Sf90 resale prices?!

That may be the case, but I’m not sure there’s linearity to make the comparison. There hadn’t been a spider version with their halo V12 GT cars in a very long time. Thus, they’re very popular and most owners (including me), won’t part with the car unless or until the F167 is available as a spider. Moreover, the 812 is also the last analog V12 GT…

In addition to an SF90 AF spider, I also have a 296 GTS. In Europe, the 296 is seeing heavy depreciation. It hasn’t hit here yet in the U.S., but there’s no doubt the thud will be heard here as well.

 

OT - Dodge Rams will be on sale as long as the company remains solvent. Then, who knows. As to the 296 vs SF90, if I can fit in a 296 then I would prefer it first as I don't care about the supercar looks over around town performance.

 

The last bit is interesting and probably true for a lot of high price items. So the question is - is that market still as flush as it was? Bc if not, doesn't matter what the sf90 is or isn't, there won't be enough buyers.

It's one thing to go into debt to finance a 360 Modena but do that for a $600k car is probably much more complicated. Especially at 8% rate or even 6%.

But the market has proven me wrong many times and the number of half a mil cars being sold, new or used, boggles my mind.

 

I had no reference to any auction or fire sale, simple price observations (all asks are declining year over year). The SF90 Spider asks are also lower, initially all were at or above $1m, now the highest (autotrader) is $899 and many in the 700s and the number on the market is nearly triple a year ago (28 currently on autotrader).

Seems there is quite a bit of speculation in your concluding comments...

I have no idea where prices for the SF90 will land in 5 years, but, I suspect it will be lower than now...

Let's revisit this in 2 years or so and see what's settled out at that time...

 

Please understand, for USA, the 812SF production was right about 1100 total, never, at any point, were 20%+ of those on pre-owned market, not even once. I am excluding the 812GTS.

I do not know of any other Ferrari model, at any time, that "enjoyed" 20%+ of its production concurrently being offered on the pre-owned market, was there one besides the SF90?

The 296 is another issue, so many of those cars leave their owners stranded (many shown in social media for Euro customers), no wonder it is having issues besides being a tight cabin and uncomfortable for taller drivers. And, remember, due to EU regulations (2019/2044), the 296 had to be 'sold' to customers there before the July 6 2022 regulation deadline, so Ferrari had to force the 296 into production to benefit from being an 'existing' model and having more time to comply, thus, Europe enjoyed far greater (early) production and USA is still catching up. Just looking and it appears that Euro pre-owned are averaging 100K less than comparable USA cars and far less available in USA than across the EU. And, worldwide there are more SF90(550) for sale than 296 (450), that's interesting since production volumes vary greatly (about 550 SF90 on the preowned market, that's about 25% of total "stated" production..so, not just a USA reaction) (site: theparking.eu)

 

It's pretty telling when Ferrari, incognito, is bidding on its own cars at auction to prop up secondary market prices.

A page directly out of the Patek playbook.

 

I’m curious…which hill are you trying to die on here, droning on about the same thing as though trying desperately to convince folks who don’t care? Do you own an SF90, 812 or 296? If not, which Ferrari’s do you currently own?

 

I come here looking for more SF90 content and all I see are discussions on values, this is ridiculous, the explanation is very simple, speculators and ballers on a budget, interest rates went up all "the ballers" are running towards the fire exit doors.

If values keep you up at night you have no business buying a Ferrari or any other exotic for that matter.

The car is amazing, I absolutely love driving it I never walk up to it thinking I wonder how much it is worth today LOL.

 

Ferrari incognito running around (registering) at auction houses with signed checks that has no amount ... makes percent sense.

 

The clue is in the thread title … “SF 90 resale prices”

and your comment about “if resale prices keep you up at night you have no business …” is pompous and out of touch. Many Ferrari enthusiasts stretch financially to buy their dream car and are very invested in the secondary values and the changes in them.

 

Assuming much? You know me how? LOL

Just as a quick aside for you. I have started from zero with no support and I have built my business in a foreign country while supporting my parents and siblings plus families abroad (which I still do) and you are calling me out of touch and pompous. You do not understand financial responsibility and living within your means.

I can not be more in touch even if I tried, the ones out of touch are those indulging in frivolous spending and then publicly lamenting their financial constraints.
That's not how you should navigate life, stretching your budget like hot chewing gum stuck to a hot pavement just to ride in style. It's like trying to fit a champagne lifestyle into a lemonade paycheck, please don't bring this up as an argument again, the whole point of my comment was that Ferrari isn't life saving medicine and one shouldn't put strain on their budget in order to acquire it but you got triggered and it flew right over your head.

 

You may not like it but that doesn't make it true. We all work hard and we all stretch to achieve -
SF90 750k - in interest taxes insurance etc is 100 - 150k add depreciation.
These are just cars - if you can't justify - don't and if you can - do.

 

Just to pile on…

1982 I talked a salesman into letting me drive a 308. Man did I love that car! I was single so who cares if I just eat beans and rice!! Did all the calculations for taking a loan and 35% down. Slept on it a while and then decided it was foolish and bought a Toyota with my saved down payment and no loan.

Almost 30 years later after raising kids, no fun cars etc., I was able to get into my first fun car. It was a 911. I could not quite afford entry into the Ferrari market for a couple more years. Fortunate enough to have enjoyed the marquis now. Only once have I broken even on a car. If I am worried about resale, I have over extended myself financially. Not interested in doing that.

