Piston Ring Lubrication At Assembly | FerrariChat

Piston Ring Lubrication At Assembly

Discussion in '308/328' started by sepino, Aug 3, 2009.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. sepino

    sepino Rookie

    Apr 14, 2008
    39
    Northern VA
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Greetings,
    I am installing new Wiseco pistons and rings in a 1981 GTSi . Is there a recommended method for lubricating the rings/ pistons assemblies prior to inserting them in the sleeves ? Is there a concern with soaking the the piston / ring assembly in synthetic motor oil before compressing the rings and installing them in the sleeves?
    I have been told that lubrication should be limited to WD-40 around the ring and piston since motor oil trapped in the grooves will cause glazing and ring seating issues on initial start up.
    Any thoughts?
    Regards,
    Mike
     
  2. st@ven

    st@ven F1 Rookie

    Aug 4, 2008
    3,294
    Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Steven
    soaking a piston in oil before installation is nice.... if you were assembling a compressor.

    In an engine the lowest piston ring (oil scraper)is intended to keep the oil away from the top ones (the compression rings).
    You want to top ones ( which indeed wil become very hot) as dry as possible.

    Using wd40 is not a bad idea i think but when you instal the pistons from the top you could simply apply some oil on the cilinderwalls. That will do the job too. Soaking won't

    good luck!
     
  3. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,825
    Full Name:
    Mike 996
    #3 mike996, Aug 3, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2009
    Install the rings on the pistons then just dip the piston with rings installed upside down in a container of engine oil. You don't need to dip any deeper than the wrist pin. After inserting the pistons in the bores, wipe the excess oil off the piston top. Many people advocate breaking in engines with conventional oil; use that if you are concerned. We broke in/ran all engines on Mobil 1 synthetic.
     
  4. tuttebenne

    tuttebenne F1 Rookie

    Mar 26, 2003
    3,207
    Bay Shore, NY
    Full Name:
    Andy
    My $0.02; There is nothing wrong with oiling all of the rings before assembly. I oil the walls and the rings with motor oil before compressing them. I would NEVER use WD-40 on rings unless I was trying to break them free before taking the piston out. I've seen that stuff leave too much of a deposit behind when it "evaporates" to want to use it in a new assembly.
     
  5. CliffBeer

    CliffBeer Formula 3

    Apr 3, 2005
    2,198
    Seattle, Washington
    Full Name:
    Cliff
    Motor oil on all three rings is the way to go. Yes, the bottom ring is an oil control ring but that ring still let's a fair amount of oil past (there is, after all, a gap where the ends of the ring meet and you should measure this clearance) so the top two most certainly do not run in a dry environment.

    Couple of tips that may be helpful:

    1. I assume you've had the cylinder bores honed? If not, big mistake to install new rings as the shoulder on the new rings will impact the lip on the bores related to the uppermost travel of the prior rings. If severe enough of a lip on the cylinders, the rings will break quite quickly.
    2. Offset the clearance gaps of the rings so they're not all in a row. In other words, with three rings, place the clearance gaps at 120 degrees to eachother.

    Good luck!
     
  6. 2000YELLOW360

    2000YELLOW360 F1 World Champ

    Jun 5, 2001
    19,800
    Full Name:
    Art
    If you oil the pistons and the rings, you'll have a while before the rings seat. When we were building motors, we'd oil the skirt of the piston, not the rings, and we'd get the rings seated within 10 miles or so. Of course that was for a racing engine, but the idea was the same.

    Art
     
  7. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,317
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    Dipping the piston in oil used to be accepted but its not anymore, at least on high end builds. There is a claim you get too much oil behind the ring which effects how it seals as well as once running the oil can cake up from the heat and carbon up in behind the ring. I pour a light stream across the rings and let it run around the outside and off before inserting the pistons. Also if you could get a proper tapered piston installing sleeve to install the assembly rather than a band you would be even better off because they dont put verticle scratches on the ring faces.
     
  8. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
    4,300
    Cape Town, South Afr
    Full Name:
    Jack Verschuur
    I have always just oiled the cylinder wall with a rag, as well as the band. Tapered sleeves are nice if they are made well, but I have also seen people break new rings in them. I never had the luxury of the sleeve, but the band has worked well.
     
  9. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,825
    Full Name:
    Mike 996
    Regardless of what method you choose of the various opinions about lubing the piston, BE SURE you individually check the piston rings for proper fit in each piston/cylinder and file them for the proper ring gap. Do NOT mix the rings for different cylinders. Measure/adjust them for each cylinder and keep them in the proper order for installation.
     
  10. sepino

    sepino Rookie

    Apr 14, 2008
    39
    Northern VA
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Thanks for all your suggestions. For what it's worth, the ring manufacturer, Wiseco, recommeded very light lubricants like WD-40 or even a dry lube. Unfortunately, I have seven of the eight pistons in place . So....... it looks like I need to contemplate doing it again !
    Regards,
    Mike
     
  11. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,825
    Full Name:
    Mike 996
    #11 mike996, Aug 4, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2009
    If the ring manufacturer recommended a specific method for his piston rings, use that method, NOT what any of us recommended. You did good, put the last one in the same way. In the shop we mostly assembled them dry because that's what the ring manufacturer we commonly used recommended. But dipping the assembled piston in engine oil will always work ok in the absence of specific guidelines from the maker. I guess I assumed that when you asked, there were no recommendations from the ring maker.
     
  12. sepino

    sepino Rookie

    Apr 14, 2008
    39
    Northern VA
    Full Name:
    Mike
    mike996,
    Thanks again for your help. And your assumption was correct. I installed the pistons and rings based on my past experience and guidelines from a few engine rebuilding books, including one for air cooled Porsche 911's. The suggested method was to invert and dip the piston / ring assembly in motor oil, coat the cylinder walls, and provide plenty of oil on the inner surface of the ring compressing tool.
    Anyway....I did seven this way. It got late, it was warm and humid, a little tired ...you guessed it, the eight one resulted in a broken ring.
    While ordering a replacement, I discussed the assembly with the tech rep who in turn recommended that the rings be installed "dry". I was a bit surprised, hence I posted here with hopes of getting better insight .
    With the replacement ring set I also purchased a tapered cylinder ring compressor tool. Now it's time to decide if removing & replacing the seven pistons with oiled rings is worth the effort....there is always the probability of breaking a good one and not knowing so !!
    Anyway, thanks again to all. It's always a pleasure to benefit from the expertise share here.
    Mike
     

Share This Page