Anyone here own one, or thought about it ? I found this cool Sabre site with a chart of the surviving flyable and non-flyable airframes. http://f-86.tripod.com/index1.html I was just curious what it would cost to buy one and fly one. I could never do that, as I don't have anywhere near the coin to do so.........but there seem to be lots of examples flying at airshows.
for private jet ownership wouldn't it be better to go the L-37 route, much cheaper to maintain and easier to fly.
Keith, A classic jet warbird operator mentioned, that the easiest part of the entire experience, is the initial cost of the warbird. The words buckets of money, were described to give people an idea, what it costs to operate a jet warbird - the writers words. Forget a moment about FAA requirements, insurance and jet fuel costs. What about parts that will have to be fabricated or located from remote corners all over the world ? I also heard putting together all of the FAA paperwork requirements, is a lot of fun. I am sure it can be done. I guess the cheapest entry level airplanes, are the Fouga, L-29, or something similar. As far as a sexy Mig-17 ? A pilot commented, that landing the thing, was like walking into a room, while trying to balance a broom handle, on the tip of your finger. Nice jet warbirds can be found for 100K or less. The problems are the fuel, minimum FAA requirements for PIC,, and a host of other factors etc... I guess you can always run it out of another country, with a long runway ? My guess, unless you have a lot of dollars and a willing boss, the T-28B/C/F, is the best bang for your buck (80% of the performance of a P-51 for 20% of the price).
Plus you are less likely to run one into an ice cream parlor, which killed private ownership of jet fighters for quite a while. http://www.check-six.com/Crash_Sites/Sabrejet_crash_site.htm Taz Terry Phillips
Thanks for posting that Terry. I remember that crash very well and never heard the cause. I never knew it never even got airborne.
Brian, bdelp- I arrived in Sacramento in December 1972 as a 2Lt for navigator school at Mather AFB. The story was still huge when I arrived and was widely discussed among those who had anything to do with aviation. It was a real tragedy and completely caused by pilot error by a rich guy who had no business flying a high performance aircraft like an F-86. Note he killed himself in a P-51 not too long afterwards. Fighters are all different in how they fly and a really thorough check-out in simulators, which did not really exist then, and the aircraft needs to take place before turning anyone loose in one. To give you examples, on take-off in an F-4, rotation was usually accomplished by pulling the stick back into your lap to get rotation. On the F-111, you pulled back gently but firmly and as soon as the aircraft rotated and lifted off, you pushed slightly forward on the stick to assume the proper climb attitude. We flew evaluators on the TAC IG team in the left seat of F-111Ds at Cannon AFB in Clovis, NM. Sitting number two for take-off, my aircraft commander and I watched an F-4 pilot evaluator take off in an F-111D. As soon as rotation speed was reached, he sucked the stick back into his lap and the Aardvark literally leapt into the sky nose-high. You could see the IP in the right seat grab the stick and quickly lower the nose before the aircraft ran out of airspeed. The aircraft staggered as it flew down above the runway before the 40,000 lbst took over and they were able to climb out normally. This performance was from a highly trained F-4 instructor pilot with over 2000 hours of F-4 time (he bought a lot of beer at the O Club that night). Now turn some yahoo loose with 500 hours of flight time, none in jet fighters, lots of money, and no feel at all for what was happening. Recipe for disaster. Taz Terry Phillips
Yes, there are private Sabrejets. You might want to check out the Classic Jet Aircraft Association. There's a message board with owners on it. Traffic's slow, but that's expected when jet owners are even less common than Ferrari owners. http://www.classicjets.org/index.html
It's 'Bonanza syndrome': wealthy doctors/lawyers with more money than flight hours buy high performance aircraft. The aircraft then get a bad reputation as 'doctor killers' because they're being piloted by people who aren't quite ready to fly them.
One of my favorite F-86 is the one that the Planes of Fame in Chino, Ca. flies around on the air show circuit. http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=5945558
An old friend was a Navy A6 pilot who was on the Forrestal when it burned. Just after that he was reassigned for a while to NAS Alameda as a maintenance test pilot and got to fly most or all of the Navy tactical jets in use at the time and I recall some of his stories of how vastly different you needed to handle different aircraft. I recall especially his respect for Crusader pilots ability to bring one in on a carrier. He said he tried to make every landing like a carrier landing but he said "Boy did I burn up a lot of runway getting an F8 down". He wound up with quite a bit of F8 time for someone who was never combat qualified in them and loved flying them but never felt great about doing an elegant job of getting one on the ground.
On a lighter note....at Temora NSW recently a bunch of dedicated warbird restorers were rewarded the other day by getting their Sabre into the air....should be a big hit at airshows downunder
Bob Hoover does some nice rolls in an F-86 in this video. Supposedly filmed in 1961. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRt6UnNzR6I
The Australian CA-27 Avon-Sabres were real hot-rods. Incidentally, do not take my remarks to mean civilians should not fly jet fighters. No reason why highly qualified civilian pilots should not be able to handle one with the proper training and instruction. Taz Terry Phillips
Terry...... One of my clients here in Calgary owns 3 of the Czech L-29 jet trainers (I've posted pics here before). They cost him $500K USD each, totally refurbished with glass cockpits, etc, no hot seats allowed though........employs 2 ex-Romanian air Force techs full time to service them and has an ex-Marine F-18 pilot training him how to fly fast jets. He is already a competent pilot with his Cessna Citation. Ahhhh........to have that kind of money.
http://www.calgaryherald.com/life/Gallery+Sabre+visit/1809416/story.html Here is a gallery of photos from the F-86 that flew in to Calgary yesterday. I saw it take off this morning.........pretty cool indeed. The color scheme is that of the RCAF Golden Hawks demonstration team that disbanded in the 60's when the F-86 was taken out of service. Question for you pilots out there.........so you've got a hot jet......I am assuming that you have got to file a flight plan and basically truck along in controlled airspace just like a 737........correct ? No zoom climbs, split S or Immelmans permitted.......you have to stay within your corridor.
Kds- As long as you file VFR and stay below FL 180 (18,000'@29.92) in uncontrolled airspace, you can do all the aerobatics you want within certain limits for built up areas. Do not know the legalities of private pilots using MOAs (Military Operating Areas), but their use would allow a pilot to perform aerobatics at altitudes above FL180 if the MOA controlling agency approved its use and it did not conflict with military operations. Aircraft can fly VFR through MOAs below FL180 and IFR if ATC can maintain IFR separation with other traffic. For you civilian pilots, are there areas similar to MOAs and SUAs you can use for aerobatics? Taz Terry Phillips
Unless I'm mistaken, the civilian aerobatics requirements are: basic VFR visibility, 1,500' AGL (except for pilots with low altitude waivers for airshows), not in congested areas or over groups of people, not within 4 nm of the centerline of a federal airway, and not in surface areas of class B, C, D, or E designated for an airport. We have an aerobatic box over NE North Carolina with nice section lines and no houses that is not near any airspace or airways. I always wondered if anyone has a privately owned F-104. That would be a handful!
