TR - Billows of white smoke! | Page 4 | FerrariChat

TR - Billows of white smoke!

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by testarob, Jul 5, 2006.

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  1. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
    Full Name:
    Rob
    This car is driven regularly. Has just over 60k miles. And while not abused, I do from time to time push it through the gears (interstate on-ramp boogie)
     
  2. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
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    Rob
    Of all the comments, this one rings most true. I seriously doubt FoCF would send me off in a car with a fix they thought was dangerous (talk about liability). However, given the nature of the reponses to this thread, there is always going to be this nagging doubt.

    I have already instructed FoCF to give the temp fix a try, but have resigned myself to the fact that I probably will need to do the complete repair eventually.
     
  3. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Dec 9, 2003
    16,210
    wisconsin/chicago
    Full Name:
    bo
    I really wonder how these scenarios really play out. If someone had a Ford, and were facing a repair that would be 40% of its value...I know exactly what would happen. It would be patched, and traded in to some dealer in a couple of days, AS IS, without disclosure. Then sold anonymously at some auction to the unsuspecting buyer. I am not implying that thats what testarob will/should do...but I bet it happens one heck of a lot more than we suspect.

    A 60,000 mile testarossa is worth about 40k$ from what I can figure by reading this board. And those prices are starting to make sense...the parts are EXPENSIVE.

    The best way out, is to sell the car on EBAY, with full disclosure. SOMEONE will buy it for 40k$, believeing that they can fix it for 1000$....
     
  4. J.P.Sarti

    J.P.Sarti Guest

    May 23, 2005
    2,426
    Depends whether you have sentimental value with the car or not, practically any major repair on a 308 will cost 50% of the value of the car but owners still put alot of money in them anyway.

    I don't think this car would last a test drive, at the least more pressure will be put on the crack and the JB Weld will blow out right away and the car wil have another big smoke show, of course this could explain why some may refuse a test drive on certain cars for sale.
     
  5. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
    Full Name:
    Rob
    I have put together a book (3-ring binder actually) that details ALL repairs that have been made to this car (including dozens of photos). Every invoice, every trip to the shop. This car has had a SIGNIFICANT amount of work done over the past two years to bring it back to shape. I will not sell it anytime soon, but when I do the buyer can rest assured they will have full disclosure (at least since it has been in my hands).

    Also, since I have already put so much into the car, I will eventually do the complete work that this 'temp' fix is avoiding. I am just trying to spread out the financial impact as I just spend $14k last month.

    If anyone can buy an 86 TR that is as sound mechanically as this one (will be once this last repair is done) for 40k they should put on a mask.
     
  6. Drew Altemara

    Drew Altemara Formula 3

    Feb 11, 2002
    1,504
    Tuscaloosa, AL
    Full Name:
    Drew Altemara
    One of the reasons this repair is so expensive is that you get into the "while we are in there" mentality. For the transmission repair to my BB512 the engine had to be seperated from the engine. The differential was gone the ring and pinion had gone and there were some gear issues. Plus the cam belts were six years old. So engine out was the way to go.

    Of course while you are in there might at as well do the syncros, bearings, seals, etc, etc.

    Rob, maybe you are lucky. If you can get some assurances that you can get it back together for $5K and that the box can be welded I'd certainlly go that route.

    Let us know what happens this week.

    When this thread is doneI 'm going to post a little narative of what I ran into on mine that might be illustrative.

    Drew Altemara
     
  7. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    85K is nothing. I drove mine to 150K. At that point the chassis rotted away and while I was on vacation my mechanic sold her before I did something stupid like trying to restore her.
     
  8. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
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    Mr. Sideways
    Ha! Did you get just a little bit of chassis flex at 150k?!
     
  9. lm2504me

    lm2504me Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 26, 2004
    1,086
    Nipomo, CA
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    Richard
    I am glad to hear this is more of a high mileage condition >50k miles. I was starting to get worried since I have less than 24,000 miles on my 87 Trossa. I don't drag race it or do peel outs. I have been chastised for babying it. I just enjoy the drive and the power on demand for passing when at highway speeds. Oh yea, the looks from other people and the low seating position is great too.

    Are there any other timebombs waiting? I thought I had researched TRossa ownership issues to death. I am a DIY'er.

    Thanks,
    Rich
     
  10. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    Bump...

    Rob, any update?
     
  11. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
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    Rob
    Supposed to be ready tomorrow ... I will post then.
     
  12. Boxer12

    Boxer12 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2003
    1,672
    FYI, I tried JB Weld on a pinhole in an oil cooler, in my Viper, and it was a waste of time. Lasted about ten minutes, even when the hole was enlarged to 1/32 to get a good fill. Tig weld is the way to go. It cost me $15 to fix that oc. It sounds like you have a crack as a symptom, not as a problem in itself. If you have to wait to fix it, due to finances, I would do so. It isn't worth the chance. JMO.
     
