Please, Someone Tell Me, What Is The Purpose Of Drifting? | FerrariChat

Please, Someone Tell Me, What Is The Purpose Of Drifting?

Discussion in 'Other Racing' started by RP, Apr 6, 2007.

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  1. RP

    RP F1 World Champ

    Feb 9, 2005
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    Don't wish to be old fashioned and stodgy, but can anyone tell me the purpose of drifting? Other than a way to use up tires.
     
  2. maxorido

    maxorido Formula 3

    Jul 6, 2006
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    Jim
    Well for one thing, it's very fun to do. Secondly, when organized in a competition it's a display of great car control, and a bit of an art. I'm not really into watching those sort of competitions, but ever since I started practicing handbrake turns around corners, I realized it was great fun.
     
  3. LongJohnSilver

    LongJohnSilver Formula Junior

    Apr 15, 2006
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    Let me start off by saying that I don't follow it, but I have seen a few events on TV and read a little about it. I have taught myself to not compare it to racing. It isn't really anything like it. It is just a pure demonstration of car control. In some forms, one car will "fight" with another car. One car leads, setting the pace while trying to get the most style points as possible. The other car tries to stick his car right on the others side, pressuring him and matching or beating his style points. They then switch places. Whoever does the best as determined by the judges over the two runs wins. They move on in a bracket style event.

    I think a good analogy is speed skating to figure skating. Both use some of the same skills but in different ways. Speed skating is all about speed whereas figure skating is all about style.

    Basically, its purpose is entertainment, just as racing is. It just entertains different people in a different way.
     
  4. Remy Zero

    Remy Zero Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2005
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    ask the Japs, Ron :)
     
  5. 1_can_dream

    1_can_dream F1 Veteran

    Jan 7, 2006
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    Definitley not racing, but fun to watch and obviously not easy to do.
     
  6. Remy Zero

    Remy Zero Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2005
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    i think the goal of drifting is to 'lose control of the car and get it sideways with style'.

    normally, they measure the scores by the amount of rubber burnt, amount of smoke the tyres produce, and for how long the driver can hold the drift. of cos, no points for slamming in the wall :)
     
  7. jknight

    jknight F1 Veteran

    Oct 30, 2004
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    Central Texas
    Ron - I agree with you - it's rather stupid in my book!

    Carol
     
  8. maxorido

    maxorido Formula 3

    Jul 6, 2006
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    Jim
    You have to admit though, it is a great display of car control. If you ever take a ride with someone doing it, you might realize how fun it is.
     
  9. waltk88

    waltk88 Formula Junior

    Jun 10, 2004
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    Boulder, CO
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    Walt K
    It's not racing, but it is spectacular to watch. I attended an event last summer. I didn't have high expectations, but ended up being well entertained for the day. Well worth the $40 ticket price!
     
  10. DGS

    DGS Six Time F1 World Champ
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    May 27, 2003
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    On dirt, gravel, or snow, where you have to manage your momentum, it can be the quickest way around a tight corner: look at handbrake turns in rallye.

    On pavement, it's a way to sell more tires. ;)


    There was a japanese show segment on youtube a while back where they invited Gilles Panizzi and a japanese rallye driver to run laps against a pair of japanese GT racers around a local track in a Mitsu EVO. It was interesting to compare the two different driving styles.
    Found it: Part one two

    And the GT drivers were complaining that, by the time the rallye drivers were done, there wouldn't be any tread left on the tires. :p ("Try using the brake some time!")


    Drifting as a "sport" is a bit like a form of auto gymkhana we used to do when we didn't have a rally lined up: you'd see how far you could drive down between two narrowing lines of cones without hitting one, or hang a plumb bob from the bumper and pull up to a point to stop with the weight (hopefully) hanging over the X-ring of a pistol target lying on the ground. (Think about hitting your pit spot from a flat run down pit lane.)

    For us, these were fun little car control exercises we could do at an informal get-together in a parking lot when we didn't have anything better lined up.

    But I guess take any recreational activity, and somebody will start applying formalized rules and scores and then sell tickets to "events".

    http://cars.ign.com/articles/777/777735p1.html (And yes, they're wrong about calling it "first ever" -- for those of us who used the term back in the '60s and '70s.)
    http://www.dgtrials.com/about.php

    Of course, back in the RWD rallye days, we used to say,
    "If you're pointed where you're headed, you're going too slow." :D
     
  11. jknight

    jknight F1 Veteran

    Oct 30, 2004
    7,821
    Central Texas
    Topic of discussion while I was feeding dogs this morning . . . John reminded me of a photo of Fangio in a drift. His rear wheels straight into a turn with front turned left so that when coming out of turn he was headed staight at the fastest speed - this was in his Maserati GP car. The World of Outlaws is another example of drifitng with some 700 hp, direct drive . . More obvious in sports car of the 60's than of the circuits and racing today. I guess in summary, how soon we forget that drifting was a part of racing instead of what it is now.

