Plumbing new house...copper or pvc?

I would put copper in my home, easy to repair and lasts forever.

 

Copper is still required by code in my neck of the woods.

Not saying it's better, but it's code.

DM

 

PVC or ABS is typical for drains. PEX (cross-linked polyethylene) with crimped fittings is becoming common for supply lines. It can be color-coded red for hot and blue for cold. It's easy to fish through walls and is frequently run like wiring where each fixture has a "home run" back to the main where everything connects to a common manifold with shutoffs.

Still hard to beat soldered copper but both materials and labor will be more.

 

I've seen CPVC piping in Wisconsin (not sure it's code approved in Minnesota). I've used PVC (functionally similar) for aquarium plumbing. It's very simple to install but except for soldering, not much different. In new construction I would expect labor would be quite similar to copper. I wouldn't cut any corners on my house but I do the labor either way.

 

as a GC, my advice,
besides being more expensive, copper is no longer the more durable choice, PEX has caught that up....of the PEX types, make sure to buy brand name (there are cheap i.e. china made, versions)....stad-vega PEX is best IMO.....go with stainless crimps....the combination will last!

in one house reno, we re-did all the plumbing (everything + the old aluminum wiring) and while at it, the budget savings allowed us to pull an extra line with each branch put in (for future repair, etc)....also PEX can come in color code (red & blue)

as for CPVC, avoid it at all costs IMO

 

I would prefer CPVC or PEX over copper. Copper doesn't react well with many municipal water supplies and has more likelihood of failures in my opinion. It also conducts heat really well so you are paying to heat the pipes with the hot water, and it has a propensity to accumulate condensation if exposed in the right conditions.


BT

 

true, copper is also more prone to thermal (expansion/contraction) fatigue & accumulating deposits from water supply....CPVC joint adhesives are a potential ingestion source, and are not durable as PEX

 

I've never seen any significant corrosion on copper in potable water systems. I wouldn't say it can't happen but it's pretty unlikely. It's used on roofs and gutters and lasts for generations. Copper also has inherent anti-microbial properties. It's high thermal conductivity is IMO it's biggest weakness but pipe insulation sleeves are pretty cheap and easy to install.

CPVC is rigid like copper and can get brittle with age. All the cemented joints are a question mark.

One thing about copper, it's not all the same. It comes in different wall thicknesses, identified as K, L & M. "K" is the thickest (and most expensive), "M" is the thinnest (and cheapest). The thicker the pipe the more durable. Fittings work with all three sizes.

I've used PEX on a few recent projects and it's impressive how quickly it can go together. If the fittings are crimped properly it looks like it will last indefinitely.

Of course nails and screws will put a hole in any of the three choices.

If PEX is code-approved in Wisconsin it seems like your contractor is behind the times.

 

for the most part yes, but copper does corrode, and in every reno of an aged property we've done, the copper piping does have accumulation on the I.D....the failures i see in copper pipe is freezing (it's suseptible to) and ruptures from fatigue (a big problem in our current condo building)....of course i'm coming across all negative, copper is a great plumbing material, but IMO going PEX is a no brainer from a GC perspective

i'm not a CPVC fan, even where it is code accepted, some will require the system be flushed thoroughly before considered drinkable!

 

I build homes for a living. My thoughts are driven off of my experiences in the areas I have built, and I haven't built where you are.

My residential construction is governed by the International Residence Code , called the IRC. Local area can apply other codes or specify specifics for there areas of governing. The IRC doesn't specify any one of these over the other.

CPVC is used when hot water is involved, over the typical PVC. You can tell the difference between them, as CVPc is cream and PVC is white. When we plumb with PVC materials, we plumb all the potable water lines in CPVC. The drain lines will be in regular SChedule 40 PVC.

Copper is expensive and has become even more so over the last several years. The costs of metals is driving this. I do not feel the copper pipe is superior to CPVC product. However, it does seem to have a public perception as being so. Even though the cost of copper is much higher, you will still pay more than that spread to get a builder to install it, even if they offer it as an upgrade. Copper theft is a MAJOR problem. I had over $100k in damages in an eleven day period between copper and electrical wiring theft. The cost of that risk is absorbed somewhere.

The PEX system is a good system but very well marketed and trumped up to be better than it is. The biggest selling point is the fewer number of joints. It is easier for a plumber to install, so they like it to. The manifold is the biggest difference in PEX systems. The cheaper version is just a central manifold where all the lines run through. The more expensive version has cut off valves. More material and more fittings but the better way to go.

There ae other systems too, but if your builder doesn't offer them, they aren't worth you asking about because they will be more expensive than you most likely would think they are worth.

I think each of these systems is good and has it's own pros and cons, but I wouldn't say the copper is definitely worth the additional amount. I am about to start a new home for myself and I am using a PEX manifold system with the cut off valves.

 

Out of curiousity, what was your deciding factor?

 

I am a small custom home builder , working near Philadelphia for 30 + years . My preference would be to use all copper piping . It looks more professional , and all fittings are soldered tight . I have used Pex in one or 2 homes , and thought it looked cheap , all of the manifold valves are also plastic . I am nervous as to how all the fittings will hold up over time as they are crimped on ? I have also had the unpleasant experience of arriving at my jobsite and seeing all of the copper removed at night as well as the copper rain gutters . We hired a night watchman to patrol the site .

 

Good choice. If $600 is all the upgrade costs, you will definitely reap the benefits (even if only a perceived difference) at resale.

 

i'm surprised at the small margian of difference, to be honest.......in any costing of our work, the diference is larger, as copper price (locally at least) is notable from PEX.....we don't (won't) use CPVC

lola - we use only copper manifolds and stainless rings for pex...using brand name pex (like stad) makes the difference too.....i hear you on the "copper mining", that business is booming!