SDL with new hyperflows, new rear o2 sensors, changed oil and reinstalled right temp | FerrariChat

SDL with new hyperflows, new rear o2 sensors, changed oil and reinstalled right temp

Discussion in '348/355' started by drbob101, Apr 6, 2014.

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  1. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #1 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    When installing the cats ( hyperflows) , I noticed that someone had not installed the temp probe on the right side. I had new headers put in last summer but the cats weren't changed so I have no idea who or how long it's been like that. I reinstalled everything and put in two new rear o2 sensors.

    I had taken the car for a brief drive last week just to warm up the trans and changed the trans fluid and oil and no issues.

    So everything is hooked up, starting the car, letting it warm up ( a bit to long, but temp is not elevated at all). I have a sdl.

    Where do I start with this now?

    Thanks for any help.
     
  2. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #2 fatbillybob, Apr 6, 2014
    SDL I assume you mean slow down light

    You start by shooting an IR gauge at the cats to make sure they are in the right range not doing crazy things which would imply the SDL is real.

    Lets assume the SDL is a ghost then take the R T probe back out then driving the car to see what happens. Someone may have left the T probe out because you have a fault in the system and they knew it and did not want to fix it. Most likely it is the T probe aka thermocouple or the SDECU assuming your wiring is good. Do not run the car without this system because you are running cats. If this turns off the light you got a problem in the system to solve.

    You can read my thread on the subject which tells you how to bypass the SDECU. You can use that knowledge to trouble shoot which SDECU the problem might be on by using that knowledge to selectively turning on/off the SDL figuring out which side is bad then which SDECU or which probe.
     
  3. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #3 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    Yes. Slow down light. Mine is blinking.

    I have shot the temps with the laser thing and both sides are basically identical and I don't think out of range.

    I'll do that with taking the probe out. Will the sdl just go away or is there a reset procedure like obd codes? I did turn off the battery switch for ten minutes or so and the sdl was right there on restart.

    Could it be as simple as the thermocouple itself? How do I check it, or just replace it?

    Thank you fbb
     
  4. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
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    #4 johnk..., Apr 6, 2014
    SDL should go off when the cat cools.
     
  5. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #5 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    Was just talking to Dave about that. I'll start the car in the morning and see if it's there
     
  6. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    #6 yelcab, Apr 6, 2014
    If you have OBD2 read the codes and see what it says.
    Then, attach a ground wire to the body if the rear O2 sensor and see if it goes away after you reset the CEL
     
  7. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
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    #7 johnk..., Apr 6, 2014
    Bob, from your first post, are you saying that prior to installing the new cats the TC was not installed on the old cat? Then when you installed the new cats you installed the TC and after letting the cat idle you get a SDL? That sounds like it may be the cat ecu. Hard to believe you could over heat a cat while letting the cat idle. That may be why the TC was not installed before. A TC junction either works or it doesn't. The SDL will only come on or flash if the cat ecu thinks it senses a high voltage. But a TC junction can not put out a higher voltage that physics dictates. The cat ecu amplifies the TC output so I would think the most likely suspect is the cat ecu. You might want to read this thread for reference. http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355/378429-thermocouples-slow-down-lights-related-cel%92s-how-conquer-them.html

    P.S. I'm not saying that you should replace the cat ecu. Just that it is a likely place to look.
     
  8. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #8 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    Correct John . Rt cat Tc was not installed. Just hanging there. I connected everything correctly including two new rear 02 sensors. On sitting there idling today. Sdl came on. I will check temps with Laser temp reader tomorrow.

    I'll check what Mitchell said as well.

    Thank you
     
  9. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
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    #9 johnk..., Apr 6, 2014
    No CEL, just SDL. Right?
     
  10. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #10 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    No cel. Just sdl
     
  11. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #11 drbob101, Apr 6, 2014
    I did plug in obd and cleared 4 codes that had not created a cel though.

    Right now there are no cel. Just sdl. Which I will check again in the morning when cold.
     
  12. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
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    #12 johnk..., Apr 6, 2014
    So what were the codes? (They may have been left over form the past.)
     
  13. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #13 drbob101, Apr 7, 2014
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2014
    Started the car this morning and sdl is blinking. Took probe out, still blinking although I didn't expect that to do anything.

    No cel , but two codes. 1449 and 1451.

    The cat temps are pretty much the same at around 275 after idling for ten minutes.

    Troy at hyperflow told me if I had any issues he would work through them with me, so I'll bring him into the loop today as well.
     
  14. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #14 drbob101, Apr 7, 2014
    Just left it idling and cel came on. 1449 1451. Cat temps are high 200s. , muffler body is 1100????? How:does that happen? Maybe as it just sits there and idles with no air flow? Wow
     
  15. johnk...

