Tony Robbins and the "self help industry"

Nothing. It's called "religion".



-DC

 

Actually it is a discipline, you have to re-learn how to think act and prioritize. Not everyone is born with the gift of confidence, and really that is what it is about right? Not just in yourself but also learning to trust in others. This is from within or from a cornerstone, a person that is a reference point.

People are quick to condemn and cautious to accept. People in general are like schools of fish swimming, the lead fish or the one that appears to be in the lead, the rest of the pack follow, in order to make them change direction for the heck of it, you need to convince them they are swimming towards a shark. They don't have to see it, they just have to believe it is there. The shark in this case is anything, something you feel you lack, your albatross, perhaps someone is telling you that there is something missing.

There is an issue I have with the whole "i am broke, i need someone to fix me" thing. but like they say, step one is accepting you have a problem and then being willing to change. people often lack the confidence or the technique, and need a third party that sounds acceptable to help them on their way.

Martial arts, it is the fastest simplest example. Anybody can break a piece of wood, what holds you back is entirely the fear. You could just swing at it and have a pretty good chance of breaking that board, but you think your fingers will break before the board. Some guy you look up to because he is in the front of the room shows you a way to hold your hand. So now you feel confident that this little technique is it. Really it was never the hand, it was all in the mind, but one person, and a nifty belt gave me that push one day. The world opened up to me after that little piece of wood.

You can call Tony a coach, a salesman that sells you back to yourself, it does not really matter. Somewhere someplace everybody has had a push, somepeople need Tony, and what is wrong with that? btw, I saw him once in Santa Monica, helluva shadow he casts, never once read a book of his or attended any of his functions.

 

i think people are quick to beat up the self-help industry because the self-help industry always sells just on the other side of the line.

remember, they all basically sell the same exact thing.

but it's not fair to say it doesn't work. for lots of people, the programs do work simply becuase they need an education about whatever it is they need from a self-help type.

nobody learns to do calculus spontaneously - you have to learn it. nobody learns how to read shakespear spontaneously - you have to learn it.

self-help lessons are no different. some people learn that stuff on their own. some people learn it from their parents or friends. some people learn it from a book or a seminar.

but the vast majority of people who buy tony robbins' stuff aren't penniless and living in nasty apartments and suddenly become mega-millionaires. those are the stories that, while perhaps they do happen, caricaturize (if that's a word) the industry. and those caricatures (sp) negatively impact the industry, imo.

doody.

 

If you wan't to understand how to get a great foothold on all of your emotions and re-wire those litle hardwired responses we all grew up with that interfere with logic and rational thinking... this book is fantastic. Never been involved with Robbins though, so i can't compare it.

NLP: The New Technology
(short for neuro-linguistic programming)

by Charles Faulkner and Steve Andreas

 

If I were casting for THAT infomercial...I'd still have to say that Tony Robbins is (just a) bit more marketable that Benny Hinn...

FYI. After a few drinks with T.R., his revealing comment had everything to do with his burning desire to sell MORE self-help kits than Ron Popeil sells rotisserie grills. He is OWNED!

But hey, If that turns your key and you attribute your success to his books, tapes, seminars, infomercials, DVD's, CD's and....... then more personal power unleashed within you!

DL

 

I listened to TR's tapes. read his books for years and I can conclude that this pretty much sums him up.

 

Wow. Where to start here?

First of all, lets remember the diverse backgrounds of everyone and that your childhood experience may be severely dis-similar to mine or the next person, whomever that may be.

Self help is an excellent way to identify areas where principles were taught improperly or were neglected entirely. More information is ALWAYS better than less if you know what to DO with the information.

Certainly there is no promise of instant transformation from vagrant to millionaire made by any of the professors of self-help; although, it seems that promise is inferred through their marketing devices.

I recently read "Secrets of a Millionaire Mind" by T. Harv Elker, and it expatiated on individual's "Financial Blueprint" and how the blueprint is influenced greatly by your parents monetary behavior. Did they save or spend? How much did they earn? Full-time or Entrepreneurial? Stocks or Bonds? etc, etc.

Did reading the book instantly double or quadruple my net worth? No. Did it promise to? No. Will it eventually if I continue to apply the principles? Yes.

Self help is the best investment (and least expensive) that you can make that will generate compounding returns over the course of your life. The book cost $14.95, about the price of a discounted Brittney Spears CD or a burger and a beer at your local diner.

"If you think education is expensive, try ignorance."

Nick

PS-

Jim Rohn is the best motivational speaker, easily.

 

I took a big turn on the self-help industry when I went to a Peter Lowe "success" seminar and realized that the only "success" he had was selling "success" to all the suckers like me in the audience.

I think there are techniques that you can use in some of the books. I'm just no longer willing to pay $199.99 to get them.

