Race car insurance

"Race Car Insurance" is a bit amorphous

In our case, our race vehicles are listed under our "collections" policy, which is part of our homeowners policy. Essentially, my wife's jewelry, my one "nice" watch, my daughter's race karts and our race/track vehicles are covered at an agreed value. We don't own art or antiques, but that would also be a listed item under a collections policy.

This coverage on the cars/karts is essentially just for theft, fire, etc etc - not for any damage incurred from use.

In our case, our insurer (AIG PCG) also provides an additional policy that provides coverage for on-track use and damage. Our coverage is for DE for all of our vehicles, and specific coverage for testing and racing of the race cars.

A lot of people get insurance from specialty providers - eg. Lockton provides a lot of coverages, some annually, some per event, for DE events. K&K is another. Both were actively recruiting customers in the paddock at the Rolex 24 this year. Seems very popular in PCA DE. It's expensive, and I believe the limits are $100K. There quite a few out there.

I have heard from horror stories about the claims experience with some of the less established providers. AIG has been astonishingly good, I've heard Lockton is pretty good.

I've used AIG for my old Porsche GT2 race car, a Fiat Abarth ITB, F430C (race), 458C (race) and an upcoming MX-5 Cup car. We've also used our street cars for DE.

Some people will argue that self-insuring is the way to go, and if you go on track, you should be prepared to write off the car.....which has merit, as "sh_t happens" even if not your fault. Track insurance is expensive, and a similar debate to an extended warranty. However, I like the peace of mind that a "financial airbag" of insurance provides when I'm actually trying to go 10/10ths in an expensive car. (We are 7/10ths when in street cars doing DE, max)

Hope this helps.

 

i use MIS Motorsport - Race and Rally Insurance Specialists | Home (Lockton Group) for my 458 GTE

 

Shannon's in Australia cover my Challenge fully comp agreed value apart for the time its on the track racing.

 

I know it doesnt answer your question and you'll think I'm a ****** but I gotta say it...

Insurance co's are in business to make money. They take the risk of you crashing times the expense to repair, then add in all their overhead and costs, and then add in a profit. In short it never pays to insure something unless:
1. you are secretively a much higher risk profile than the average person -- you know something about yourself that the insurance co doesn't.
2. a claim could cause a severe financial harm that you are unable to handle (i.e. a multi-million dollar lawsuit, you get cancer and get $1MM of healthcare costs).
3. You are forced to get insurance (i.e. if you have a mortgage).

If you dont fall into one of the above, there is no reason to ever get insurance. If you have a race car, write it off with out a worry and be prepared to regularly spend $30K on a weekend after you include some occasional repairs and issues.

If you owned an insurance co would you write a policy for a race car? Hell no! Unless I knew I was charging WAY more than the real cost to take the risk of insuring it. In short, race car drivers dont insure and if you do you'll be paying way more than the risk of self insuring.

 

well you said it. I"m unsure what your actual experience is with racing and/or insurance in racing is. I've been racing for 16 years, and have always had some form of insurance on cars I've owned, cars I've driven and liable for, and even rented.

However, I believe you're a stand-up guy for paying for the damage at the Lucas School, so good for you...

1) of course insurance companies are in it for a profit.

2) their ability to cover race (or, track) related damage has to do with the aggregate risk and premium pool. Believe me, your history and resume are factored in, other than the "retail" DE policies, which are more group-centric.

3) I guess you would be surprised to learn how many "racers" (or, their teams) carry insurance even at the high end pro levels. It's just good business sense. The deductibles are pretty high, and the policies are expensive, but when you tub a modern GT car or a prototype, it's more like catastrophic coverage. Bumpers? Doors? etc, you wouldn't make a claim with race coverage, but you'd probably do that with a street car dinged in a DE event.

4) as I said, "s__t happens". I've had friends destroy cars due to a tire going bang at top speed. I also like to hedge my bets and have every advantage, which includes "peace of mind" that allows me to attack a corner with less worry about "what if....". Again, if you're a Ricky Bobby, any coverage you get will be prohibitively expensive.

 

Great thread. Does anyone know of anyone in Australia that does track day insurance coverage as opposed to actual races?

