Shifter Kart Advice

I currently have a CRG. I use to have a Mitox Tony Kart and I have to say, the CRG is the best chassis I have ever driven. I have even tried a Birel, Track Magic and Tony kart Trulli edition and again the CRG has been the best. As for the motor, stick with a 125 CC Honda Motor, do not get an ICC motor, very expensive to maintain. The Honda are built proof, easy and cheap to maintain.

Vic

 

I dont have any personal experience with a shifter but I do with a 125 Rotax. If you are just getting started you might want to look in to the Rotax class as well as the shifters. They are still very fast but much easier to maintain and better to learn on. The thing that sold me was that the maintainence was much less on the Rotax and that the motors are sealed. It makes the racing more driver dependant than amount of $$ spent on the kart. Regardless of the way you go, alot of people feel that you should buy a chassis that your local shop sells because of the ability for service/parts and help with any setup issues you may have. Hope this helps and good luck!

 

Gwat,

From a setup sand point, it is very easy to tune on. It is more forgiving. One little change is not going upset the chassis. It adapts well to changes, whereas with the Tony Kart it is so hard to take caster out of the kart, it typically has alot more front end bite. Same thing with the other karts. As for 50mm axle vs. 40 and 45, technically 50 mm is better for a shifter, but then again it is personal preference. I hope this helps, if you have any other technical questions, just send me a personal message and what I can do is forward you to my mechanic, he knows best.

Vic

 

I have raced karts since '97 at the national level in Germany and the USA. The reason I mention this is that I have come to learn a lot about karting and have seen many newbies jump in (sometimes at the wrong end). Here are my tips:

General:

- buy a kart and engine package from a well-regarded, service oriented local kart shop that will frequently be at your local kart track...this is more important than chassis type and motor. Almost all the chassis (there are literally hundreds out there) can be tuned to be fast by people who know the chassis, but even the best chassis without the proper knowledge (ex. seat positioned wrong) will handle like a pig

- like cars, the better known brands are easier to sell on the secondary market

- shifter motors: if you are going to race in a series, the ICC is probably the better bet as moto racing is declining quite dramatically. if you are going to just do it as a hobby, then you could probably get a better deal on a moto pkg

- new versus used equip: if you are just starting, then a good used package (1-3 years old) from a reputatable shop is a better way to go. It takes most people at least 1 season to get fast in a kart. Once you are with .5-.9 sec of the fastest drivers, then buy a new package

- axle diameter: if you are a hobby driver 40 v. 45. v. 50 does not matter. The 40mm stuff will be cheaper, the 45mm will be hard to find. If you are going to race, the 50mm and you will need 3-4 different "stiffnesses"

- karting info: go to www.ekartingnews.com there is no better karting resource in the USA. Check out the classified section to get a sense of what the real used price of set-ups are

- tires: if you are hobby driver, go with a good medium/hard compound and run them until there is nothing left. If you are going to race, buy new tires for every serious regional or national race...and every 3rd club or local race. Get the tire pressure right (get a recommendation from your kart shop) and start low and build up

- baseline set-up: do not buya kart unless the kart shop gives you all the specs on a baseline set-up and the range of 1st and 2nd adjustments to make to the kart. Make sure they set the seat to your body size and height...this makes a huge difference.

 

all good advice. in my experience we just went to summit point and within a hour several guys offered us whole rigs for sale. kart, trailers, spares. electronics and training for under 7k. these where 100cc yamahas, fast enough for an old fat man, not shifters though. so i'd say go to the track you will be running most of the time and look around. it won't take long for someone to try to get you set up. not sure where you're located but the woodbridge karting club is a teriffic outfit to get hooked up with in the mid atlantic area.

 

If you don't mind me asking, what series did you run in? In addition, do you still race?

 

A few years ago I sold my racecar and went to karting for a few years while my son was a newborn, the idea of being able to practice, qualify and race in the same day really appealed to me as I had limited free time ( and money). I have since gone back to SCCA racing. I mention this because karting is very hard to do well and set up and upkeep on these things is a lot. I can tell you that buying a kart that is not supported by your local kart shops @ the track is a big mistake, their help for a new comer is so valuable you will not believe it. Also, take a look @ the classes @ your local tracks to make sure that you will have a lot of people to race with, running around by yourself will yield very little fun, plus you want to make sure that your weight and height will not kill any chance of running well, fat and old will be the death of you in most karting classes. I have seen many folks make the mistake of buying a shifter kart as a first kart, I would strongly suggest that you start with something else. The driving learning curve in karting is very long and steep and trying to figure it out while working on gearing, carbs, tires, axles, tire pressures, alignments, seat potion (the single most important things on you kart to get right) is crazy. It is the top level class of the sport for a reason, and it would be akin to jumping into any pro level sport with little to no experience. I, too, love to work and tune cars and you will have plenty of chance to do so at any level of karting that you will join, trust me on this point. If you still think that shifters are right for you, rent one first. You might be surprised @ how much work it is to drive one. The Rotax class would be a much better starting kart class in my opinion for someone new to karting, plus you can not beat the self starting motor, try that in a shifter (lol).