 

I think likening many of these "self-help" gurus to snake oil salesmen is generally spot on. While I do tend to agree that the general principals they promote can likely help people to improve themselves in many aspects of their lives, the main reason these guys are out there is to sell a product: Themselves. And there's nothing wrong with that as long as the product fulfills it's intended purpose. However, it's the ones out there that go about it in an underhanded way that really irk me. A perfect example is Amway/Quixtar & other "Multi Level Marketing" organizations. They front as if they're a legit "business opportunity" yet all they really do are sell "self-help" products (tapes, books, seminars, et cetera). They're the ones to watch out for as they tend to prey on ignorant, weak-willed individuals who are easily influenced. An ex (for this very reason) of mine got caught up into that stuff (Quixtar/Amway) & is too far into it to get through to now. I guess it's a good biz if you're the motivator, but not the motivatee. Just my $.02 pesos...

 

Ugh. I hate this type of comment.

What other business can you get into with $500 plus sweat equity and turn yourself into a millionaire after 5 years of hard work? Really. I want to know, I'll send you a check.

Nick

 

Self-help, motivational speakers.....oh man, don't get started on that racket. The higher-ups in my company subject us to one at least once a year. All they're doing is "re-packaging" common sense and (as mentioned previously) their only success is selling their services to the suits in my company.

One classic motivational speaker did nothing more that play video tapes from a guy that looked and sounded like Marshall Applewhite from the Heaven's Gate cult.

It may work for some (more self-power to you) but it's an absolute waste of time for this happy camper.

 

The only suckers there were the one's who believed him and his bs. You were one of the smart one's. A good father or grandfather is all you need. I did not know my father or grandfather, but the grandfather figure in my life told me, "The best home in the world won't help you sell a crappy lot, but the best lot in the world will always sell the worst home."
I am a home builder now and little things like this have helped me to be fairly successful. I keep a notebook of things I need to tell my 18 month old son when he gets old enough to listen.

 

The answer is - ANY BUSINESS. You could take the $500 and spend it on software instructional books, write a good piece of software that fills a niche market and make that money. You could spend it on a horrendously cheap pickup truck and use your mower to start your own landscaping business and in 5 years, with the right amount of hard work, be a millionaire. You could start buying/selling on eBay with the $500 and with enough work, turn it into millions. ANY BUSINESS can be made successful with the right decisions, smart work and hard work.

Amway/Qiuxtar is a scam for weak willed people. The people at the top make the money, and they make it on the backs of the drones. It's the same with most of the real estate programs - Carlton Sheets, Don whateverhisnameis...

The real problem is there are lots of people who want to strike it rich in short time with little investment of time or money. Some believe (or are led to believe) that if they just work harder, they will strike it rich. There are some who do. There are also some who win the lottery, or who strike it rich in other ways. If you look at rich people, they are rich because they were successful in REAL businesses. Businesses that produce a product thats good and has widespread appeal, or businesses that offer a good service and expand their idea. For every person who made money on some junk like Amway, there are 1,000 who made their money by starting a real business and growing it with hard work. Drive through ANY town in any city in the USA. EVERY SINGLE ONE of the businesses you see is owned by someone. Let's say the average size of a business is 20 employees. That means that for every 20 workers in the USA, there is a CEO/owner behind that business. THAT is where the real money comes from. Not get-rich-quick-just-be-motivated type stuff.

My .02

 

Excellent post!

 

Hmmmmmmm....

Let's say that your number is right and 5 out of every 100 people are CEO's. You're saying if someone invested $500 they could make a business work?

I vehemently disagree.

Most small businesses fail BECAUSE they are started by Mr. Joe and Jane Sixpack. They have no formal training, shallow pockets and big dreams.
Their biggest problem is that they have no system to follow. MLM corrects that problem. If SOMEONE got rich following the system, ANYONE can get rich following the system.

A good friend of mine who is 29 used to have a position in sales at a large software company at 25 making around $120K per year. He is a Dartmouth grad and started with a specific MLM after he was laid-off from the software company and now makes around $60K per month.
He wasn't in on the "ground-floor" or any of that other "only the founders get rich B.S." When he started, the company was 6 years old doing $100m per year. Now it's doing $500m per year and will continue to grow.

What would have happened if he used his severance pay to START a software company? Well since he was in sales, he could have SOLD the software possibly, but what about CREATING the software? I am not talking about coding either...

Remember... the value of a software program is not in the code, but in the business process mechs. behind the software.

Sorry Mike, your arguement doesn't cut it.

Respectfully,

Nick

 

Fact: Every business is owned by someone. Some are large public co's but the # of small businesses in the world far outweight the # of large public ones.

Fact: There are hundreds of thousands of small businesses out there. They ain't all losing money.

