Multiple Duplicate titles in Texas

Maybe the DMV women who process the titles are also cheerleaders and the guy couldn't stay away.

(Seriously, I don't know... but it sounds suspicious, as though someone tried to "launder" a salvage title, perhaps?)

 

I know more about how the Texas DMV works than the average joe, but not everything.

I've never seen the term "duplicate titles" but rather "lost title" and no human would go through the hoops to file for a lost title 6 times, it's not easy.

But, again, I don't know everything. I also have never heard of Autocheck.

 

Seems suspicious. I have seen duplicate titles on a carfax several times, but not more than once on any single car. I wonder if the duplicate titles are related to some sort of loan he took out on the car multiple times. I personally would not want five additional copies of the title to my car floating around.

 

it does seem strange, but do a PPI, check the vin number and frame and go for it if the price is right.

 

Wait, what?!? Six duplicate titles?!? That sounds fishy. Can you post the VIN? Also, if the seller sent you pictures of the car, and one of those pictures includes a license plate, can you include that as well?

 

Duplicate titles can be legit...and they can also be used to pass off cloned cars.

Imagine a stolen Ferrari. How does the crook sell it intact? She'd have to swap out the VIN plates to VINs of an unstolen Ferrari of the same model...

...and then she'd have to pretend to be the owner of the clean Ferrari who "lost" her title. Once she has the duplicate title in hand, she can now sell the stolen Ferrari with VINs matching the VIN on her new duplicate title.

Pity the poor owner of the clean Ferrari. He might not and probably should not be aware that someone copied his title.

So in the above hypothetical, there is one clean Ferrari and one stolen Ferrari...both now have the same VIN and the same title. The stolen Ferrari will be sold outside the U.S. so that the DMV of any state never sees two simultaneous registrations.


http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2009/march/cloning_032409

 

Very interesting, thank you. Can you give an example where duplicate titles are legitimate? I only ask because I can't fathom one on my own - aside from a lost title that was found after a replacement was issued. But couldn't a potential buyer simply contact that state's DMV and inquire as to the validity of the title number?

 

if you're stealing cars with the intent to export to another (3rd world?) country, why go through all the nonsense regarding duplicate VINs, titles, etc? other than maybe clearing customs, but frankly if you're shipping stolen cars outside the US and going through customs, there's probably a flaw in your plan...

 

Is there a method that circumvents customs when illegally exporting cars? Isn't the purpose of title-washing or title-duplicating so that the stolen car can successfully clear customs before escaping to a far-away non-extradition treaty country?

 

Issuing a duplicate title VOIDS and cancels any preceding title issued... each title has an identifying number... duplicate also can mean replacement title... clearing / removing lien holders is a common reason for getting a replacement, it shows that the state is satisfied that there are no liens recorded... to ease any concerns contact the DMV to verify current title is correct and valid, they also may be able to show the voided copies of prior titles

we all too easily accept titles at face value without verification... high value car title transactions should have the some verification at a minimum, in a sense similar to purchasing real estate, with a car title verification can be as simple as a phone call or email. Airplane and boat transactions are commonly checked for liens, too often the verification ball is dropped at the sight of a title. Using a replaced ( voided by reissue ) title to sell a car is fraud, as is any other false document... best to check with DMV before signing the check

there is NO such thing as a duplicate title... states issue replacements ONLY after CANCELLING prior title... anyone finding a previously issued title has a title that has been VOIDED AND CANCELLED

 

ICE has a stolen vehicle list ( NCIC ) which it runs against any exported cars, a "typo" in the VIN can fail the system as can a simple change in description. A stolen car can fall through the cracks. Read the various threads here about cars that were stolen and missed by customs

 

Guys, we are talking Texas here, not Japan.

Duplicate titles, may be a misrepresentation of where the title work changed over.

Pm me the info, and I will see what I can find. I subscribe to a service that allows me access to certain information.

Where in Texas is the car?

