Tesla Roadster

Interesting thing about technology. It isn’t worth crap 2-3 years later.

So while a classic car will hold value, old tech does not.

Aren’t you buying pretty much just the tech on a Tesla?

How competitive will a 10 year old Tesla be? How much are the original roadsters worth now?

 

Nope. Its accurate per Tesla. I've seen it posted in numerous online articles. They claim it makes more torque than their new Semi! The exact quote is 7376lbs.

 

I’ve driven an i3 BMW, and think that’s a very valid car in the round, including it’s 100 mile range, but totally unconvinced about the Tesla’s.

 

Image Unavailable, Please Login New electric car charging point installed in Salisbury; reported Sept 1896.

 

Really?

 

I love my i3, best of it i only bay 180 a month of it so leaves cash to face the TR maintenance


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we have been discussing for pages and pages across many areas of the site....
about a car that has not been built yet, might not ever see production, let alone mass production of more than a handful of units.
the ONE car shown did not have to pass any nhtsa, epa, or other tests.

we are wasting our time and emotions discussing a unicorn.

 

As a Ferrari fan and 458 owner, I never thought I would buy an electric car. Tesla just pulls the right strings... $50k wired! At $200k it's a bargain!

 

Same! Hoping for the best.

 

musk +150: fchatter tesla supercar buyers -150

 

We need to start one more Tesla Roadster thread on this site- a Bubble Thread!

 

I'm glad you like facts I just wish you would learn them:

1) The batteries don't need disposal. They maintain 70% of their original charge for decades. Old Tesla batteries will be repurposed into energy storage batteries.
2) The power plant emissions are about 50% of tailpipe emissions in most states. That is clean on a comparitive basis. And more and more Tesla owners are adding solar to their homes so they don't generate power plant emissions.
3) EV owners charge their cars at night when there is plenty of electricity available. No major infrastructure needed.

Comparing Tesla to a ponzi scheme is a joke. Elon has delivered on EVERY promise he's made. He's just always LATE to deliver. Big deal.

People said you can't start a new car company in this day and age - BS. People said electric vehicles can't compete because they are too expensive - BS. People said you can't sell and service cars without a dealer network - BS. People said Tesla can't sell the Model S profitably - BS. People said he will never bring a $35k car to market - BS (coming next quarter). People said you can't land a rocket booster and reuse it - BS. I can keep going if you haven't gotten the point.

 

At least you see the big picture, that technology is changing the norm so it's better to embrace it because it's coming whether you approve or not. However you are misguided on a few points. Tesla batteries will not end up in landfills. This is pure myth. Tesla batteries maintain 70% of their original charge for decades and decades. They do not become useless. They will end up being repurposed for energy storage. You will have one in your attic to level your electricity costs and prevent blackouts in your home.

And as far as getting bored going 0-60 in 1.9???????? I'm on my third Tesla Model S and I still haven't gotten bored with the ridiculous acceleration. I floor it from almost every stoplight. And since 90% of my driving is on city streets I'm going to the amusement park every day. It's great! And, I've received no tickets in this time because I let up around the speed limit.

Lastly, Tesla's will not be obsolete after 7 years, this is absurd. Tesla's the only car that gets better and more modern as it ages. Because it's connected it gets over the air software upgrades that improve the performance and features of the car. You want proof? Look at resale prices. Tesla's sell at a MUCH higher residual than any of the german cars and it's not even close. Tesla's are designed to last over 1 million miles.

 

You love the Model X but you are not going to buy it because Tesla is working on a future car to be produced in 3 or 4 years? In other words, because they are 3 months late ramping up production of the Model 3 you don't want them working on their future lineup of cars? Sorry to say, but Elon has proven he can multitask. Relaunching rocket boosters while building a car company from scratch while inventing new forms of transportation (hpyerloop) while tunneling under LA are all things he's already done. Releasing a prototype of an enhanced version (Roadster) of his EV platform is small potatoes.

