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Not crappy replicas!!!!

Discussion in 'General Automotive Discussion' started by redhammer, May 28, 2012.

  1. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

    Jun 7, 2007
    4,267
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    Jack Verschuur
    Hit a nerve there, didn't I?

    My Ferrari was real, my Maserati is real, and you won't find fakes in my house either. Just for your info, everything on my wife is real too, but I'd be grateful if we could leave her out of the discussion.

    If discussing this yopic angers you to the extent that it apparently does, maybe it's better to stay out of the discussion: participating exposes you to the opinions of others who may not agree with your viewponts.

    I live in a country where counterfeit goods are extremely commonplace; they are illegal, but at the same time are imported, from China mainly, in such vast quantities that controlling it is near impossible. There's a strong trend out there, that if you can't afford the real thing, you just buy fake, and amongst certain groups of the population this kind of thing isn't even considered questionable. Nevertheless, it remains just plain theft.

    If that point of view makes me ******, so be it. Rather that though than a poser...
     
  2. jgriff

    jgriff Formula 3
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    Jun 16, 2008
    1,103
    Houston, TX
    If you look on Flickr for 355 photos there are a lot of bad 355 replicas. It's just so stupid. I feel sorry for the guys that own them. It's like a guy wearing a toupee. Just man up and be who you are instead of pretending. Replicas are the toupee of the automotive world.
     
  3. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 26, 2005
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    Jon
    Well put.
     
  4. furious_ferrari

    furious_ferrari F1 Rookie

    Nov 25, 2005
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    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bf52jNzNRjI&feature=plcp[/ame]
     
  5. redhammer

    redhammer Karting
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  6. redhammer

    redhammer Karting
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  7. Testacojones

    Testacojones F1 Veteran

    Nov 3, 2003
    5,139
    Terra
    I understand your point and also those of replica guys, as long as the badges aren't on the car and they don't pretend to be what it isn't.

    But to me this line says it all and it isn't an attack on you at all, but I just added a twist to it. You see, wealthy people buy the real thing to impress other people and that's ok with me, but as long as those individuals leave their ego really deep where it belongs.
     
  8. nathandarby67

    nathandarby67 F1 Veteran
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    Feb 1, 2005
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    Nathan
    This is an excellent point. I can only speak for myself, but if I ever were to buy a replica like the Proteus C-Type, it would have exactly ZERO to do with what anyone else thought or any attempt to impress anyone. I could not possibly care less what anyone else thinks about what I drive. I would simply be buying it because I liked the looks of it and thought it would be fun on a country back road. Hell, I'm a guy who has a Mondial 8 and an MG Midget in the garage...those are two of the most un-loved and least respected creations ever built by their respective factories! If me liking some of these replicas means I am only out to impress people with my purchases, I have certainly chosen poorly up to this point!
     
  9. Testacojones

    Testacojones F1 Veteran

    Nov 3, 2003
    5,139
    Terra
    Exactly, I almost bought a 917 recreation and have been looking for a Porsche 908 coupe recreation or builder. I don't care what anyone thinks of it, I know the car will make me happy and that's the end of it.

    I see people getting so frustrated every day and is really funny. The universe is so that even a real 250GTO is exactly nothing, hell, the whole planet and everything in it to a degree is just meaningless.
     
  10. dbw

    dbw Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
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    palo alto ca
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    dave
    someone's been reading hitchhikers guide to the galaxy just a bit too seriously.....:)
     
  11. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #86 boxerman, Jun 18, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2012
    Fakes and recreations, two different subjects,. Pur Sang, Lynx various GT40's cobras are pretty accurate recreations. On top of that the FIA now reckognizes recreations for racing.

    These cars are very different from fakes, ie plastic countaches etc.

    As for people driving something to impress others, I think that applies to most "real" ferrari owners. Most real ferrari owners cant drive for sh*t. All new ferraris are engineered to be daily's so aveage drivers can drive them, and nearly every one is red with sheilds. That is my friends for poseurs.

    So people who buy say a superformance GT40 are in my opinion real enthisiasts, because to actualy operate such a car, you have to have a clue and a bit of talent, not to mention the desire to go fast and youre not really impressing the great unwashed with it because they have no clue what it is. Nor did the creators understand branding or see it as art.

    What seems to be the differentiator here is that some peiople are real drivers so they have no problem with a recreation, because they are into the "experience" of the thing, what it really is, which is motive art and experience for the driver/owner, and they understand that technicaly and dynamicaly it is no different from an old build, save that some snobs have not run the price into the stratosphere as an investment. In thats ense recreation owners are very much like the original enthuisiasts who saves these rare old race cars.

