Which is Faster the 458 or ENZO

Top Gear ran both around their track and the Enzo was only a tenth faster than the 458. On paper they look to be very evenly matched. That being said - you're comparing different technology. Put the 458's electronics/F1 transmission in the Enzo today and it would be an even more amazing machine!

 

In a straight line, the Enzo is much faster. And that's expected being 400 lbs lighter than the 458 with 100 more HP.

Here's the last tests C&D magazine made for the 458 and Enzo. After 15 seconds the 458 is going 140 mph. The Enzo does that in less than 12 seconds.

ENZO:
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What amazes me is the time of the Porsche!

 

I agree. That new Porsche Turbo S is out of this world with a 0-30 of 1.1 second!

Note that its 60-130 time is 8.1 seconds and 60-100 is 3.7 sec, which is not supercar territory. But that 0-60 in 2.7 seconds must be fun! That's Veyron territory.

 

Does "faster" means only "acceleration"? certainly not, so does somebody having the chance to drive both is having an opinion? what about a track test?
Remember that 430 scuderia was supposed to be as quick as the Enzo around a track (even Fiorano), so what about a 458 now?

 

Yes, the ENZO is surely faster, but 3 seconds to 140 mph are not exactly the real difference, expecially if we are talking about factory mule cars, that they are faster. The Enzo factory press car tested by C/D during the Fiorano press day. The 458 press car sent to EVO.uk did 12"9 to 140 mph http://img42.imageshack.us/i/evopmc.jpg/
The 458 tested by C/D is slower because it's a customer car, that's the confirmation what I'm saying from long time.
Take a look even Autocar test about a customer UK 458 http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/6799/90001.jpg

 

I don't think the 458 is faster. It might be just as fast on a short track, but on a long track no contest.
You have to remember tracks like the top gear and ferrari test track are short.

 

Very true. On the Nurburgring:

458 = 7:38
Enzo = 7:25

 

And that's with just few Marc Basseng and Horst Von Saurma's laps. With the same effort of Nissan for their 7.26 of the GT-R (over two years and long time spent in time attack sessions with Suzuki driving) the Enzo is surely able of about 7:10 on the NRing. This tell me about low 7:20 for the 458. No any Driver is able to extract the 10/10ths of these cars with just few laps; but is possible to understand the level of the potential.

 

I agree with 7:10s for the Enzo and 7:20s for the 458. And Marc got 7:26 with the Enzo's suspension leveling system disabled when it overheated.

These times also depend very much on the tires. Most tests try to use the factory stock tires, but I suspect some may use otherwise. The Enzo tire technology is 7 years old, so even 7:10s may be beat if the Enzo had better tires.

I think I can provide an unbiased opinion about the Enzo. (-;

 

All the cars tested by Marc Basseng that day were able to do better lap times with much commitment. Even W.Rorhl recently said that the CGT with new tire technology is surely able to improve 10s from their 7.28, and we all knows that their W.Rorhl attack were not the best of what their car were able to do.
A variable is the track too. Rumors always said that the conditions of that track are very variable during the year, just during the day, and it is difficult to guess the perfect moment for the best lap. This is why Nissan had spent a lot of sessions and over two years for improve form 7.38 to 7.26.

 

Sasha Bert achieved 7.32.9 with the 458 on 20.8 kms lap, while Horst Von Saurma with 7.38 on the 20.6 kms lap version. Just few laps attempt.

 

The Enzo's suspension overheated because it's not designed for extended hard track use and because the Enzo weighs too much.

P 4/5 which weighs 2650 lbs can go longer on than an Enzo on a track before it's suspention overheats but still couldn't run 10/10 laps for an extended period.

The Ring is a Monster and stresses everything. A properly driven car there leaves the ground several times a lap which overwelmed the Enzo's suspention in less than one lap.

The idea that an Enzo could go 7:10 at The Ring is silly.

As an aside changing tires/sizes on an Enzo is no simple thing.

The ECU's have to be reprogramed if the size changes even a micro amount as the TC/and engine managment need very accurate data or they will shut the car down to limp mode.

We changed the wheel and tire size on P 4/5 and used much better tires that the original ones and it took a LOT of electronic re engineering.

 

I realize it's not the intent of the question, but at the end of the day, the 458 is just a 458 (which is fantastic I admit...) but the Enzo, well, it's just in another league. Even when the "special" 458 comes out that is all stripped out with extra tech and lots of carbon and speed quite possibly to beat the Enzo, it will still be lacking. 4 cylinders, if nothing else.

 

They are both great road cars but neither is a race car able to turn lap after lap at 10/10 at The Ring.

 

You just can't shave of 10 seconds of an already damn fast car (that already comes with super sticky tires, great brakes+++) on Nürburgring with minor tweaks ("just change to newer tires"). And after all we're talking about stock cars vs. stock cars when it comes to Nürburgring times, leaving modifications out of the picture.

I would have loved to see a suspension modified Enzo do 7:10 on the ring, but I wouldn't bet on it.

Car is epic, not 7:10 @ Nürburgring epic.

 

A good friend of mine is one of Walter Rohl's friends. He told me that Walter said that the CGT ran more than 10s faster around the NS with a different street tire, and NS oriented suspension; which the factory will never release. Ultimately the reasons for the suspension/tire package they gave were purely for a more compliant ride, and wet weather grip. The CGT is heavier than the Enzo... but was born on the north loop.

 

Should anyone want to see for sure ship your Enzo or 458 over to the Ring or if you live in Europe drive it over and give it a go.

Try any tires you want and set the suspention any way you want.

We'll be testing and racing there next year and if any of you run a 7:10 in your Enzo or a 7:15 in your 458 I'll buy you dinner.

Those are serious numbers. We'll be at 2700lbs and about 424hp. It will be interesting to see what times we run.
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That's what I meant... The sub 7:30 times are already "serious business" and every second down from that requires a functional tweak or two from someone who really knows exactly what they are doing.

***

And just to state it: If you drive the Ring as an amateur and manage sub 9 minute time in any performance car, you're good. Being an amateur and trying to beat the 8 minute mark requires gigantic testicles because the speed vs. surprising corners gets frightening, no matter how big your brakes are and how much grips your car has.
This is the speed you're going through and the skills you need to break the 8:00 mark: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdGoFhs1pf4 There is not much room for error.
Now, imagine blind corners like the Cork Screw at Laguna Seca (watch this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edhBvCunbkE) all the time (see the clips and how he struggles to attach the Cork Screw at full throttle) - that's the Ring for you.

 

All TRUE.

Best

 

Lap times on NS, or any track are interesting, but partially pointless. Yes, it can lap in 7:[xx], but only with [insert amazing race driver here] driving in those conditions.

 

True. That's why were entering the 24 Hours of Nurburgring.

Endurance racing interests me more than Time Attack.

 

It's far more exciting- especially with night time racing.

Best of luck!

 

It's incredible what can be achieved through endurance racing today, from both car and driver

But I guess we can't really discredit the old days now can we, like Luigi Chinetti in the 166M