    Carol
     
  12. menoy

    menoy F1 Rookie

    Mar 12, 2005
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    I think you have to differentiate between a controlled slide, of which the purpose is to carry speed through and out of the corner and what is considered today as a separate sport and is called drifting. Its true that although it might have originated from efficiency - trying to take a corner as quick as possible (which in certain cases was by letting out the back), but has now become smth totally different. And I think this is the drifting that's the subject of the thread. To me the word "drift" has all too easily forced out any other description of a controlled slide ending in misunderstandings like these. Did the guys of Fangio's time refer to it as a drift? (genuine question here - although I bet the answer is "no").
     
  13. EVILZ33

    EVILZ33 Formula Junior

    Feb 2, 2007
    258
    chicago
    longjohnsilver pretty much nailed it on the head. ive attended a few events here in chicago and once im done building my car might try my luck at it but have drifted a few long turns on the street. it gets chicks too but driving a ferrari alone is good for that.
     
  14. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    +1

    There was a time in F1 when it was all the rage and people applauded Gilles Villeneuve for doing it in a Ferrari.

    Then there were the rally aces who thundered sideways on icy roads lined by fatal trees.

    Watch "2 fast 2 furious, Tokyo drift" and get a sense for it. What they're doing up and down that parking garage is just absolutely spectacular.
     
  15. DGS

    DGS Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Formalized terminology seems to have come in with driving schools. What's portugese for "drift"? ;) (I think it was usually called "sliding".)

    But seeing what they've turned drifting and gymkhana into makes me wonder when we'll see another "sport" leading to "Fast and Furious: Parallel Parking". :p
     
  16. b-mak

    b-mak F1 Veteran

    Count me in, Ron and Carol.
     
  17. greg328

    greg328 F1 Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
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    I personally find it juvenile and wasteful.

    Pure auto racing is not about sliding, it's about NOT sliding around!

    I know, I know, drifting is not considered "racing". I'd like to see a drifting "race". I bet there'd be a lot less "drifting"!!

    Greg
     
  18. EVILZ33

    EVILZ33 Formula Junior

    Feb 2, 2007
    258
    chicago
    that made alota sense....:)
     
  19. DGS

    DGS Six Time F1 World Champ
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    GT drivers try to keep it inside the friction circle, in order to preserve the tires. You didn't see a lot of slides in F1 during the tire wars, when the tires got dangerously thin to reduce weight. With the spec tires, you might see a little more of it.

    But when you get off the clean dry pavement, you're racing beyond the friction circle, and sliding is part of every turn. If you kept within the friction circle, you'd be much, much slower. (When you're outside the envelope, that's when it really gets fun. :))

    In GT, running laps over the same course is about hitting a fast pace on a corner repeatedly, lap after lap. When you hardly ever see the same turn twice, you're ad-libbing around the turn, and there's a larger "good enough" window. Sliding isn't good for repeatability.

    It's theoretically possible to slide turns on pavement to push the speeds up past the friction limits. But you'd shred the tires in only a few laps. And you wouldn't be able to do a corner the same way lap after lap. (Unless you were Fangio or GV.)

    And I think it says something about modern tires and suspensions that, in the GT vs rallye exibition I mentioned above, that the GT drivers and the rallye drivers (sliding the turns) posted exactly the same best lap times on a paved track.


    But I think the modern popularity of "drifting" came with the proliferation of FWD machines. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I can't imagine any kind of "real" racing with an FWD machine. Blowing smoke and sliding around is about all they seem suited for.
     
  20. maxorido

    maxorido Formula 3

    Jul 6, 2006
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    I don't think so. It became popular over in the states long after it did in Japan. The main reason it became popular over here is because of Import oriented media publications were showing it through video and magazines, because it was different to American audiences and kids nowadays seem to like anything Japanese, so it caught on.

    First of all, it's not really sliding with a FWD is it? It's more like ass dragging haha. Secondly, the comment you made abot not "imagining any kind of real racing with a FWD machine" tell that to all the FWD touring car and GT car drivers out there. There are many FWD cars in BTCC, WTCC, Super Gt etc.
     
  21. ferraridude615

    ferraridude615 F1 Veteran

    May 4, 2006
    5,836
    Texas
    As I am reading this thread, I am watching Tokyo Drift. Really dont understand it, it just measures how well you can control an out of control car.
     
  22. waltk88

    waltk88 Formula Junior

    Jun 10, 2004
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    Actually none of the competitive drift cars are FWD. They are pretty much all RWD.
     
  23. The K Reloaded

    The K Reloaded Formula Junior
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    Oct 28, 2004
    570
    Los Angeles
    I've been watching the drift practice for the Long Beach Grand Prix both yesterday and today and I just don't get it. It's amusing when they lose it and hit something though.
     
  24. Fred2

    Fred2 F1 World Champ
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    Jan 2, 2005
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    So it sounds like Nascar, just without the racing.
     
  25. ajimbo

    ajimbo Karting

    Feb 27, 2007
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    Kelowna BC Canada
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    A Jimbo
    Did anyone ask for me?
     

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