  13. lm2504me

    lm2504me Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 26, 2004
    1,086
    Nipomo, CA
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    Richard
    Sorry, I didn't mean to attempt to redirect the thread. I will be more careful in the future.

    I also have an interest in Rob's fix.

    Back on topic..... So is this a high mileage issue (>50k miles) or not?

    Rich
     
  14. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
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    Rob
    So much for JB Weld. I didn't make it the 25 miles home before it started leaking gear oil. Quite frankly this wasn't a big surprise given the excellent feedback I have received from all you Fchatters. I knew JB Weld was a long shot, and a temp fix at best. Now, when I take this back to the dealer, what options should I expect to hear?

    ps - anybody have a good deal on a 512M tranny? Acually, would a 512M fit in an 86 TR?
     
  15. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    Sorry to hear that. Good luck with whatever permanent fix you pursue.
     
  16. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,352
    Indian Wells, California
    Full Name:
    Jon
    I'd expect some allowance for the money spent on a 25-mile fix... although I'd assume it wasn't huge money just for the JB Weld attempt.

    I would guess the best option would be to get a 512TR gearbox housing from a parts car, assuming that fits.
     
  17. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
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    Rob
    Only $5000 for the temp JB Weld fix ...
     
  18. 3forty8

    3forty8 F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 25, 2006
    2,713
    San Diego
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    Eric
    Good lord - assuming $500 for fluids, seals, JB Weld and what not, and assuming a shop rate around $100/hour - they required 40 to 45 hours in labor? I'm really sorry to hear that and I hope someone on this board can help out and offer a cost effective and permanent solution.
     
  19. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
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    Rob
    JOKE ALERT ! ! ... only a few hundred... just preping for the spanking coming up
     
  20. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,352
    Indian Wells, California
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    Jon
    {mops up beer sprayed all over keyboard...}

    If you can really get this resolved for $5K, I'll be bookmarking this thread for when I get my TR. Seriously, would love to see this car put right for sane money.
     
  21. 3forty8

    3forty8 F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 25, 2006
    2,713
    San Diego
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    Eric
    Damn - and here I was feeling really sorry for you! Nothing surprises me on these cars anymore; it's good to see you can still keep a sense of humor and I hope you can get it sorted out for "sane money." Be sure to let Jon know what your cost effective solution is - the sooner he gets comfortable with owning a TR the sooner he'll have his magnificent 328 up for sale!
     
  22. Boxer12

    Boxer12 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2003
    1,672
    You need to make some calls. Start with TRutland, and Ferrari UK, and Ferrari of Orange County. I would not shy away from a used OEM replacement, rather than a 512, unless you plan to race the car and take the opportunity to upgrade. There are thousands of TR's on the road, and a few weld failures doesn't mean the entire lot is rubbish. Just think of it like any other car? Likely you would just find a used one, bolt it in, and drive worry free.
     
  23. Jeff Pintler

    Jeff Pintler Formula Junior

    Jul 20, 2005
    537
    Richland
    Full Name:
    Jeff Pintler
    From what I understand, the early TR's had a two piece differential carrier that was welded togetherand the welds fail. I had mine diff replaced along with syncros and seals for about 10k and a major service done for about 5K. The shop was Francorchamps in Calif. and they work on this repair alot. They also indicated that some of the later cars had gears that were brittle and they make there own replacements. (The reason I sent my engine and trany there was I couldn't get into reverse or 2nd. Turns out there is a rubber bushing on the shifter rod that was oil soaked, that prevented full shift rod travel. So I spent 15k for a piece of rubber.) Having said that, you may be lucky and dis-assemble the trany, find someone to tig weld the repair (remember to pre-heat the part), spend the 6k in parts and put it back together. Something to keep in mind is the trany has to locked into gear then assembled with a special pin (I kid you not - you can make your own) and installed back into the car. The process is involved enough that the shop said be very, very, very careful or you have to dis-assemble the trany again. My local dealer said 30k and they were willing to try. I bought a 2 post lift, pulled the motor/trany and shipped it to them........it was a kinda fun project and took the summer two years ago. I have the crate, engine dolly and engine subframe you can borrow. Sometimes, love can be painful.

    Jeff Pintler
    89 348tb(on the mend), 86 TR
     
  24. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
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    Mr. Sideways
    #99 No Doubt, Jul 18, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Did that piece of TR rubber look anything like the 348's part #55 below?
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. testarob

    testarob F1 Rookie

    May 13, 2006
    2,504
    Debary, Florida
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    Rob
    Good news - the JB weld held just fine.

    Bad news - another leak manifested itself on the other side of the housing. This time it looked as if the gear oil was actually leaking through the wall of the housing itself! Implication is that there is a crack on the other side of the housing and is allowing the gear oil to leak through without seening a visible crack.

    At this point I have given the go-ahead to replace the housing. Hopefully, once they get it opened up there won't be a ton work that needs to be done. Maybe a syncro, but there was never a problem shifting (no noise or grinding when shifting). Who knows?

    More later.
     

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