360 Stanceparts Air Cup Kits for 360

Paging @Keith360 who also put an air ride system into his 360 spider:

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/air-suspension-on-360-spider.572885/

 

I researched stance cups when doing my front end lift. Basically comes down to nobody has done it and there is very little info. Also, I believe the mount styles are different and there would need to be custom fabrication. I sucked it up and bought the kw hls2 lift system. Plus it takes up way less space and is quieter.

 

K&W have/had a lift kit for 430/360.
It works well, and would be even better if it was a little faster.

 

I looked at that as well. It's been mentioned a few times and one person actually started installing it years ago but then never posted any updates. My guess is that it will have the same challenges as the stancecups.

I considered the four corner lift, but you really get more clearance on the front with just a front end lift as the car is angled and not level. The KW kit gives you new springs as well for all four corners.

Definitely highway robbery for what you get as the Ferrari tax is evident, but there doesn't seem to be any other turn key solution. I'm sure the community would thank you if you managed to get a cheaper setup figured out and installed.

 

I can confirm that the Stanceparts cups will not fit the 360 shock. I too wanted a front end lift and I too was not able to find a cost effective off the shelf solution. I wound up purchasing the Stanceparts 45mm shaft cups and modified both their cups and the stock 360 shock top mount. I also had to create a sleeve to interface between the modified shock mount and the modified cups. It required a number of turning operations on the lathe along with sourcing new larger diameter O-ring seals. The OD of the Stanceparts cups is 120mm and just does fit on the car with a small amount of clearancing of the frame.

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Hi, would you have more pictures of your modifications?
I'm considering these cups for my F430, so probably not exactly the same but it could help me

It seems stanceparts now offers a smaller cup (110mm), but the spring OD needs to max 89mm, I will measure it but I suspect OEM springs are larger than this

 

Yes, the OEM spring OD on the 360 is in the high 90’s…am pretty sure it was about 97-98mm. Would guess the 430 is about the same.

I neglected to take pictures while performing the modifications but do have screen shots of the cad design.

First some background. The Stanceparts cups are designed to seal against the shaft of the damper. The design of the Ferrari (360 and 430) top spring perch of the damper will not allow for that. There are two bosses that protrude down from the spring seat of the perch. The central threaded boss is where the damper shaft screws into and the outer boss locates the ID of the spring. One could mount the Stanceparts cups under those bosses but you would loose quite a bit of shock travel.

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So the best solution would be to design and machine a new top spring perch. I instead went the route of modifying the existing parts.

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The OEM top spring perch was modified by machining away the spring locating boss.

With this boss removed there is now room for an adaptor sleeve that serves the purpose to provide the center sealing surface for the Stanceparts cups/perches.

Lastly the bore of the Stanceparts cups/perches needs to be enlarged and new O-ring grooves cut.

An advantage to this design is that no shock travel is lost because the Stanceparts cups/perches don’t seal against the shaft of the damper.

I hope all this makes sense (am not so certain after reading back through it…haha!) and perhaps provides some assistance.


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Thank you very much for your answer ! Impressive work !
Now I understand better...

I just dont understand why you had to do this :
"Lastly the bore of the Stanceparts cups/perches needs to be enlarged and new O-ring grooves cut."
you bought 45mm cups => couldn't you just use an adaptor sleeve of 45mm in diameter ?

 

Thank you!

So to maintain damper travel, the body of the damper must be able to pass inside the sleeve on compression. The OEM damper has a pressed on cap at the top of the damper that measures about 56mm in greatest diameter.

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So the sleeve needs to have an ID of at least 56mm. Mine has an ID of 58mm. The wall thickness of my sleeve is 4.5mm giving an outer diameter of 67mm.

I simply chose the 45mm shaft diameter Stanceparts cups because at the time it was the largest diameter cup they offered and just meant there was less material I would have to bore out.


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Thank you, very clear !

I may have found another solution :
- remove the outer boss as you did
- use these cups (enlarge the hole to the size of the inner boss)
- probably use new coilovers with dampers ~50mm in diameter, and ideally springs about 90-95mm OD (to fit the M version)

What do you think ? Does anyone konw such coilovers ?

These cups are those of the "Roberuta x 326 Power "Cupman" Air Lift System"
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Yes, those cups don’t require the damper shaft for the center seal. I bet they would work well with modified upper damper spring perches.

 

A bit off topic, but when you do get your lift system installed, Sticky RX can make you a 2 position switch with a front axle lift graphic.

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Looks great !

My latest thoughts:
- keep stock coilovers, leave top spring perch unmodified
- machine a ring, to be installed ouside the outer boss (matching its height) in order to create a flat solid supporting surface...
- ...for installing the inexpensive stanceparts cups hereunder => btw, what's the shaft diameter, in order to buy the proper cups ?
- restore spring travel by lowering the lower prech
- shock travel shouldn't be significantly harmed, in my opinion (it is probably possible to find a slightly smaller shock absorber pad)

 

Yes, many ways to skin this cat. As you go through your design process, you will want to try to maintain as much shock travel as possible. You will need to maintain about 50mm of droop in the shock as installed at ride height to allow the lift system to function. The Stanceparts website has a good page explaining that.

Also remember the bump stop. It measures at about 43.5 mm of axial depth and in the design that you are contemplating the bump stop will mount under the Stanceparts perch.

On the OEM upper perch, I measured the bumpstop mounting surface to be about 2mm proud of the spring mounting surface…so it is tucked up in there between those two bosses pretty far. Given that the shock threads into that central protruding boss, the bumpstop in OEM config only extends about 18.5 mm down the shaft of the damper.

Another bit of info that may be helpful to you is the axial depth of the Stanceparts cup (10mm) and perch (12mm).

The shaft of the damper is 15mm in diameter.

It’s a fun 3 dimensional problem and if you are able to model some of the basic parameters in cad it can make it easier before you buy parts or cut metal.


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Thank you, very useful !
Is this diagram correct, with your figures ?
Especially, the outer boss is 23mm high, and the inner one is slightly smaller ?

I will attach a bump stop under the air up, but I don't need a 43mm one, 18-20 mm are enough I think

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You are getting close…this may help.

Disclaimer is that I measured the part using a set of calipers months ago so dimensions are close but certainly NOT exact. I originally created this drawing for my own personal use without any intention to share with the rest of the internet so big grain of salt here! This drawing also doesn’t include any of the small fillets or chamfers on the part. Would use these measurements to put yourself in the right ballpark for choosing a path towards your final solution. Then measure any critical dimensions yourself!

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Excellent, my diagram was quite false but now it's fine thanks to you. I plan to do the job in the coming 2-3 weeks, I'll keep you informed

 

I'm facing a problem : how to unscrew the shaft from the top perch ??

 

I adapted stanceparts aircups to my F430. I had a machinist modify the OEM upper spring perch and also modify the aircup to seal against it. You will need to use the smaller aircups for the front and the standard size in the rear. I ended up going with Switft springs to make everything fit together. Turned out great. There is a lot more to it than I just described, but know it is possible.
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Thanks, great job
I'm now considering going aftermarket coilovers, because my OE dampers won't unscrew from the perch even with strong force...