_C

    Frank_C F1 Rookie
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    #9 Frank_C, Aug 11, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 11, 2020
    I’d say blame Todt for having ruined Formula 1. But really blame the person who leaked Max’s S&M tape to give Todt the opportunity to ruin the sport.

    Yes, the Germans pulled a fast one not only in getting their plug and play V6 hybrid rubber stamped, but more so in the advantage given with the contemporaneous rules limiting their competitors’ ability to respond. (The former not disputed, the latter certainly sottovoce)

    And yes, the Italian arrogance allowed them to take the bait thinking they were/are capable of mastering a new engine formula. But shame on them and rest of the teams in not foreseeing the lack of development and testing effect on being able to respond.

    You had one chance to get it right and if you didn’t you couldn’t dig yourself out of that hole. Huge error when changing a formula. It’s not the same as going from a NA 12 to 10 to 8 cylinders. This is going from one type of power unit to another, not one engine to another. History had already shown it took what 3 years to get turbos right? One team got their already developed concept rubber stamped and look what happened.

    Not only did this misguided path of cost savings fail to diminish costs initially (or at all) but over the course of the years ruined the sport. The proverbial rubber band around the balls. The tokens, the lack of testing, the endless reliability hurdles- what is it now each engine needs to last 3 seasons or is it 3 calendar years? Moronic- slowly but surely the balls fell off.

    Todt had already cut their balls off, why acquiesce to further evisceration? Now after several more years of said lunacy we have a horse with no back legs.

    Todt’s other error was to go down the path of common parts instead of customer cars. This is where he has killed Formula One. And I say killed because the poison has been administered and now it is a waiting game as (out of ignorance) the current owners have bought into the premise of making all the cars look the same for the sake of competition- after all it works for Indy and NASCAR and they have to make up billions........

    Customer cars was the better solution- this would allow not only for the big teams (not necessarily just the big 3) to sell their cars to offset the balance sheet but exponentially reap the rewards on their R&D dollars. Further, more teams would be able to go racing- some can pick up a $25M Williams in lieu of a $50M Ferrari season.

    Don’t get me wrong they also got their basic car concept correct and all they’ve had to do over the years is just tweak it here and there without having to change the basic means in which the center of pressure is managed (I won’t get into the whole Lewis argument as indeed he is among the best). But again the emasculated rules has left other mfg to throw crap (literally and figuratively) against the wall and see what sticks. Only Newey seems to have figure out how to seal the floor without a drastic drag penalty.......


    Bernie and Max would not have allowed this folly to happen.

    No, Formula One now sucks and it will continue to suck until its inevitable death. Thanks Jean and thanks to the bastard who outed Max.




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  10. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
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    Mercedes winning is in the script....
     
  11. TonyL

    TonyL F1 Rookie

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    Totally agree with all you have said but the last bit, MM was steering a path to the hybrid era and cost cutting which is where we are today. He did a lot (safety) and was certainly better than Balestre

    There are no special talents at the FIA as far as i am concerned, i thought Brawn would of added something to the recipe but alas he seems like a neutered pup. Unfortunately looking from within they dont see the problems.

    100% - F! is dead in the water regardless of who is winning, the buzzing bees in Formulae E is more entertaining imo

    Best

    tony
     
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  12. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Regarding Max Mosley: so much for the cost cutting.:rolleyes:

    Regarding Formula E: no.........no......no Formula E.
     
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  13. TonyL

    TonyL F1 Rookie

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    Its on its way :) personally i hate it
     
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  14. SimCity3

    SimCity3 F1 Rookie

    British design.
    British engineering.
     
  15. SimCity3

    SimCity3 F1 Rookie

    That'll be a certain Mr R Murdoch.
    Also responsible for Brexit, but let's not go there.

    At least Max counter-punched and gave Rupert a bloody nose. More than most people would dare
     
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  16. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
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    A pact with Satan.

    Apart from that, I suppose that many things contribute, but the short answer (actually the short answer for eveything) should be: MONEY. They could start preparing for the new formula before the others, hired everybody available from the other teams, attracted Hamilton from McLaren, and kept pouring money at the machine to keep it well greased. Of course, you have to know how to spend the money, but without money there is nothing.
     
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  17. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

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    Yes a legendary German brand car entirely build in UK.
    Do you understand why I love Ferrari so much now ?
     
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  18. Frank_C

    Frank_C F1 Rookie
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    Shame it doesn’t translate into road car reliability. Although the one car I truly miss the most is my ‘05 Vanquish S, which I took delivery with valves pinned open.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  19. 635CSI

    635CSI F1 Rookie

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    If it helps, my 03 SL55 AMG was incredibly un-reliable.
     
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  20. Frank_C

    Frank_C F1 Rookie
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    Funny you say that I went to trade in my ‘04 SL 55 on a DB9 when the salesman asked if I wanted to drive the Vanquish. Pushing that damned start button cost me 100k........

    After nearly 30 years I swore off MB after my last go around. My ‘05 S 550 coupe was a dog with fleas....never again.


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  21. johnireland

    johnireland F1 Veteran
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    They do it better than anyone else.
     
  22. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    But you are supposed to love Renault !!! ;)
     
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  23. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

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    Enstone, famous french countryside city..
     
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  24. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

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    Well, at least the engines are made in France.

    I think part of the engine work of Mercedes is still made in Germany.
     
  25. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
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    :D:D:D
     

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