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Seattle PPI ?

Discussion in '308/328' started by Yo328, Sep 9, 2014.

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  1. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #1 Yo328, Sep 9, 2014
    Looking at a 3x8 at Ferrari of Seattle and wondering if a separate PPI is necessary. FoS says they do an over 100 point inspection on every car and will share the information with me. They have already given me a little information and I am awaiting an email with the list of service needs. Judging from their reputation on Fchat it seems like their service department is recommended for PPI,s and is pretty highly trusted. The car is on consignment.
    Thanks in advance for your advice and opinions.
     
  2. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #2 Yo328, Sep 9, 2014
    Just received their full report. I have to say I have nothing but respect for FoS. Very detailed report that covers everything. Everything I have read about them must be true.
     
  3. ceb39

    ceb39 Formula Junior

    Sep 17, 2012
    483
    San Francisco Area
    Full Name:
    Chuck B
    #3 ceb39, Sep 9, 2014
    What records from previous owners have you looked at for this car, if the records are available. Looking at these records can help you determine what was done to the car and how well (or not so well) it was maintainced.

    Missing records can come back to bite you. I am missing the records from the 1st and 2nd owner of the car I have now. Although the guy I bought the car from (the 3rd owner) had his records, and I can see what was done to the car. Those missing records can leave doubts in your mind. Since I am pro active with my car, if I can not see a record to determine if something was done to the car, I will have it done. More expensive that way, but I have no desire to be stuck along side the road.

    Curious question. You say the car is in Seattle and from your location you are in Sothern California. How did you get hooked up with this car? Assume you have seen it and driven it, correct?

    As with all these older Ferrari's I would advise that you have an extra $5K in your back pocket to take care of surprises you might encounter once you own it, if you buy it.

    With regard to the PPI. I would say yes. You want someone who is not associated with the sale to look at the car. He is going to be working for you and looking out for your interest.

    Remember, caveat emptor.

    Good luck
    ceb39
     
  4. TacElf

    TacElf Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 15, 2010
    1,713
    Seattle area
    Full Name:
    Jeff
    #4 TacElf, Sep 9, 2014
    Give Carlo at Alfa of Tacoma a call - easily searched for on the web. You would have to work it out with FoS to ship the car there all at your cost. In the end you'll thank yourself many times over. Carlo is well known around here and is expert at these older models.
     
  5. uberlink

    uberlink Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2012
    777
    Twin Cities, MN
    Full Name:
    Mark Johnson
    #5 uberlink, Sep 9, 2014
    +1 for Carlo. Did a great PPI on my last 308. He uses a very thorough form to ensure that all systems are checked and rated and provides great comments.
     
  6. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #6 Yo328, Sep 9, 2014
    Thanks for the input. After looking at the $28k estimate of repairs needed by FoS I am passing on this car. Too much of a project and I am sure the numbers would climb higher as the work began. Found the car online and did this research before going up there to see it. Again FoS saved me a lot of time and money by sharing their inspection with me.
     
  7. david

    david Formula Junior

    Feb 21, 2001
    805
    Northwest
    Full Name:
    david
    #7 david, Sep 10, 2014
    FoS did a PPI for me years ago. At the time, the car I was looking at seemed fairly OK. I knew that there were some issues, but I wasn't too concerned. FoS looked it over and gave me a complete and detailed report plus they explained to me what the impact of some of the discoveries would be. They ended up saving me a lot of time and aggravation. I ultimately passed on the car. A year or two later I saw that same car in at Carlo's. He was doing some work on it. I asked him about it and he just was shaking his head in dismay. I guess it was quite the basket case.

    My guess would be that if FoS sold you a car, they would stand behind their quality inspection. And my guess would be that their quality inspection would cover every thing you could imagine and then some.

    28k of service repairs sounds pretty daunting. If you were a do it yourself guy, it might be a project, depending on the price of the car, but it's way too much if you bought the car and had FoS bring it up to speed. Sounds like you made the right move.
     