I hardly think that is a pompous stance.


Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat

 

Everyone is coming from different places. What unites us is the passion for Ferrari.

Do you know anyone who bought any thing- maybe it's a house- and it didn't quite work out? Worrying means you are paying attention. No one knows it all, so it's ok to look around and get a read on what's going on in the market place.

I doubt anyone would criticize a friend for buying a house and then he is complaining that gee the landscaping costs more than I realized? How about insurance- how much has that gone up.....

What if you just left your money in the bank over the past few years- what are those dollars worth today vs let's say 2015? I think they could buy you about 30% less.

We are in a time of a lot of changes and adjustments. There are probably more to come.

 

The hill is the SF90 is very odd in its resale, never before (that I can discern) has such a high volume of overall production been listed for sale on the pre-owned market (20% +) contemporaneously.

That is quite curious, especially for the Flagship. Flippers exited the market years ago, whose left are real owners, some are quite passionate about the SF90 despite all the recalls including do not drive order and other "birthing issues". But, many are not (for whatever reason) and that is notable.

 

Do you own an SF90, 296 or 812?

 

You must have missed my earlier post. It looks like total US SF90 production numbers are closer to 2,000-2,200, which would translate into around 7% of them (not 20%), currently being offered on the resale market, which is outstanding.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/149520542/

 

Check your private messages

 

I see

Another approach:

Europe sales for first 3 years:
https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/ferrari-sf90-sales-figures/

2020 34
2021 643
2022 690
-------------
1367

if 2023 had about the same, then 2000 or so for Europe

USA is less than Europe
Page 93 of Ferrari's 2022 Annual Report shows about 31% of total overall production was Europe and USA/NA about 26%.

So, if all things are even, then if ~2000 SF90 for Europe then 1677 for USA (with USA being about 83% of Europe). I have no idea if USA production was that strong in 2021 (there were no MY2020 deliveries since first release for USA was in late CY2021, so MY2021 was first for USA).

If accurate that would mean about 6450 SF90 produced worldwide, a very healthy number. Surprised Ferrari let its production end with no replacement in sight. That also means there is no flagship model in production...

And, if accurate, of the 150 Coupes+Spiders currently for sale, that would be less than 10% of total production and that would mean the SF90 pre-owned market is about the same on a percentage basis for its other top models.

So, good news for the SF90 market

 

Yes. Even using your approach, which I believe is most conservative of the two, the pre-owned percentage is on par with other models, as you stated.

But I think my approach is probably more accurate, which beats the other models by a couple of percentage points.

 

Almost makes we want to buy one...almost

 

In fairness…this is the value thread. The title itself makes that plainly clear.

 

Thank you I can actually see that, I have commented on the value thread in my second part of the comment hence on topic, my first part of the comment was related to the fact that “value” discussions are peppered through out a large number of topics relating to the SF90 so instead of finding proper content on driving opinions, living with the car, available mods, adventures in the car the majority of the commentators are discussing the doom and gloom of buying the SF90.

IMO that takes away from the enjoyment of being involved with the car and it does a disservice to the community at large which is looking for guidance information and feedback on this forum.

Lots of people with no first hand knowledge and without owning the car or living long term with it are constantly bashing it therefore tainting the experience and at the same time misinforming which is the biggest issue for me.

The issues I have with judging cars (unless they are utilitarian vehicles) on their monetary value when trying to quantify their actual worth for their intended purpose is the fact that you can not make an accurate judgment without bias, creativity comes from having no strings attached to value and cost, I always tell my architect, draw with no budget in mind we will worry about making it affordable later, art is the same and I consider these cars as art or at least in the same category something useless which brings you joy.

I understand the nuances and the purpose of this fairly useless thread after all I am a business man I deal with values on daily basis, my point is, we are on a Ferrari forum talking about a Ferrari flagship an unnecessary acquisition of a very costly car which can only transport two and has no booth space, if value retention is your concern or it drastically affects your life you shouldn’t be involved with the car, I know there is a lot of sensitivity in the world at the moment, this isn’t an attack meant to trigger anyone, it’s just my opinion, detracting from the marvel/genius the SF90 is simply on its market value fluctuations based of your financial ability/inability is doing a disservice to the brand and the community and doesn’t tell you anything about the car itself which is the reason why we are ultimately here to talk about, that’s my opinion anyway you boys carry on I wish you the best of luck with acquiring your dream car at whatever budget makes you comfortable, I will now bow out of this thread so you guys can carry on.

 

I like what I just read. I agree with you overall. If I am spending so much money on a car I am going to drive so much of it. If I can't afford to drive it, it probably means I could not afford to own it to begin with. I had 15k miles in each of my FF, Lusso, and 458. Just added 2k miles to the 812 GTS in 4 months. 6k miles in STO. Currently looking at SF90 Spyder. Was just worried about the battery warranty as it will be my first hybrid and I am pretty clueless about it.

 

I have around 9000 km on my Spider and the only issue I have had so far was a frozen dashboard interface, pulled over switched the car on an off and it came good, I figured I give it the iphone treatment LOL

The other issue which frustrates the hell out of me is the Bluetooth connectivity it never worked, the car is currently getting the annual service done and I have raised the issue with the dealer but I am not holding my breath, I do carry a wire with me so I can hard wire the phone, other than that it has been flawless.

I look after the car but at the same time I drive it I am not saving it for the next guy so in other words it isn't a garage queen so far so good so based on my experience I would advise you not to be too worried about it.