Elon ALWAYS delivers what he promises. He's just always LATE. Big deal.

 

"Lack of soul" "no passion"

Those claims were made when power steering was introduced. Racers complained about lack of feedback.

How many famous authors use a typewriter because it has more character than a computer?

How many people use a Blackberry because they can feel the buttons?

Sorry folks, an EV drivetrain is a WAY better drivetrain than an ICE. Technology has changed. Embrace it or not, up to you. Luca lost me when he proclaimed that Ferrari would never produce an EV under his watch. Well, he is gone and so maybe Ferrari needs to wake up. Enzo's first passion was to have the fastest cars with the fastest drivers for his race team and that is what inspired his road going cars. When you are no longer the fastest car you better change and adapt.

 

I feel sad about impending death of ICE. I think Tesla painted Roadster intentionally red to challenge Ferrari. My first reaction was that Ferrari would suffer most from these news. But on the second thought, this is not necessarily the case. I suspect there are other brands which will get hit harder at the same price point and also on the hypercar class. Ferrari's good point is that they haven't chased only ultimate acceleration and top speed figures. Ferrari's are more than that. Brand, heritage, luxury, comfort, space and sportiness.

However, this must be a wake-up call for Ferrari too. They really should have a electric car strategy planned already. That said, ICE is not dead yet, and will not be for years. I would not be cancelling Portofino orders over Roadster ones yet. There will be quite a decent mileage on your Ferrari before any customer Roadster turns a wheel. Also, I suspect Roadster may not be as nimble car as you would think, if you are basing expectations on Model S handling. Roadster is certainly a smaller car than Model S. This means the huge (twice as large battery pack) will go upwards in a car. It must have a negative effect. And no matter what they do, this car will weight at least 5000 lbs.

 

Internal combustion engines aren't going anywhere any time soon.

 

I suppose you noticed that was just about what I was trying to say in my whole post. But, I still feel sad already.

 

Tesla and Ferrari still have different buyers imo for this roadster. Yes, both are quick and red, but I think the similarities end after that. Fcar owners are particular about looks, history, interior appointments, and/or sound and not just performance. Ferrari has had TONS of competition over the years with Lambo and McLaren and even German automakers making stuff at high-end price range...and Ferrari still has waitlists.

I'm not saying Ferrari is invincible as they can screw the pooch by treating people like dirt and lose customers that way, but they won't lose waitlists because of this Tesla.

 

I love Elon Musk's vision and I love the automobiles, but I have serious doubts about Tesla's future based on the current cash burn rate and the critical importance of meeting certain benchmarks for the Model 3. The fact that they would divert attention and resources away from such a critically important task when (1) they are having tremendous difficulty resolving supply chain bottlenecks (2) they seem to be having considerable difficulty with factory automation,including welding aluminum to steel (3) they barely have the infrastructure to support the 100K cars currently on the road, much less the 500K they have promised to produce, (4) they have yet to develop anything resembling a properly functioning parts supply chain; (5) they burn through cash like a cokehead at a strip joint (6) if Seeking Alpha is to be believed, even if the Tesla 3 meets production goals, the company would still be structurally bankrupt and need infusions of investor cash to stay afloat (https://seekingalpha.com/article/4126264-even-model-3-success-tesla-structurally-bankrupt?page=2)

This is not me bashing on Tesla. The guy is clearly a visionary. However, sometimes a company also needs an accountant. Either the Roadster is (A) a blatant money grab to try and get deposits they can use now (2) evidence that Musk has ADD who is more interested in shiny flashy things then running a profitable car company (3) a capital intensive investment that, while revolutionary, will become a massive cash drain, or (4) evidence of Musk's brilliance. I have NO IDEA which one it is.

The problem I have with Silicon Valley in stereotypical terms is that they seem to love raising cash... in fact, to my fiscally conservative eyes, many tech companies seem to view the raising of cash as success in and of itself. At some point, you actually have to run the business. It can't always be flash...sometimes, you just got to learn how to Frickin weld.

