Maserati Classiche....

While money is obviously a major factor and Maserati does need it, they are also the only manufacturer of its type without a classic program beyond Fabio providing copies of historical records. Aston, Jaguar, Alfa, Mercedes, Porsche all have programs.

Don’t expect Maserati’s program to be like Ferrari’s Classiche. It took Ferrari 20 years to reach the level they are at today. Maserati doesn’t have the personnel or workshops to conduct the type of certification, restoration that the other manufacturers Nor the parts inventory. A lot of the process would be subbed out to companies like Candini and Campana.

this program needs to happen for reasons far beyond just the revenue it will generate.

 

Please correct me if I am wrong but according to my humble knowledge Campana is not in the resto business anymore. And there are now much better shops around Modena!

 

Walter: The OWNERS of the cars requested the certification, I only served as an advisor. While I advised against getting involved with the process, I do agree with you there is substantial pressure among some ownership segments to "get all your cars certified because everyone else is doing it". As for me, no thank you for my cars.

 

I think certification certainly has a role to play, particularly for higher value cars- as can be seen from other marques. As you say, the 'market' speaks (although to a large extent the market is of course people like us).

In that regard, I have no issue with a car that is not 100% original not being issues such a certificate. In reality, most owners and buyers know that information already (for example a US Khamsin converted to Euro spec).

What I do find strange is my inability to have access to the basic factory build sheet info for my car just because it has been converted to RHD. I'm not sure whose interests that serves.

My car exists. It's records exist. It seem more than bizarre that such records are now inaccessible for the owner of the car who has an interest in its history, preservation and eventual further restoration. What is the benefit for these records to now be 'sealed'?

Happy to do without the eventual 'Classiche' certificate, but would be great to have the other information which was more freely available in the past.

 

I don't know since then this information is more difficult to obtain.
Obviously, according to the email sent to me by Fabio in 2017, at least since that date, i.e. a policy decided before the introduction of the Classiche program

 

For cars at these price levels I can understand wanting as many of the best trained eyes examining a vehicle's authenticity because of the history of fakes, thr enormous pricing and not wanting to be publicly embarrassed. Cars like these are way beyond my sphere of experience. But to extend these methods down to cars in the $100K - $300k level of most vintage Maseratis is what we're discussing. Such classifying of far more reasonably priced cars is what necessarily drives pricing higher unless the people doing the restoration work have a perfect knowledge of what's correct and what is not. I realize that the in the minds of the Classiche departments such knowledge is alleged and carries the authority of god but having seen quite a few of the more garden variety Maseratis while they were still pretty close to new I know that Maserati tended to pull whatever was in inventory out of the parts bin, ditto for Lamborghini. So when some concours judges start pointing out things which are wrong I can sometimes roll my eyes. But I'm certain the Ferrari is perfect ...

 

Ferrari definitely is not perfect...

What I can`t understand is the RHD discussion regarding the car n Australia. Maserati made all Mistral-Spyder in LHD-specs. But they converted the few cars that were sold new to the UK to RHD.
Following their -new?- strategy now, even the cars they converted by themself to RHD are non-original....
Ehhh......

 

Yeah that is outrageously unfair and just plain wrong. If it wasn't done at the behest of the factory like all those spyder conversions , Ferraris had that done too, then I understand.

 

In December last year, I visited the factory during the Maserati club's president's meeting. Maserati presented their future plans, among them the "new" classiche approach. Yes they will certify cars, but no details were revealed. If the car needs to be transported to Modena or if it can be done elsewhere was not clear. As I understood it, they will somehow also offer restorations, most likely outsourced, not many details either. They also talked about the possibility of producing difficult to find parts for classic models, again without too much detail.

 

Thought I should provide an update.

Having been seized of this issue due to this thread, I wrote a nice long and polite email to Fabio pleading my case. I had previously checked twice and was told that the documents were not available due to the RHD conversion- so thought I would try and mount a sensible argument this time around.