    Other F car owners are into the image and projection of the thing, or what it "represents" how it looks to others going down the road, what it's worth etc, so to them a recreation or replica is a threat, it dilutes the image and tosses them into the pile of poseurs. I can say the worst part of owning a ferrari is the name and all it implies. When someone hear's you own one you are immediatly categorized with the 90% of Rolex wearing poseur owners.

    Real enthusiasts know that many if not all historic cars are at this point only partialy real. What is great is seeing them used and raced, not posed at a consours.

    Take wooden boats as an example, that community has no issue with new build recreations and simply grades them value and astheticaly by how well and authenticaly they are done.

    All of the cars like the boats are fungible objects, if we want to see them enjoyed and enjoy then, lets grow up and accept recreations that meet a certain level, that way we might even save a few old("lesser") cars from the blowtorch.

    If you live in a house, is it a fake by design? ie colonial etc.

    If someone thinks a replica is real, they probably are not part of the car culture anyway, so who cares.

    Lastly Ferrari Classiche is pretty much recreating original cars from a few rusty bits, is that authentic because they do it? When Aston made some run on BD4 Zagatos sanction2 from some old D4's was that OK? If that is Ok what is wrong with Lynx, or a Kirkham Cobra? Seriously there really are shades of grey here.

    Yes we all object to a plastic countach fake as it is touted around town, but there is a whole other range of recreations that are different. The only things certain recreation are missing is maybe historical provenance, and at this point even the FIA reckognises them as the real thing without old history. How many real cars are actualy still the original car.
     
  12. AxerJk

    AxerJk Formula 3

    Jan 28, 2009
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    Chris Ashworth
    So much hate in this thread. Are we around hardcore car guys THAT much that we're forgetting that very few people can afford the real thing?

    I like to think of a replica as a tribute car. No one would create a replica of a car they didn't like, would they? Most can't afford a $300,000 car, so they will create a replica of the car they like.

    I thought the Diablo roadster in the original post looked fantastic. And as stated in a post above, as long as it makes the owner happy, that's all that's important. Life is too short to care what others think.

    Chris
     
  13. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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  14. Athenia

    Athenia Formula Junior

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    The only replica I want is the tiny little scaled model of my car which is on my shelf.
     
  15. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 26, 2005
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    Jon
    If someone can't afford food or health care, that's a serious issue. If someone can't afford a real XK-SS and has to settle for a Ferrari 360, life goes on.

    Capitalism doesn't guarantee all of us access to the same goods. It does come with laws protecting intellectual property so that those of us building brands can profit from doing that.

    Porsche was so touched by a 959 'tribute' described in a recent thread here that they sued the replica builder and destroyed the molds.

    The owner of the trademark and design, or the person who used these without paying?

    I'm sure Lamborghini would be flattered that someone is paying tribute to their cars.

    Amen.
     
  16. ferraripete

    ferraripete F1 World Champ

  17. AxerJk

    AxerJk Formula 3

    Jan 28, 2009
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    Chris Ashworth
    That's the spirit! Kudos!

    Chris
     
  18. ferrarilover

    ferrarilover F1 Rookie

    Nov 5, 2003
    2,508
    Barrie, ON, Canada
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    Christopher Bailey
    check these guys out, http://www.ontariokitcarbuilders.com/

    I've seen a car in the flesh, it came into the old GM dealer I worked at, big Corvette dealer, this car was pretty cool to check out.

    This is interesting:

    "In Canada, it is against the law to build kit cars for the purpose of selling to the public. Ontario Kit Car Consultants does not build cars for resale. Instead, we provide technical expertise and assist the home kit car builder with the completion of their project."

    Chris
     
  19. 412monzaindy

    412monzaindy Formula Junior

    Mar 8, 2005
    848
    Ontario Canada
    Full Name:
    PBI
    Tribute is for bands. If you want to hear and listen to the Rolling stones, but can only afford the tribute too bad. Do you then say, that you were at a Rolling Stones concert but it was really only a tribute.

    Tributes are for the local bars and pubs, not concerts.

    You are being sucked in by people who are willing to take your money, then you pose as someone who can afford the REAL thing.
    Fake, Fake, Fake, Fake
    Fake Ferraris
    Fale Lamborghinis
    Fake Cobras
    Fake GT-40
    Fake, Fake, Fake wannabe, nothing else.

    If you want to play, you got to pay.

