Ron Dennis forced out? | Page 5 | FerrariChat

Ron Dennis forced out?

Discussion in 'Other Racing' started by Anthony_Ferrari, Feb 27, 2008.

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  1. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

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    Maybe even more than that this year, after that fine?
     
  2. barbazza

    barbazza Formula 3
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    I believe you're right about that.

    Personally I don't want to see Ron go. Max Mosley is the real villain in F1, not Ron Dennis. The more yes-men like Flavio that Max has around him the easier it will be for him to dumb down the sport and turn it into a spec series.
     
  3. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ
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    +1 I would rather have a Ron Dennis or Frank Williams around any time than either of those two other bozos. Besides, Enzo Ferrari, Colin Chapman, and Ken Tyrell the other Team Owners (Principals) are a footnote in history. History will include RD and FW with the former Principals for their acheivements of excellence.
     
  4. Tifoso1

    Tifoso1 F1 Rookie

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    Not sure I am understanding your statement here correctly, can you please explain what you mean by this ? Are you saying that Ferrari, Chapman and Tyrell are only a footnote in history as oppose to RD and FW, that you consider to be in another catagory above over the trio ? Thanks.
     
  5. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ
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    Hey Anthony not at all, I am saying that I feel that RD and FW will go down in history of Formula One as the Ferrari, Chapman and Tyrell of their generation as opposed to the countless individuls such as Eddie Jordan and different team principals of the Independent Teams.
     
  6. Tifoso1

    Tifoso1 F1 Rookie

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    Now I understand, the first comma threw me off.

    RD and FW certain does belong in the same catagory with Ferrari, Chapman and Tyrell. While we are on the subject, I wonder how will history see Todt in 20 or 30 years. I think Todt is in the lead if we only goes by winning percentage, but I am not sure if I had rank him that high as a team principal tho.....
     
  7. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    He managed what nobody was able to do for 21 years before. And then continued on with the winningest streak in Ferrari's history. So regardless what anybody might say about his style, his place in the history of F1 as well as Ferrari is guaranteed.
     
  8. Tifoso1

    Tifoso1 F1 Rookie

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    But I wonder how much of his success at Ferrari will be overshadowed by M. Schumacher and R. Brawn, especially if Brawn does indeed transforms Honda into a powerhouse.
     
  9. Whisky

    Whisky Two Time F1 World Champ
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    The original Fernando

    But TODAY, what is an independent team ?

    Non-factory backed ?

    Also, Frank Williams was an independent team owner in the beginning, he ran March chassis on his team.

    But no, the independent teams of today look nothing like what we remember of independent teams of the 60's and 70's, those days have been gone since about 1986 at the very latest, when you were pretty much FORCED to align yourself with a turbo-motor supplier.
     
  10. yzee

    yzee F1 Veteran
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    Whitmarsh said I won't be Judas. Are they looking for Judas? Old sponsors are worried by the spy stuff. New sponsors are reluctant. $100 million is not chump change, even to these guys. I don't care who owns what but Mercedes Benz is not happy. I always liked Rd's efficiency and success but the golden goose is LH and MB is worried that this crap compromised his marketability. This man stepped in the wrong hole at the wrong time. Meet the new Todt.
     
  11. IanMac

    IanMac Formula 3

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    I think LH came out of it pretty much unscathed and I doubt that MB have any concerns about his marketability. If they are worried I think it's probably a general concern about having their brand associated with McLaren. Assuming they want to get rid of RD they will need to get another shareholder in their corner and whether or not they can do that is arguable.

    I'd be disappointed to see RD go. He's got what it takes to run a team at the top of the sport and there aren't too many of those around.
     
  12. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

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    If Merc were that bothered they could stop supplying them engine's, IMO they need each other. Bad press makes the headlines and Merc was in headlights, but could stand back and say "it aint nothing to do with us gov".

    The spying/data theft would have probably happened whether Ron was at the helm or not ..

