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who owns #52385

Discussion in '365 GT4 2+2/400/412' started by kliko312, Jul 25, 2010.

  1. Sham701

    Sham701 Rookie

    Feb 26, 2018
    6
    Full Name:
    Steve Hamilton
    I am new to this group but does anybody know if Jan Graaf ( Kliko 312) is still active with this group? Thanks. Just got the car and am a fanatic for originality so these books are the Holy Grail. Steve
     
    rubenpadron likes this.
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  3. roger21

    roger21 Formula Junior

    Aug 13, 2015
    262
    France
    Full Name:
    Stéphane
    Hello Steve!
    Have you tried to contact him directly? (by sending a private message)
    According to his « profile » he was seen on the forum 6 days ago so...
    Good luck!
     
  4. Sham701

    Sham701 Rookie

    Feb 26, 2018
    6
    Full Name:
    Steve Hamilton
    I am new to this site but I will try that. I saw the six days ago note but the threads end a year ago. I will try it. Thanks. Steve
     
  5. rubenpadron

    rubenpadron Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2013
    1,043
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ruben
    Welcome, let us know how it goes!

    Also, please post some pics!

    Ruben
     
  6. steved033

    steved033 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Apr 12, 2017
    3,410
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Steve D.
    Great story! I love stuff like this.

    sjd
     
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  8. Sham701

    Sham701 Rookie

    Feb 26, 2018
    6
    Full Name:
    Steve Hamilton
    Great car, have just got it going after buying it a few days ago. The fellow with the documents/manuals after being very active dropped off this site a year ago so something must have happened but no responses from him or threads in a year so i think the chances are remote. Steve
     
  9. omd78

    omd78 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 26, 2005
    12,563
    Breda, Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Martin
    He is, just posted in the Dutch section a few days ago.

    Gr. Martin
     
  10. Sham701

    Sham701 Rookie

    Feb 26, 2018
    6
    Full Name:
    Steve Hamilton
    I think it was a few days ago but 2017 as the year
     
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  11. Sham701

    Sham701 Rookie

    Feb 26, 2018
    6
    Full Name:
    Steve Hamilton
    So miracles do happen, Kliko312 has been found and like the true enthusiast he is, he was still saving the manuals and documentation for my car. We have worked out a beneficial scheme whereby he gets a manual set for his car and mine is restored to its rightful serial number. i can not thank him enough for saving these all of these years and to all of you for helping me find him. It is the best of this hobby at work with quality people. Thank you all so much. Steve
     
    larryg, Ashman, rubenpadron and 2 others like this.
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  13. bjwhite

    bjwhite F1 Rookie

    Mar 17, 2006
    4,046
    Seattle, WA
    Full Name:
    Brian White
    Outstanding! Love it. I wish I could find the Warranty booklet for my car.
     
  14. roger21

    roger21 Formula Junior

    Aug 13, 2015
    262
    France
    Full Name:
    Stéphane
    Yeah!! Wonderful story
     
  15. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jan 21, 2004
    1,702
    Argent/Brasil
    Full Name:
    Guido
    I wonder WHY it is so difficult to leave those books, warrantys, toolkits etc... with the car WHEN SOLD !

    Guido
     
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  16. rubenpadron

    rubenpadron Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2013
    1,043
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ruben
    I’ve often wondered the same. I think it may unfortunately boil down to the fact that there’s a market for these things to be sold individually. The buyer can get a couple of extra grand (or potentially way more depending on the F model) by selling them separately from the car. Sad and not worth it IMHO as care takers of these wonderful cars.

    I’m glad car and books were able to be reunited in Steve’s case - congrats to you and Kliko312!

    Ruben
     
  17. Part Time

    Part Time Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 16, 2013
    491
    Port St. Lucie, Fl
    Full Name:
    Gary Shore
    After spending 40+ years in auto dealerships, this issue is widespread across all makes. I cannot calculate how many 100's of basic owners manuals, or manual "kits", (which includes the manual + tire war + radio manual + lemon law + service log + custom bag/folder/pouch ) for customers. Although the last few years have seen many brands change to cd's or even PC downloads, we still ordered many paper copies for our "senior" clients. And, no, I never knew why the books are not in the vehicle when it got traded/sold. Don't even get me started on not having 2 sets of keys for a used car, and telling the sales dept. that it will cost them $200+ to cut and/or program another set. ( Price for "regular cars", not Ferrari keys!! )

    Gary
    PS: Also happy to see the books return to home.
     