So...in short... as much as I want a Tesla Model X....and I really do.... I'm sitting on the sideline until Musk turns a corner on the Model 3.

 

I believe you are overdramatizing Tesla's and Musk's business acumen. First, Elon has 50 years of combined experience in corporate leadership. During that time he has created 4 separate companies each with a valuation in excess of $1B. (only person in history to have accomplished such a feat) And that doesn't even include his first company which he sold for $340M or the billion dollar idea he gave away for free, the Hyperloop. In those 50 years he has never once misled investors or the public and he has always accomplished his goals. In typical Silicon Valley fashion he is almost always late to deliver on those goals but he gets it done in due time. He is already the most successful businessman and entrepreneur in the history of the world. So let's correct some of your assertions:

1) They are not having tremendous difficulty in resolving bottlenecks. They had 1 supplier who was designing 1 part of the battery pack who did not deliver. They fired that supplier and went in house to design it from scratch. This is resulting in a 3 month delay of Model 3 production. Elon himself camped on the roof of the Gigafactory while personally leading the engineering team to solve the issue.

2) There was internet speculation about welding but no evidence of this. Trust me, if Elon can land and re-launch rocket ships he can weld. This is pure unsubstantiated FUD.

3) They have plenty of infrastructure to handle the 500k new cars. There are hardly any wait times at service centers and I haven't seen a Supercharger backed up in some time. And there are WAY more Superchargers being added each month. Where is your proof of inferior infrastructure?

4) You are worried about a parts supply chain?

5) They have been burning cash like a cokehead in a stripjoint because they were paying for Model 3 production equipment. This was temporary. They will not be spending at that rate going forward and they have $3.5B in cash plus what they raise for Roadster and Semi deposits. Once full production of Model 3 begins to roll in they will be cashflow positive by the end of the year.

6) You post 1 article written likely by someone with an ulterior motive. Meanwhile none of the real analysts on Wall St. project Tesla to go BK. The biggest bears on Wall St. believe they are overvalued but this article is an outlier written by a nobody.

As to your second list of points:

1B) Of course the deposits for the Roadster are a money grab. It's because they can get away with it. It's legal and ethical so not sure what your point is. BTW, I'm obviously obsessed with the Roadster but even I think it's stupid to give them $50k to sit on for 3-4 years just so I can get mine a few months early.

2B) Musk may have ADD? The man who can relaunch rockets, dig tunnels and shake up the auto and oil industries definitely has something but lack of focus clearly would not be one of them.

3B) Not sure what you mean here but the point is they started work on the Roadster obviously some years ago because they have a functioning prototype. This is an entirely different team from the engineers trying to build the Model 3. The Roadster team is unaffected by a slight delay in Model 3 production.

 

I think you may be confusing me for someone who wants to see Tesla fail. I invested in Tesla back when it was trading at $40.00 a share, believe me. I get this vision and the product.

As for everything else, I hope you are right, but I posted one quick article for the sake of convenience, there is no shortage of articles on the subject of Teslas viability. If you just do a quick search of "Tesla Bankruptcy," for example you will get some idea. I know you may dismiss it as the naysayers having an agenda...and maybe they do... but everyone has an agenda right? But aside from what I have read online, some of the information I posted, is what I am hearing from people I know who work with Tesla. You can dismiss it or take it as gospel, who knows...maybe you are right and they are wrong. My gut is that where there is smoke there is fire...maybe not a five alarm fire, but probably not a campfire either.


Nonetheless, at the end of the day, Tesla's valuation is based, IMHO on the promise of what it could be, not what it is...and the window for fulfilling that promise gets smaller every day.

But let me be REALLY CLEAR. In my best case scenario. Tesla becomes the largest and most profitable car company in the world. I just hold deep reservations about that prospect based on the last few months.