Fact: The majority of "rich people" got rich by founding a business, growing that business, and making money from that business.

If I had a buck for everyone I've heard say "I know 'a guy' who is making <insert large amount of $$$> per month from Amway!", I wouldn't need amway because I'd be the rich guy. EVERYONE who is a drone of Amway knows of "the guy" who is getting rich off it. The FACTS are out there. The FACTS show that for everyone making money, there are THOUSANDS who are losing their shirts.

It doesn't take belief, it doesn't take hard work or motivation or skill or business acumen. It takes 3rd grade math to see the real story. Pyramid schemes are just that. In something like Scamway, err, Amway, you are not working for yourself. You are providing the means for everyone above you to make money and your money comes from everyone you sign up. Business isn't about getting suckers to join your cult, err, program, it's about providing a VALUABLE product or service and expanding it. The main 'sale' of the pyramid schemes is to get MORE people to sign up. There are a limited # of people in this country, and you can very easily see that there is a VERY small group of people who can actually make money on these programs.

But I feel this is falling on deaf ears. The people who are indoctrinated in these programs do not see the truth. They (very sadly) expend their energy on 'the program' and in general they fail miserably. The people at these programs don't make money on the program, they make money on selling the program - the books and videos and all that crap. There is no need for the structure of Amway. Look at the prices you pay for stuff! Look where the money goes! If someone wants to be a reseller of water purification machines, go to a distributor and get setup... get biz cards made, brochures, flyers, put an ad in the paper. But they don't do that. Why? Because people who join Amway are not real businesspeople. They are afraid of making the true leap. They don't have the security net of someone telling them what to do, how to do it, when to do it, etc, etc. They are not real entrepreneurs, they are get-rich-quick mentality folks who generally fail, and for good reason (becase they are not smart businesspeople). if they were real entrepreneurs, they would see the massive massive disadvantage they start off with by joining an MLM.

Fact is, there are no guarantees in business... but a guarantee of success is the prize that people want so, so badly. They want the +++'s of business without the risk. That's what Amway and others sell them on - a structured program that removes the risks (supposedly) and still has the huge upside. The people who buy into this junk are so intent on beliveing they can get the upside without the risk that they leave their common sense at the door. And they get burned. Badly.

It's a great shame, because all that motivation and energy could be channeled into a real business that makes real money from a real product or service. Amway and the like is for suckers. There are some entrepreneurs in Amway... the guys who started it. Its too bad that they are on the same ethical level as email spammers and people who sell speakers from vans from supposed overshipments and such.

 

I agree completely Mike. I've posted this in the various MLM threads here in the past, but here we go again. http://www.thedigest.com/68/68-21.html

I know the guy in the story who used to be Excel's #2 rep. No, BS he used to knock down $500,000+ a month. Currently he does at least that well and most likely lots better..BUT.......He makes his money selling the dream to people who will never realize it. He made his money with Excel the same way. He is one of a couple of guys I have known over the years who have made real money in MLM. Like the others, I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him. I see these guys as predators...nothing more, nothing less.

 

Sigh.

I make the majority of my money from "real businesses" as you put it. I also have residual income from an MLM because I get paid when people pay their long distance bill. Do I make millions of dollars? No. Is it enough to pay my bills? Yeah, some of them. Bottom line is that I introduced ONE person, it took 10 minutes and now I have a portion of 400 peoples phone bill coming to me every month.

You're right, I AM a moron and so is everyone else with multiple streams of income.

Nick

 

Chill tiger, I am not saying you are a moron - after all, you haven't made MLM your life

But, your position illustrates exactly what I am saying in three ways. First, you are not making tons of money from MLM. Second, your income came not from selling anything, but from selling someONE. Third, your real income comes from real businesses.

Couldn't have given a better example. You're one of the real businessfolk, not the ambots.

 

a message from Tony: http://www.sr.se/P1/src/sing/index.htm?key=W9GB814W#

 

My own brother was a full time "Cult" follower for a few years. It literally took an actual intervention to get him out! Thanksgivings were a blast. He'd show up with a truckload of soap. Then came the vitamins....born again! Then the financial services and refis at astronomical interest rates (that didn't matter cause the payment is better).

Oy VEY!

I'd invest in a MLM that sold Sodium Pentothol, Pavulon and Potassium chloride!

 

You can't blame one player when the entire sport is doing the same thing.

Drug companies, car compaines, governments, real estate agents, parents, teachers, etc.... If some one has anything to gain, anything at all, they will pull heart strings, lie and yes of course prey on the weak.

The whole world is a total F'in mess, why shouldn't "self help" people make millions too?

 

Okay, so how much do you guys/gals think Tony is pullin' in a year?

 

According to wikipedia... $30,000,000