 

Entropy, your response doesnt change a thing I said. If you want to pay more than the calculated risk, that is your business.

Just because you do it doesn't mean it is fiscally sound.

Just because insurance is available doesnt mean it is a good deal.

The bottomline is by definition, insurance never makes sense if the potential damage doesnt inflict significant harm to you. And if you are racing Ferrari's you have no business racing them if a crash inflicts significant fiscal harm to you.

If you can afford to race Ferrari's I cant see why you would ever pay the premiums to insure (and deal with all the paperwork to get the policy and the paperwork when trying to collect).

But like any financial matter, your business is your business. I'm just gving my perspective on insurance.

And yes at Lucas I crashed and caused damage to two other cars. Everyone is responsible for their own cars, regardless of fault. I paid for everyones anyways because I realized I was the cause. Also because I knew it was no sweat to my wallet and it would have been a big deal to the other guys (one was young man who won the school in a contest, the other was a writer for Road & Track). Like I said if you cant afford to pay without a thought, perhaps racing is not the think to do

 

Yes, My car is insured for track days only at $100 per day with Famous. Must be a CAMS sanctioned event. Max payout is $10,000 with $1,000 excess

 

Thanks for the answer. I will check them out although a max payout of 10k doesn't cover that much. I guess for a $100 it's a great safety margin.

 

I may have taken this down too much of a philosophical path.

1) yes, because I do something doesn't mean it's the right thing for everyone. Having said that, I think many would be surprised at the amount of "insurance" (in multiple forms) that is in place in active racing, mostly carried by people who can well afford the cars to begin with.

2) agreed, insurance coverage at all is irrelevant unless it protects you against meaningful risk. (that's one reason why many have high deductibles on policies). "meaningful risk" is highly variable. I have and will continue to spend amounts on racing I really don't want to think about, especially with some of the modern GT cars. The cost of racing per year is a multiple of what the car costs! Having said that, I'd rather not risk vaporizing $300K by demolishing a car and just walking away, when there are hedging options. A $5K Spec Miata? yes. A $60K old Porsche DE car? sure. If you're comfortable risking $300K-600K on a high end car, good for you. (or, whatever your tolerance is).

3) in terms of throwing good money after bad; the insurance I have essentially means that if I pay the full premium for 10 years and have zero claims, I'd be hosed. Of course, the odds of me going 10 years without a claim are about zero. So far, if I balance out all the premiums and deductibles paid vs. when i've had to make a claim, insurance has been a good thing financially. I like to think I'm far from frugal or cheap, then again I hate wasting money for no good reason. A bit part of the motivation is "peace of mind", which is by definition not logical.

4) last, the insurance policy I have for racing is part of my overall package bundle, with all of our other coverages (homes, cars, liability, collections, flood, etc). I really have no paperwork to do, and when I've had to make a claim, the insurer was first grade; the biggest hassle was waiting for the car to get back to the shop for them to verify the damage. Candidly years and years ago, I did buy one DE coverage from Lockton, it was online and took about 10 minutes; however I"ve never had to make a claim with other providers so have no basis other than I've heard a couple horror stories.

OK, so back to the thread....

 

BTW for that sort of coverage, Hagerty is a good option...my experience is the typical insurance providers sometimes struggle with setting the appropriate values on unique or race vehicles (which is actually why my agent has us on a collections policy).

good luck

 

Hagarty for STP stuff (plus car shows, etc) and Locton on track. You can add tools and other garage equipment with Hagarty. Guess there's no perfect option yet I hope this combo is good when needed.

I used to use USAA for the 360CH and it wasn't covered as soon as it left the garage. No TP (of the STP), so it ended real fast and I went with Hagarty.

 

My apologies for being a *****. After re-reading the thread I didnt address the OP's question and I didn't come off as intended. I should have listened to my inner voice and kept my mouth shut.

 

Quite the contrary, IMHO debate helps learning. You have a valid PoV (everyone is entitled).

"Insurance" is both a financial and emotional thing. I take (big) risks all the time, then again I refuse to gamble (but will accept the free drinks in the casino).

All good.