  8. energy88

    energy88 Three Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 21, 2012
    31,387
    West of Fredericksburg, VA
    Full Name:
    John
    #8 energy88, Sep 10, 2014
    I just did a quick check: If this is #79968, then, $64,900 + $28,000 = $92,900

    OUCH!
     
  9. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #9 Yo328, Sep 10, 2014
    Yes that is the car and that is why I passed. It is amazing to me how many neglected cars are out there where the owner wants to sell at a non-neglected price. They should deduct the money they did not spend on caring for the car off the price since it is still in their pocket. You can't sell a car at Condition 1 or 2 prices if you did not invest the money to maintain it that way.
     
  10. ferrame

    ferrame Formula 3

    Mar 2, 2005
    1,196
    Orange, Calif
    #10 ferrame, Sep 10, 2014
    What kind of repair that added up to $28K?
     
  11. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #11 Yo328, Sep 10, 2014
    Tires
    All bushings very poor shape
    Shocks need rebuild or replaced
    Major/belt service
    Coolant hoses
    Heater hoses
    Fuel hoses
    Seat back hinge repair
    Tach only reads half of actual value (could be tach or ignition module) estimate is to diagnose.
    Turn signal wiper signal stalks and switch need rebuild. Stalks ready to break
    Oil pans gearbox leaking. New seals and epoxy sealing
    A/C inop
    Radiator requires rebuild
    Heater cores similar condition to radiator
    Climate control panel works erratically. Dignose only in estimate.
    Windshield washer pump failed. LH washer nozzle broken

    All this totaled 28k and of course it will climb as you get in and dignose a few issues. I know dealer prices are higher but it is quite a list.
     
  12. TacElf

    TacElf Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 15, 2010
    1,713
    Seattle area
    Full Name:
    Jeff
    #12 TacElf, Sep 10, 2014
    That's a ton of "needs" for nearly $65k asking price. Definately a pass at that level.
     
  13. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #13 Yo328, Sep 10, 2014
    I believe the seller is willing to fix things depending on price but I am not at the point of wanting to play that game. Thanks to everyone for all the feedback.
     
  14. GrayTA

    GrayTA F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 25, 2006
    15,129
    Deep South
    Full Name:
    PDG
    #14 GrayTA, Sep 11, 2014
    Yikes! Thats scary for a repair bill...



    PDG
     
  15. SpyderGT

    SpyderGT Formula Junior

    May 15, 2005
    997
    Vancouver, BC
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #15 SpyderGT, Sep 11, 2014
    Agree that $93K (65 + 28) asking seems out of line, even with the apparent increase in asking and selling prices of recent months, for what would presumably be then top condition car . Interesting to note that the CarFax suggests the car has only been driven 2130 miles since Feb 2007. Maybe that's where the market is going.

    Jon
     
  16. NW328GTS

    NW328GTS Formula 3

    Nov 16, 2009
    2,191
    Washington
    Full Name:
    Hal
    #16 NW328GTS, Sep 11, 2014
    Having done all those jobs myself on my 87 GTS... my cost of parts for bushings, hoses etc. was $2500-3000. My tach even did the same thing so I replaced it myself. But, all that being said, FoS does really good work but not for peanuts. They will tell you everything the car needs and will include what an owner "should" do. They notice my wiper stalk is cracked every time I bring it in. Its the owners call what gets done and unless its safety they wont even argue. They will charge you for Ferrari branded parts unless you specifically request they get them elsewhere.

    Any car that is 25 years old needs most of this work just due to age. Asking $65K for a car that needs this basic maintenance based on age is ridiculous no matter how pretty it looks and how low the miles are... No recent belt service and asking $65K?!?
     
  17. Yo328

    Yo328 Karting

    Jul 26, 2014
    181
    Brentwood CA
    Full Name:
    Yoram Limor
    #17 Yo328, Sep 11, 2014
    I agree. Asking that much with no belt service is high. As a buyer I have to assume $10k for a belt/major service. I have read that they run $5k-$10k and most have averaged around $7k-$8k. I think I can do some of the maintenance myself. That is what I like about the 328, I can enjoy doing some of the work.
     

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