Symptoms of CS Clutch Position Sensor Failure. | FerrariChat

Symptoms of CS Clutch Position Sensor Failure.

Discussion in '360/430' started by Ingenere, May 26, 2014.

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  1. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Dec 11, 2001
    6,430
    On the Limit
    Full Name:
    Dino
    Has anyone had their clutch position sensor fail?

    If so, what were the symptoms you had.

    Thanks guys....
     
  2. F430giallomodena

    F430giallomodena Formula Junior

    Mar 2, 2012
    910
    Lugano, Switzerland
    I had in my F430. No symptoms until car died on fast lane on higway. Impossible to restart.

    car towed, 2K bill to replace.
     
  3. SCEye

    SCEye F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2009
    2,950
    Norcal - Peninsula
    no warning signs? that's kinda scary to think that clutch can fail anytime.
     
  4. F430giallomodena

    F430giallomodena Formula Junior

    Mar 2, 2012
    910
    Lugano, Switzerland
    it is not the clutch. The F1 sensor is a rubber covered sensor that sends exact clutch position to electronic system.
    The problem is that mine failed only when it was completely worn out, no previous signs....
     
  5. freaky1

    freaky1 Formula Junior
    Owner

    Dec 10, 2012
    434
    Sydney, Australia
    Full Name:
    Paul
    How much mileage on the car when it failed ?
     
  6. F430giallomodena

    F430giallomodena Formula Junior

    Mar 2, 2012
    910
    Lugano, Switzerland
    49'000 km
     
  7. JSP

    JSP Karting

    Oct 5, 2013
    159
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Steve
    My CPS failed suddenly at 15,000 miles. No warnings, just shut down and would not restart. Towed to dealer and the repair was $2500.
     
  8. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
    6,430
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    Dino
    Thanks guys!

    Those are the symptoms, and that was the code I pulled.

    It looks like a PIA job.
     
  9. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    39,010
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    The sensor can be changed without pulling the clutch by a competent technician, so not as bad as it sounds. The sensor should always be changed during F1 clutch changes, along with the throw-out (thrust) bearing.
     
  10. RBarbieri

    RBarbieri Karting

    Feb 11, 2014
    237
    Bradenton, FL
    Full Name:
    Rich Barbieri
    My clutch and throw out bearing were recently replaced, but not the sensor. D**n.
     
  11. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
    6,430
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    Dino
    Can the sensor be changed without removing the gearbox? I hear both yes and no.
     
  12. rustybits

    rustybits F1 Rookie
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Jan 28, 2007
    2,509
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    Eddie B
    Yes. You can change the sensor without pulling the gearbox. I have done so several times. Be sure it is not a sticking release bearing though, you need to look at input shaft speed when the failure occurs. What was the p-code?
     
  13. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    6,430
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    I don't have the code in front of me. It was P-08XX I think. But the description was 'clutch position sensor high'

    It looks like access is on the passenger side of the gearbox, correct?
     
  14. rustybits

    rustybits F1 Rookie
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Jan 28, 2007
    2,509
    Somewhere, anywhere
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    Eddie B
    Yes through the little window where the red sensor cable passes through into the trans. Get yourself a ball-ended magnetic hex-socket. There's a couple of readings you can take to confirm the fault, I don't have the relevant paperwork in front of me now but I'll post it up tomorrow for you..
     
  15. vv23

    vv23 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 8, 2009
    258
    Edmonton, Alberta
    Full Name:
    V V
    I have a code p0806 right now on my cps. The Ferrari dealership told me to replace the sensor as well. My symptoms are delays in shifts sometimes into 2nd, and sometimes in 1st gear it feels like the car revs to 3k before it very slowly starts releasing the clutch.

    I assume the easiest access is from underneath the car to the window where the sensor is located correct? Any DIY instructions as this seems to be a common replacement item?
     
  16. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
    6,430
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    Dino
    Thanks much!
     
  17. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
    39,010
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    Terry H Phillips
    Eddie- Thanks for chiming in. Nobody believes me, but they do believe you and Brian.
     
  18. F430giallomodena

    F430giallomodena Formula Junior

    Mar 2, 2012
    910
    Lugano, Switzerland
    +1

    mine has been changed without having the entire gearbox removed. It's the red cable on the right side of the engine compartment.
     
  19. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    39,010
    Clarksville, Tennessee
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    Terry H Phillips
    V8 owners are lucky that way. Cannot change the clutch position sensor on a 575 or 612 without yanking the clutch. Might as well put in a new clutch at that point.
     
  20. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
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    This is all good news. Thanks for everyone's input (you too Taz :) )

    It looks like I have a weekend project. It will probably be easier than the timing belts... which were straight forward.

    Do you guys know what size magnetic, ball-headed socket is needed. I have a few, but I just want to make sure I have the correct one, BEFORE I'm upside down, up to my elbows in CS bits..... and realize I have to go to Sears...... again! :)
     
  21. vv23

    vv23 Formula Junior
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    Jan 8, 2009
    258
    Edmonton, Alberta
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    V V
    If I remember the local Ferrari tech said 2.5mm Allen key. Maybe someone can chime in.

    Let us know how the new sensor works out
     
  22. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    #22 Ingenere, Jun 7, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2014
    I got the car up in the air and YES, it's an allen key that you have to go at an angle to get. Of course the 'ball headed' allen keys that I have were too big.

    I ordered 3 & 4mm, as there were none smaller at Snap-On that had the ball head.

    Now that I've actually seen the area, the job looks more than doable. I was hoping to be driving tonight, but alas it will have to wait a few more days.
     
  23. vv23

    vv23 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 8, 2009
    258
    Edmonton, Alberta
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    V V
    I just tried too. looks like it has a 3mm allen key bolt. I can access the top one but the bottom is hard to get at.

    are you going to remove the two lines in front of the bottom bolt? any suggestions?
     
  24. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
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    Knocked it out today!

    It took a 3mm, ball headed allen to do the job. The 2 hard lines had to be removed. Use the quick disconnect above Clutch position sensor to start. You really only lose a couple of tablespoons of fluid. Access is more than doable with the lines removed. A valiant effort was made to do it without removing the lines, but it had to happen.

    Sensor went in. Clutch was bled. The car started right up and shifted great. Took it to dinner and ran perfectly. Job done! It's nice to have her back!
     
    MarioVU1 likes this.
  25. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    39,010
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Dino- How did you bleed the clutch line without an SD2?
     

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