To my pleasant surprise, we wrote back quite quickly telling me that his earlier advice had been incorrect- and that a RHD conversion did not disqualify the vehicle from being called original; which is great to hear. Now the question for me is which documents to order- I didn't realise there were so many. Am tempted to get them all in case things change in future.

Having been around early 911's mostly in the last 5 years, this discussion reminds me of what has been going on in that world. A year or so ago, Porsche determined that they would no longer provide COA documentation about the early cars without the cars being inspected by Porsche Classic first (for a fee of US $500). Of course, you would need to have a Porsche Classic centre near you.

In the enthusiast early 911 community- there is not a lot of respect for the Porsche Classic service. In many cases, they know much less about the early cars than independent shops that have been working on them and restoring them for decades. There are many examples of important early 911's being restored by Porsche Classic in Germany and mistakes being made/ concerns cut which an experienced independent shop would never do. And certainly, a lot of the Porsche Classic branded replacement parts are very poor replacements for the originals. So very clearly there is a good way and a less good way to create a Classic department that is planning to offer a wide range of services.

At any rate- very happy to know I can access the documents for my car after all, and now to choose which ones to order.

Remi

 

So everyone's angst, strenuous opposition to such an idea and discontent with such a strict Classiche program was due to an error?

Perhaps someone at Maserati has been listening to Fchat? Hmmmmmmm.

Happy for your outcome.

I'd still like to know what happened with their much earlier database where I registered my cars and had the capability to buy that certificate which came with a fresh owners manual and some other goodies ???? (in case they actually are listening) LOL!

 

Remi: Get EVERYTHING you can NOW. Over time the costs will be well worth it.

 

I think my negative reaction to the Classiche certification program is that I have enjoyed working through the years with passionate people such as Cozza and now Fabio Collina. These people truly care about Maserati's history and genuinely want to help owners of classic cars. I just hate thinking that accountants might screw things up. Hope I am wrong.

Ivan

 

Cozza is out of charge now and enjoys his well deserved retirement. Fabio is a great guy and always willing to help. But he has to respect the rules given by the management.
Maserati seems not to understand that every classic car, every book about their history etc. is an ambassador for the marque!

 

Ermanno usually stops in for a half day or so once a week, (Wednesday). The Maserati Classiche program began when Giorgio Mauro transferred in from Ferrari as the Director of After Sales at Maserati, working with Luca Dal Monte Director of World World Communication (also exFerrari) they convinced Wester to create a Classiche department within After Sales built around Cozza.

The Classiche Department eventually grew to the point where it had a board that consisted of Cozza, Fabio, Adolfo Orsi, Fabio’s direct report within SpA, as well as that person’s direct report (These positions within SpA rotated, within the last few months the individuals in these positions have changed). I could be wrong but I believe Matteo Panini Is also on the Board.

if I remember correctly they would meet every 2 weeks (Friday?) to discuss business. Also well known individuals associated with Maserati from the Modena area will meet with the board.

That was the structure, but obviously things are changing. the individuals from SpA management that are now in the Board positions are good, they care about the Brand. Looking forward to see the direction they guide the Classiche program.

 

A little story about one of the individuals you listed:

4 years ago I brokered a T60 Birdcage. Part of my services is to provide the full history about these kind of cars. I contacted Fabio for documents etc. To my and his surprise he told me that there is not one single document about that car and the entire file is gone.
Via a friend I contacted one of the individuals you mentioned....and voilá, there it was, the entire file incl. docs etc., etc.! I informed Fabio about that and he was again very much surprised that this person has a file that officially belongs to the factory....
Take your conclusions....

 

Walter,

You lead an interesting life! Stick around for a long while as It really makes my day when you reveal something new on the website!

 

Know enough stories about this that I’ll keep to myself.

 

Walter,

I'm sure there are other skeletons that you have dug up that you will never speak or write about, expect maybe, posthumously?

 

Posting after death ... I think we'd need to invite Houdini in to debunk that one ...

 

Eliott,
you can bet on it!

 

be careful, remember what happened to Pope Formosus!

 

Walter,
I hope that I am around for the book, I'm 78, but I also hope it doesn't come out for at least 50 years. Stay safe and stay happy!

 

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