All the best

Chris

 

You are making the right decision. In my opinion karting is the best form of racing. It's the best place to start racing. I been karting for about 5 years at the regional and club level. It has me thought how to adapt to a racecar quickly. It also improves your reaction time and your racecraft. . I have kart raced against some good racecar drivers and beaten them because they have a hard time adjusting. A good karter will be faster in a car than racecar driver will be in a kart. It also gets you in good shape because of the G's and of how fast things are happening. From a financial aspect, like you said, it is the most inexpensive form of racing. As you mentioned you have a 360 Stradale and I am sure you do not want to worry about putting in the wall. This is the great thing about karting, if you crash it does not cost you thousands of dollars. I guarantee that once you start karting, it will be very easy for you to push your 360 stradale to the limit without crashing.

 

Listen to this guy.

His advice has been the best so far of the two threads pertaining to karting.

In addition, I would also recommend NOT starting with a TaG kart. 28HP is still too much for a beginner. Start with a Piston Port or Yamaha Can. Also, those who think they are good enough to start with a shifter are vastly underestimating the competition. The fastest shifter guys are lightning quick in a TaG kart too- Chad Dokken is just as fast, position wise, in his shifter as his TaG kart when he races TaG- and he is the current NRRS shifter series champ...

For the 4/ fans, TaG also includes them- the Biland 250cc TaG is the most popular of the 4/ packages.

I currently race the WKA National Road Race Series (enduro) in the Spec 125 Sprint class and have consistently placed in the top 5 throughout the season, higher on drivers' tracks, lower on power tracks.

For the NRRS, shifters are split between ICC and WKA classes and also split further in the WKA class with WKA bodywork and CIK bodywork, with a big group of WKA shifters- moto engines, CIK bodywork, enduro seats... Some very, very, very talented racers in that group. The guys who jump in with little/no experience usually get demoralised very quickly.

Get a chassis that is supported by the series you are racing. For me, my choice is the Rocket- supported by Russell Karting/Kirby Derby who are at all the races I go to. I have two karts- a long wheelbase "speedway" chassis, and a regular chassis. In my class a 32mm shifter chassis is the fast way to go. People in this class win on both 40mm and 50mm axles, choosing the right stiffness and chassis setup tune is far more important that the size of the axle. For me, front brakes are necessary because I tend to trail brake- but for others, dual rear brakes are enough (and lighter). The class minimum weight is 375lbs- driver+safety gear+kart. Most people are over that limit by at least 10lbs.

The Spec 125 Sprint class is exciting... Imagine 30 minute races, on car tracks, consistently hitting over 5g's in lateral acceleration, drafting in multikart packs up over 100mph... You always have someone to race with...

Ekartingnews forums are good to learn from. Go to the TaG forum. Go to the Road Racing forum. Go to the General Forum. Go to the Two Stroke Forum. Ask questions there.

Most people here won't know that much about karting.

 

Good advice from GTRPower and Pmonto.

I agree that something like the 125cc Rotax ("Formula Rotax") class would be a good place to start. The reason I wouldn't recommend shifters to start with is that non-shifters will teach you how to driver properly... as in the correct line, steering technique, etc. With a shifter you can cover up poor driving by downshifting to power of out your mistakes. Mess up in a non-shifter, and you lose more time.

Once you've mastered a non-gearbox class, then its time to add gears to the equation.

 

As I agree with you on a 125 non shifter is a good way to start, I don't agree with is that a 125cc you can get away with poor driving. That is a misconception. I also race in the WKA Manufacturers west coast series in 125cc shifter ICC class. Yes you can get a way with a mistake on 125cc shifter, but it is alot harder to drive than a rotax. Rotax does teach how to be smooth, but you can't drive a 125 shifter the same way as a rotax. There are quite a few drivers who have a hard time making the transition from rotax to a shifter. For one, a shifter is alot more violent to drive, its less forgiving. Everything is happening much faster. You are dealing with so much more power which becomes more physically demanding. The rotax is good just to get the basics down, but once you mastered it, don't expect to get into a shifter thinking you are going to go fast right away. I do recommend starting in a rotax, but do not stay with it for very long, move to a shifter as quick as you can.

 

Yes, I know they're more difficult to drive. But my point is that, as you mentioned, non-shifters teach you to drive smoothly. If you mess up, you'll know about it (because of the lost time / speed). Whereas if you're a beginner in a shifter, the added ferocity and power will make it feel like you're going fast all the time, and the added complication of managing the gears will make it very difficult to concentrate on your steering technique.