Firstly, im on the road for the next week or so but I thought I would try to gather some intel to have ready when I get back home. This is an intermittent problem, mostly when the car has been sitting for a few days. When I go to start the car, I hear the starter make a high pitch whine (im presuming its the starter). The car is not turning over etc. It will take 3 attempts and then fire up as normal. When warm, no problem. Its as if the starter gear is spinning freely but not fully extended to engage the motor. Thoughts? Thanks in advance, Christian 1990 TR US Spec.
There are two switches in the back of a US version starter solenoid -- one causes the fuel pumps to run and the other runs the starter motor. Are you sure the "high pitched whine" is not just the fuel pumps running (when cranking action does not occur)?
Steve, the whine is only when the key is turned to the start position. The whine is fairly distinct and immediately disappears when the engine fires and I let off the ignition key. Turbo-Joe: If the magnetic switch does not fully pull the starter pinion forward, does it just spin? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Edit: I only have to hear the whine for a half second then let off the key. Try again, if I hear the whine, back off again. Then it will start immediately on the third attempt. Im good to go for the next couple of days hot or cold. Is there a way to visually observe the engagement of the starter on the flywheel during start? Its not a huge deterrent, but I can stand something not operating as designed. Other theories 1- Bad starter solenoid? Time to get a cheap WAI replacement. 2-Low voltage from battery? 3- New/rebuilt starter? If I can, I will have the wife start it and confirm / deny if it is engaging after a long sit. Then maybe remove and clean the internals. Hope this helps to give more info.
I took this: "The car is not turning over etc." to mean that the crankshaft is not spinning when the humming occurs -- is that a wrong translation?
You are correct. The crankshaft / flywheel does not spin. Only a very audible whine spinning sound. On the second or third attempt , it fires up immediately instead of the whine.
If it is the starter motor that is running (which can only happen if the solenoid plunger actually moves), without the pinion gear driving the flywheel or without the pinion gear moving out to engage the flywheel teeth, you've no choice but to do a starter-ectomy and investigate. Not a typical failure mode as that (mechanical) mechanism is fairly robust, and not something that would typically be intermittent when it goes wrong -- but anything's possible...
yes it will spin so next time you start get a second person to touch the starter to feel if this is spinning or not. also when you turn the ignition to start you say you hear the whining. so try also next time to be longer with the ignition switch on start to locate where this whining comes from.
I had same problem with a Ford F100 a few years ago. There were a few broken teeth on the flyweel. After a number of attempts, flywheel would eventually move past the broken teeth and starter would then turn the motor over. The problem was intermittent. Maybe not the same problem, but worth checking to see if there are any broken teeth on the flywheel. I had to replace the flywheel.
if only the teeth are not ok you don´t have to buy for a TR a new flywheel. you need only the sprocket. it is shrunk on the flywheel. I will look later here in my documents, there I have somewhere pictures form my sprocket when I shrunk it on the flywheel after I modified this for my new ignition/injection
Thanks guys. I have a game plan now. Chief, your idea has merit. But this is a 'time between use issue' that presents itself if the car has been sitting for a few days without use. Ill report when I get back from St Marteen. Christian
The wife ran off to work befor I could recruit her but I made a little video. The car hasnt been started in 2 weeks. I put my iphone next to the starter and no use of the gas pedal etc. First attempt you can hear the whine. Second attempt my fingers slipped off the key so the whine is very short. Third attempt, whine then fires up and idles no problem. Now that it has been 'primed', it will fire up on the first attempt until left to sit for a few days then back to the 3 try attemps. So, does the whine sound like the starter to you guys? If so, Ill do an investigative Starterependictomy over the weekend. Worst thing that can happen is to order a rebuilt one. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQwc3ckIQkw]Tr start - YouTube[/ame] Thanks in advance, Christian
Kind of sounds like my TR, but I never was that close to the starter. Always in the drivers seat. Ago
the first you started has been not long enaugh to hear exactly if the engine is turning or not. and the 2nd time has also been to less. but I think there would be somewhere somebody around to have a look if the flywheel will turn or not ? try the following if you are only alone there to check: put in a gear ( 2nd or 3rd ) and then start. if you hear then the same noise without the car is moving ( you may not push the clutch and in front of the car there must be free space ! ! ! ) it is a problem of the magnetic switch at the starter. but if the car will move you immediately push the clutch pedal and then you know it is not a problem of the starter. but be careful: the engine could start at the first time and if you then not push the clutch pedal the car will go forward. so do this only if you ecaxtly know what and why you are doing this ! ! ! I´m not responsible if you crash this way your car ! ! !
Trubo Joe, We have a saying in the USA, "Out of the mouths of babes" Translation: sometime a problem need a fresh look to see the answer. Thank you, Im kinda ashamed that I didnt think of this before. And yes I will have my wife help me when I get home again....hopefully tomorrow. Phill, It just sounds so unnatural, but Im glad im not the only one. More to come tomorrow.
Romano you crack me up! I watched the video and it sounded normal all 3 times. If it's a bad solenoid, the sound is distinctly different because the starter just spins without engaging the flywheel. Hard to say... You should make another video only hold the key in the start position longer the first time.
right ! ! ! and if the crankshaft will rotate check with a test lamp on the 2 cold start valves if there is power and ground during starting
Update: Cheers to Turbo Joe. I guess its normal. The car lurched forward while making the 'normal' whine. So the Starter is in fact engaging the flywheel. Thanks to everyone who confirmed that the sound is in fact perfectly normal. Christian
In the video I was not crazy about how she turned over. Slight stumble then she fired up.. The b*tch should fire right up especially when cold.. When hot sometimes you have to feather the gas a bit - its a process - but cold she should rip up alive.. Connections, Connections, Connections.. Update your connections with the gold kit.. I'm not saying its gonna fix your issue but what it will do is build a solid foundation so you can properly diagnose. The connections are so horrible in the TR - one never knows if its the component or the connection until you put one to bed.. Gold kit puts connection issues to bed for good.. It really works brother.. R