Shawn

 

So you've only got this info via autocheck? How about asking the actual owner? One way a new title would be issued is any time a lien is cleared or a change of registration info. From a personal name to business name at the same address from one person to another at the same address..etc Also if they used the car as collateral for a loan or did a car title loan once the lien is cleared a new one would be issued. There are just as many "explainable" reasons as there are "devious" reasons, not sure why most people always jump to "something must be fishy" right away.

I'll admit I've never used autocheck, I use carfax and they make a good point of recording anytime there is a lien reported. I was very interested ina 348 about a year ago, carfax showed a salvage history/loss many years prior and autocheck did not so it never hurts to check both and they can be wrong.

 

I'm not so sure that its that easy.I do know that when i bought one of my cars from the States, I had to give the U.S customs the title 72hrs before i could bring the car into Canada.So they must be checking something for those 72hr.

 

It's not my plan, and they get busted often!

Still, they clone titles because sometimes it works.

CBP Vehicle Export Team is 'Watchful Eye' at Port of Miami | U.S. Customs and Border Protection

 

Tough to imagine that scoring a duplicate title from the DMV would somehow purge insurance/AutoCheck/Carfax records of a claim.

Might work for whitewashing some types of car liens, perhaps?

Cloning for illegitimate use or replacing a paper title burned up in a house fire for legit use seem more likely.

 

Is this list, or any kind of list like it, available anywhere online?!?

 

Noticed this thread yesterday, but just thought of something: Could multiple Mechanics' Liens result in duplicate titles? IOW, guy brings car to Repair Shop "A", bounces check, Repair Shop attempts to collect without success, places lien against vehicle in court - court grants it, and as deadbeat car owner goes about his business this gets lathered, rinsed, repeated, several times with different repair shops over X-number of years, and with failure to collect, on all fronts, you end up with multiple duplicate title-holders, or partial title-holders?

Can that happen with regard to titling, or nah?

 

I don't think that could happen without proof of settling the lien, but not sure.

I am sure that someone, somewhere has tried

 

Shops would be unlikely to have access to your physical paper title, imo...

And a court will put a lien on the master electronic title, which should be reprinted on each new duplicate paper title from the state, one would think.

In contrast, perhaps a Title-Pawn shop will give you cash in exchange for your paper title...which may not always be reflected on the state's master electronic title record.

 

Multiple leinholders over the course of the ownership period appears to be the most reasonable and logical explanation.

Maybe the guy liked to refinance for better rates or maybe short term title loans. Either way, the lenders would have registered the lien with the state of Texas and upon release of that lien, a fresh paper copy of the title would have been sent to the owner.

According to TXDMV.GOV - Add/Remove a lien on a vehicle

Quote:

"When the department receives an electronic release of lien notification from a lienholder, the electronic record is automatically converted from an e-Title to a paper title and mailed to the recorded owner or third party."

 

access to the NCIC crime computer database is restricted to law enforcement... one can go to any local law enforcement office and ask them to check on a particular vin... I'm not aware of private / civilian access to the crime database... a vin check can be done by any LEO from their car if equipped with a computer link ( as that is standard equipment in most patrol cars )...

a stolen property entry stays in the computer permanently until it is removed / situation is resolved that clears the theft

the weak link with a theft staying in the NCIC data base is that the system can be gamed by lawyers with enough encouragement ( $$$$ ) using fraudulent court documents to remove the entry... it has happened with high value property... one needs to review their theft entry on a regular basis... courts and DMV can be gamed with enough encouragement as the entries are low profile record keeping and the volume of entries changes is large ( just follow the long running theft / ownership threads here )

again there is NO such thing as a duplicate title... ALL replaced titles are CANCELLED before a replacement is issued... there can only be a SINGLE title issued for each vehicle... "finding / using a previously lost title" is a VOIDED document without any legal standing and constitutes fraud... using the word duplicate is misleading... when the true meaning is REPLACEMENT