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    #15 johnk..., Apr 7, 2014
    If I have the codes correct 1449 is a cat temp code, bank 2. Diagnostics say check TC, cat ECU, and wiring. 1451 say secondary air pump, check wiring. I doubt this has anything to do with the cats. Maybe when you re-installed the TC you pulled a on a wire to the cat ecu.

    The way I tested these is to pull the cat ECU and probe. Connect power to the ecu and then monitor the output as you heat the TC tip with a torch. It should behave as in the thread I pointed to. It's not important that you know the temperature of the probe, just that to ecu output increases as the probe heats up.

    Also, before you go out and buy a Ferrari TC you can pick up a TC for testing the ecu for $31. THMK-T06L06-02 | Type K Thermocouple Probe: 316 SS, 6 inch length

    Cats 200, muffler 1100??????????
     
  16. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    #16 yelcab, Apr 7, 2014
    Make sure that you insert the Cat thermocouple into the Cat TCU and the Bypass valve thermocouple into the Bypass TCU. They are identical and easy to make a mistake.
    I would also check the validity of the 1000F temp of the muffler. Seems awfully hot.
     
  17. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #17 drbob101, Apr 7, 2014
    AT this point Mitchel I haven't touched the ECUs or the connections to them.

    All I did was install new cats, new rear o2 sensors and reinstalled the right probe into the new Cat as I found it was just hanging there on the old cat.

    I will get under the car and check the ECU connections though. I never had a SDL in the 3000 miles I put on the car since I owned it with the OEM cats and maybe that TC probe uninstalled.
     
  18. johnk...

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    #18 johnk..., Apr 7, 2014
    You could have broken a wire in the TC lead when you moved it around to re-install it.
     
  19. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #19 drbob101, Apr 8, 2014
    Ok I checked all the wiring for probes and plugs on ECUs and all is intact. I noticed that I have green ECUs for the TC, right and left, and the third ECU higher up is black. Iwould guess thats original and the others have been replaced. I have a receipt for one from the PO a couple years ago.

    In a thread in the tech area I read that someone cleared an SDL by clearing the codes on the OBD reader. I thought that the SDL was independent of the OBD, code wise, but I went out this morning and cleared the OBD codes and the SDL went away as well.

    So now I am back to square one, that being no codes, no sdl and the right probe out of the cat. I will put the probe in and get some miles on the car and see what comes up again and starting tracking it down.
     
  20. johnk...

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    #20 johnk..., Apr 8, 2014
    You have me confused. I though you cleared the codes previously and the SD light stayed on and the codes reappeared???

    Drive it and see what happens. What's the worst that can happen. Insured for fire, right? :)
     
  21. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #21 drbob101, Apr 8, 2014
    That is what happened. I dont think this stuff follows logic and objectivity to well.

    Initially, the sdl came on, no CEL. I checked the OBD and it said two codes (no cel mind you), I cleared the codes and the sdl stayed on.

    I took the probe out, sdl still on, engine warm. CEL now comes on. 2 codes.

    Overnight cool, next morning. SDL on (blinking , all sdl above were blinking), CEL on, two codes. I did not try and clear anything that was yesterday.

    Today after reading thread in tech area, start car, sdl, cel, 3 codes. Cleared them, cel and sdl go off.

    This is where I am at now.
     
  22. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #22 drbob101, Apr 8, 2014
    I am going to start by pulling the ECUs and using Jevs instructions and a heat gun, check the outputs of them all and the TC as well.

    Does anyone have any old ECUs around that they think are no good.? I would like to see if I can repair them as Jevs outlined with fixing the solder joints. I will return them to you fixed if I am successful.
     
  23. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
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    #23 johnk..., Apr 8, 2014
    Hi Bob,

    I had a fellow chatter send me a bad cat ecu. When I tested it, it did not work. I opened it up and removed all the potting compound and all the pins were soldered fine. There had to be something wrong with one of the components. I did not attempt to fix it as it's all surface mounted devices and a fairly complex circuit. There are also a couple of potentiometers that I suspect are used to set the sensitivity or the gain of the TC amps. Since I have no idea what they should be set at there wasn't much point in trying to fix it.
     
  24. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #24 drbob101, Apr 8, 2014
    I didnt think it would always be as simple as the connector solder joints. Thanks John.
     
  25. TrojanFan

    TrojanFan F1 Rookie
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    #25 TrojanFan, Apr 8, 2014
    I had to replace my cat ECU. It wasn't working and was cracked from the long term exposure. It was one of the originals. Apparently the new ones are a different color (green vs brown) and are easily distinguished from the old ones. With the block itself cracked and warped, didn't seem like it was going to be a good candidate to repair.
     
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