VP Racing C12 Fuel

Any reason for the change? It would be expensive to run high quality racing fuel all of the time, and you would want to tune specifically for it to get some value for money. A blend to increase octane is possible but surely there is pump gas available in your area that would be a cheaper alternative or are you doing it because of the leaded fuel aspect?

 

Though I have personally not had any problems with ethanol fuels in Central Illinois, I can document many problems with this fuel blend in other parts of the country. Going to C12 is probably overkill for the Countach. If you can find a source for non-ethanol pump gas in your area, that should be all you need for both good running and storage stability.

 

112 octane is likely too high for the compression ratio. It can make starting more difficult as the higher the octane, the more stable the fuel is and the stronger the spark required to fire it. 100 octane will be cheaper and perfectly adequate. Lead was used in fuel to lubricate valves and particularly valve seats that were not hardened to protect from valve seat recession. Substitutes are available for unleaded non ethanol fuels which prevents the micro welding that causes the valve seat recession. Modern seats are now all hardened.

Italian Fuel lines and crossover connection hoses from the 1980’s were not designed for ethanol fuels and while looking perfectly fine on the outside can fail catastrophically resulting in engine bay fires. It is why so many 80’s and 90’s cars burned as fuel tanks and lines were contained in tightly packaged mid engine configuration.

Change to new hoses if this has not been done in the cars maintenance history. Small carb hoses can fail and if shut off quickly enough, the car can generally be saved. If the fill connector hose fails after filling the tank, the splashing on top of the engine can result in the total loss of the car. Sorry to go off on this tangent when you were just asking about fuel type, but the results of ignoring fuel lines on this era car, especially if has been running ethanol fuel can be tragic for the car. Driver is generally able to escape so they can watch something they care about and is valuable to them burn to the ground.

 

Have you been using 93 octane E10? (or has it been tuned for that?)

If so you will need to recalibrate slightly for C12 which is 14.79 stoich vs 14.13 for pump E10. (and really no need for C12) C9 would work and still be higher octane than needed.

I don't have a Countach sadly but have ran E10 93 octane in my carbureted 1959 Cadillac for the past 10 years and never had an issue. Gets driven a couple thousand miles a year and stored in the winter.

I would flush the system out with ethanol free fuel if it was going to be stored for a very long time but haven't seen any issues with the way I use the car.

 

Suggest you consider Sunoco Race Fuels. They have a huge range of products, all available in the same five gallon pails. And several of them are specifically designed for vintage vehicles with shelf life of two years or more. I can attest to the fact that the higher octane fuels make vintage engines harder to start. But once they start, they run beautifully. And that smell….ahhhh…

 

Didn't the said "expert" provide sufficient answer or don’t you trust him/her sufficiently ?
Just curious.

 

I use Sunoco Standard leaded 110 in my 1963 Jag and my 1967 Ferrari 330 GTC. The float bowls of the carbs stay incredibly. No crap in the fuel tanks. No water anywhere in the system.

The Ferrari starts without issue, but the Jag needs a bit of cranking even though they live in an HVAC’d garage and so are never below 65 degrees F when starting. Difference between Weber and SU carbs? I don’t know. But they both run well on Standard 110. Necessary? No. Expensive? Yes. A year ago I could get Standard 110 (at a fuel pump about 30 minutes away - I take five gallon containers and fill them) for $10/gal or about $13/gal in pails. Now it’s $17/gal at the pump and approx $21/gal in pails.

I use the race gas to avoid ethanol. And I like the idea of leaded fuel since that’s what the car originally ran on. Realistically, they will run just fine on 93 E10 pump gas, but I would then feel the need to drain the fuel and replace it with non-ethanol fuel for any storage.

I prefer the Sunoco Surge 105 but I can only get it in pails and while $17/gal sucks, $21/gal is worse, plus I have to special order Surge as no one locally stocks it.

Bottom line is that the cars run very clean on the race gas with the only issue being the cost of the gas and inconvenience of not filling the cars at the local Sunoco station which is less than 10 minutes from the house.

I can tell you that Ralph Lauren’s collection of vintage cars run exclusively on “CAM2” race fuel. I was lucky enough to visit his collection many years ago, and the curator at the time stated that they only use non-ethanol race gas so they don’t have to drain ethanol fuel for long term storage. They’ve never had a problem with using race gas. That’s a pretty decent endorsement if you ask me.

 

Those of you who buy by the pail, how do you store it? I don’t have racing/unleaded fuel available at the pump, but I do have access to pail purchases about an hour away. Thanks.

 

Hmmm…don’t know why my profile would show up as restricted as other reach me via PM with no issues? I’ll check my settings.

I buy at the pump at Zoom Fuel in Damascus. They used to be Fast Fuel.

9871 Main Street
Damascus, MD 20872

You can use a credit or debit card at the pump. They also have 100 octane, but it has ethanol.

 

I store it in the garage. It’s gas vapors that are explosive and I never have a partially filled can/jug in the garage. I leave the empty cans outside for a few hours to allow any remaining gas (we’re talking a tablespoon at most) to evaporate and then seal them back up. If using cans, I take the empties to recycling station. I reuse the plastic jugs. It is a temperature controlled garage so the fuel never gets hot. And I’ve never smell gas in the garage (well, there was that time when one of the SU carbs started dripping….that was fun).

 

When you click on the member’s name and the little black box pops up, you can still send a message, even though access to his profile page is limited, by clicking on “start a conversation.”

 

Don’t run the C12. I use it in my old Ducati 888 corsa as it works with the high compression, but if you leave it in the bike after riding, it wrecks many components in the fuel system. After use at the track I drain it and run pump gas through the bike for a bit. C12 will wreck your Countach fuel system.

I run ethanol free shell super in my LP400S in Toronto which works great, and 100 octane super in my LP5000S in Bologna with no issues.

 

correction

 

Thanks for clarifying. As I said, I was just curious.
And no, I don’t have experience with Lamborghini engines or necessity of high octane racing fuels in them.
All my experiences are on road use cars intended to be driven/used, preferably extensively and I’ve yet to find a reason to buy/pay for anything other than readily available pump fuels.

 

when you push the gaspedal at the webers the fuel acceleartion pumpt gives a little more fuel into the cylinders and you need no choke. the SU carbs you may pull the chokes. so the complete main system is going down a little and the needle at the piston opens this main system a little more and so more fuel comes in. when you not pull the choke it will take a while until there is so much fuel-air mixture that the sparkplug will ignite this.

 

I use the choke to start the Jag from cold. I have had several cars with SU’s, and the choke is definitely needed for start and initial warm up. Lots of folks debate the use of the choke on Webers. Some people say never use the choke on Webers, just a couple of jabs on the accelerator pedal. To each their own. I have a simple view; if the choke wasn’t necessary why did the designers include it on their carburetors?

Either way, please let’s not hijack this thread with a discussion of the design and use of different carbs and their choke system.

 

then sorry please that I have written some.