    BTW Ian, Andy Murray the young scot, hats off to him beating Federer AGAIN.. :)
     
  13. bowbells

    bowbells Formula Junior

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    Don't forget the days of DeTomaso and Piers Courage back in the day for Frank. A true "garagiste" as Enzo liked to call them.
     
  14. IanMac

    IanMac Formula 3

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    I thought about the engine supply angle and presumed that MB are contracted to supply them until some specific date in the future and that it might not be possible for them to terminate that contract immediately. I agree with you that MB can remain at arms length from the controversy and that they're unlikely to be harmed by it.

    Yes, a great result for young Murray - Britain's next great hope for a Wimbledon title? ;)
     
  15. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

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    So -

    Is there any fire here, or even any smoke? If not - then pour some gas on it.

    Let me go on record to say that I have a deep aversion to this arrogant egomaniac.

    I simply do not understand the continual sympathy that some (particularly those who choose to incorporate the fine name Senna into their handles) have for this plastic grocery bag of cat waste.

    This junk about him being up with Ferrari, Chapman, Brabham, or whatever needs to stop.

    Have we forgotten whom his team was named for? And the shame he brought upon that fine name?
     
  16. It's Ross

    It's Ross Formula 3

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    You are spot on about RD and the silly comparisons. All I would add to your characterization of RD is the word "steaming" before cat waste.
     
  17. IanMac

    IanMac Formula 3

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    Arrogant egomaniac? F1's full of them. Take the arrogant egomaniacs out of FI and you'd have no F1.

    As for comparisons with Ferrari, Chapman and Brabham, RD's record of WCC and WDC wins speaks for itself. And at least two of those you appear to be citing as exemplars were far from being angels. For example, Chapman was arrested for being involved in a massive fraud and would probably have ended up in jail if he hadn't died.

    I find it difficult to understand why people get so hot under the collar about McLaren 'cheating' when it's very clear it has gone on forever and that virtually every team does it or has done it.
     
  18. Senna3xWC

    Senna3xWC F1 Rookie

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    +1

    you got to it before I did. Excellent post.
     
  19. Tifoso1

    Tifoso1 F1 Rookie

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    With all due respect, regardless of Mr. Ron Dennis' personality, his achievement in F1 should not be over looked. He and his Project 4 group was asked to take over Team McLaren because they were a sinking ship after the untimely death of Bruce McLaren, he took McLaren-Project 4 team to another level and since then, has historically been able to reload his team with more than capable engineers, drivers and align his team with engine manufactures to put them in position to challenge for the title. Team Lotus, after Chapman's death, can only wish that they were as lucky to find someone like Ron Dennis to take over the team.

    Let's also not forget, the late Enzo Ferrari, whom most of here, all hold dearly to our hearts as Ferrari or F1 racing fans, he too was considered to be a real bastard by many, just ask Carroll Shelby and Ford. IMO, it isn't right to judge Ron Dennis by what happened in 2007, just like it isn't right to judge Senna's career by the Suzuka incident in 1991 or Schumacher's career at Monaco in 2006 etc. One may not have to like any of them, but one should not deny them of their greatness in what they were able to achieve.
     
  20. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

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    OK - then...

    He is a plastic grocery bag full of warm oatmeal cookies, and is on a plane with Elvis, Ettore Bugatti, and the Queen Mother.

    So, is he to be declared IN or OUT?
     
  21. IanMac

    IanMac Formula 3

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    What are Elvis, Bugatti and our wonderful queen mother doing on a plane, they're all dead. Oh, that kind of plane! ;)
     
  22. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

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    Yes, that kind of plane.
     
  23. R2112

    R2112 Formula 3

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    (IIRC) wasn't RD one of the few key people who made the Mclaren F1 roadcar project come to fruition? I may not like or respect some things he has done but I do give him props for his part in bringing the world the Mac F1.
     
  24. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

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    And here I have been mistaken that it was Gordon Murray
     
  25. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

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    +2
     

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