    Stop being a cry baby and pass off your fake for what it is. FAKE
     
  20. Subarubrat

    Subarubrat Formula 3

    Apr 1, 2009
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    Scott
    In the aviation world which I am also involved in, where the money involved is often more than exotics, the replica issue is seen in a totally different way. Many designs are done as replicas both for aesthetics and performance, both the result and the craftsmanship that goes into building them is openly respected and admired. For example the Piper Cub, there are many ways to own a replica of this airplane, a homebuilt that costs about as much as an original Cub, ones that costs way more, and ones that cost a great deal more than an original Cub but offer improvements on the original design such as being able to solo from the front seat and wing tanks. The Cub is an iconic design in performance and appearance, and replicas that capture or build on that are all welcomed.

    Replicas of other impossibly expensive or rare aircraft are out there and well liked as well. P51 Mustangs are out there for sale, for a few million. Or you can build anything from a Lohle Mustang for $30k which is much smaller and just styled after the original, up to something like the Stuart 51 that is 75% scale and flies with a big block V8, check this out; [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhFraPV340I[/ame] How cool is that? Yes real Mustangs exist but that takes nothing away from the thousands of hours spent building that wonderful replica that is a joy to fly.

    I am finishing building an AcroSport II biplane which is an original design and not a replica of anything, once that is done I am moving onto building a full scale replica of a Fokker DR1 triplane (Red Baron's plane). There are no original ones surviving in flying condition, and Manfred Richthofen's ghost isn't going to haunt my hangar for owning a "fake". I will get to fly around the countryside capturing a little bit of what that experience was while having a blast. People will look up and be amazed at what a beautiful plane they are seeing, and no aviation aficionado will tricked into thinking it is a real one.

    I find it curious how two enthusiast communities see the issue so differently. I'll just remain content to drive my "real" Ferrari to the airport to fly my "fake" Fokker.
     
  21. AxerJk

    AxerJk Formula 3

    Jan 28, 2009
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    Chris Ashworth
    ^^^It's funny you mention the Fokker Dr1, I just recently visited the National Air Force Museum in Ohio, and it was absolutely spectacular. Some of the rarest, most significant planes, including the Fokker DR1. As you stated, 320 of them were built, but none of them have survived. The one on display at the museum was a recreation, but it was beautifully done.

    Chris
     
  22. Testacojones

    Testacojones F1 Veteran

    Nov 3, 2003
    5,139
    Terra
    We pilots are less than one percent of Earth's population and understand a kind of freedom like few others. ;) I feel that freedom opens up in many other views and aspects of our lives. Some folks just don't get it.
     
  23. kverges

    kverges F1 Rookie

    Nov 18, 2003
    3,160
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    Keith Verges
    I personally am all for well done tribute or replica cars, so long as they are held out as nothing more. To me the "fake" is something like the Barracuda converted to a Hemi Cuda and held out as the real thing, or the GTO created from a VIN plate.

    Seems to me that most builders of kit cars have a hell of a lot more passion for the vehicle than most buyers of late model exotics. The former put sweat equity into what they have, the latter are often more interested in a fashion accessory or status symbol. Both worked hard, but the kit builder worked hard on THE CAR. The high-end retail buyer probably worked hard at something else and as a result has a less intimate mechanical connection with the vehicle. Nothing wrong with either approach until one dis'es the other.
     
  24. VF1Skullangel

    VF1Skullangel Formula Junior

    Nov 22, 2008
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    San Marcos, CA
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    Jay
    #99 VF1Skullangel, Jun 23, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2012
    Wow dude your just ****** yourself. I have nothing else to say but wow....



    I don't think so. If your gonna buy a replica you'd better have a damn good reason to do so. I favor the fun factor cause for the money you aren't going to find a better car, that I can promise you unless you buy a wrecked supercar and rebuild it yourself. I look at Replicas as buying the Generic brand of something and quite honestly we do that everyday when we shop at Walmart. So why does a Replica have no exceptions? Why is there a huge double standard? You know Even some of the worlds most famous hot rod builders have built Replicas and Tribute cars themselves. Look at year one for an example and their "Create Camaro's" Those could be considered Replicas! Its the same concept just like an Extreme Murcielago of molding body pannels off an original.
     
  25. VF1Skullangel

    VF1Skullangel Formula Junior

    Nov 22, 2008
    437
    San Marcos, CA
    Full Name:
    Jay
    Your full of crap. If you've shopped at Walmart before(Which I know you've probably have) I can point out like 10 things sitting in your home thats not legit.

    So at the end of the day your still just as much of a poser as me. Even if your pushover 308 is real.
     

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