  18. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jan 21, 2004
    1,702
    Argent/Brasil
    Full Name:
    Guido
    Is'nt there a legal issue to that fenomen ? I'm not a layer, but I think that holding back those things (they belong to the car) is like stealing from the new owner.
    The seller should be prosecuted !
    People that are offering those things have to proof how they get it (if bought from a former owner that hold it back...remember stealing) is healing...that should be prosecuted !
    People that are bying those things, even in good faith, should know those things belong to a specific car....is healing and should be prosecuted.
    Is'nt there someone from DA or FA prosecution office on this site that thinks the same way I do ?

    Little far-fetched or a good idea to stop this trade !?

    Guido
     
  19. rubenpadron

    rubenpadron Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2013
    1,043
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ruben
    At least in the US, used cars sold by individuals (as well as many dealers) are sold “as is, where is”.

    Ruben
     
  20. Ashman

    Ashman Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Sep 5, 2002
    28,585
    MA
    Full Name:
    John
    Yes, what you see is what you get. Unless the car is offered with books (and tools, and jack) and you verify that they are actually correct and present, there is no obligation of a seller to include any of those things.

    I think some of the missing owner's manuals are because they are kept separate from the car and just mislaid or forgotten while some are probably deliberately (in the case of Ferraris and other high value cars) kept separate because their value is higher when sold separately.

    As for the lack of two sets of keys, this is a mystery to me. Who in their right mind doesn't keep at least two sets of keys for their car, whether it is a Honda or a Ferrari? Not a big deal in the older cars with "dumb" keys that can be replicated for a few small dollars but in this day and age where each key costs $200-300 or more, it is unacceptable.

    Moral of the story: Get very detailed in your understanding of what is and is not included in the price when you buy a car, especially a Ferrari.

    PS: When I bought my 400i, I did a visual inspection of the spare tire but didn't think to check that it actually held air. Turns out it had two nice slashes in the underside sidwall that made a (then) $350 replacement from Coker mandatory. Not a killer but still a pain in the ass cost that I didn't count on. A lesson well learned when I looked years later at used cars for my daughters when they were in college and beyond!
     
  21. kliko312

    kliko312 Karting

    May 21, 2008
    165
    Spain
    Full Name:
    Graaf
    Steve,
    My pleasure. Thank you so much for making this work out as we did. Amazing overall.
    Cheers
     
    roger21 likes this.
  22. jacques

    jacques Formula Junior

    May 23, 2006
    836
    Los Angeles/Florida
    MY 1980 Series1 also has the thin plastic wood-like veneer. Sometime in the not so distant future, I plan to redo my in a very nice wood veneer that I have purchased. With proper effort, it should turn out exquisitely. Jq.
     
  23. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2004
    16,584
    Coolum Beach, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Karen H.
    Short answer - hot market for them outside of the sale of the car... what happens when 'things' become 'investments'...o_O
     
  24. steved033

    steved033 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Apr 12, 2017
    3,410
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Steve D.
    I inadvertently found out my car was spec'd with luggage (from a thread on f-chat, actually), so i contact the guy who sold the car to me, and he's like "yeah, I took it out. it's in my spare room. I'll sell it to you"

    *disappointed face*

    sjd
     
  25. Part Time

    Part Time Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 16, 2013
    491
    Port St. Lucie, Fl
    Full Name:
    Gary Shore
    Well....there you go...NOW you know WHY things like books & tools & jacks/bags & window cranks & extra keys & luggage sets get separated from their rightful cars...


    GREED !!!! $$$$$$ !!!!

    Gary
     
  26. D.J

    D.J Karting

    Mar 17, 2015
    90
    Perth WA
    I guess I was lucky then, I received the two full tool kits, all books minus the pouch and the plastic part that the tool kit sits in.
     
  27. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jan 21, 2004
    1,702
    Argent/Brasil
    Full Name:
    Guido
    :mad:

    I can imagen your feelings after receiving that message....

    Guido
     
  28. steved033

    steved033 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Apr 12, 2017
    3,410
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Steve D.
    for real, even if I'd paid a couple grand more than I wanted and it was included with the car...or if he'd brought it up when I bought the car...(i have a 348, btw), that's a more invisible spend than just chucking 2500-3500 out the window. I've got other stuff to spend that kind of money on....

    sjd
     

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