Marriage without kids.... anyone want?

Valid exaple? And the Bible was written by people who believed that the earth was flat, that it was the center of the universe, and that everything was created in 7 days.

Yeah, let's bring out religeon when all arguments fail. If you want to jump on the religeous train, wasn't Jesus THE SON of God? Apparently God knew that it was important to have at least one child.

 

Since you made the initial statement, please explain how natural selection plays into this. The motivations of the organism are irrelevant, it is only that their particular genetic information is passed on.

From a third world perspective I might agree with you that a more wealthy person would have a better chance of survival and successfully raising children to reproductive age. For developed nations in practice we as a species are "too successful". At least in North America very few poor people starve to death or have significant child mortality. Therefore everyone has a fairly good chance of living to adulthood and raising children to reproductive age. What we have actually done in developed nations is eliminated much of the advantage that genetic differences play in the likelihood of passing on genes. Now virtually everyone can reproduce if they want to. Therefore being comfortably or even obscenely affluent gives little advantage that your children will reach adulthood while others will not.

 

The general public will accept a man not wanting kids much easier than a woman who does not want kids. Growing up I never dreamed of giving birth and having kids of my own and I still don't. Considering I am now 38, I think my biological clock must have been broken because I still feel the same way. Everyone that knows me thinks that I would make an excellent parent and I think they are probably correct. But at the end of the day, it is a bigger role than I want. I love kids and like having them in my life (nephews and such) but none of my own. Sadly, people interpret that as selfish and uncaring, which just isn't the case.

 

True 'dat.........you know nothing when you are in your 20's (which is where most guys make their mistakes regarding marriage and kids).....when in your 30's you start to figure it out (I spent my 30's hitting everything that walked, lived the life of a porn star, see the strip bar thread for details)......and in your 40's and beyond you benefit from your wisdom and choice of actions.

But none of you will do that however, because, most of you are in your 20's and think we old fogies are stupid.

The wife and I spent a weekend at the zoo recently on a sunny Sunday afternoon. The place was packed with families........mommies carrying a bambino in their tummy holster and daddy pushing the two seat stroller. The mommies were beaming as only an active breeding receptacle can, yet none of the daddies were smiling.......in fact, most looked tired, bored, and downright grumpy with that 1,00 yard stare in their eyes.

 

There is no strong correlation between being successful at business and being able to have a family. To go on, just because you "have" kids, doesn't mean you should. A lot of well-to-do people are useless parents. I wouldn't bet against the divorce rates of the wealthy being higher.

Why does not having kids= lonely? Go to a nursing home. You'll see regular old folks who have kids that visit maybe once a month (if they're lucky).

 

If you read this memoir, Dennis pretty much says that if you are comsumed with acquiring wealth, something has to suffer. It usually is your family, there are only so many conscious hours in the day.
http://www.amazon.com/How-Get-Rich-Greatest-Entrepreneurs/dp/B001R23FN4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1254248362&sr=8-1

 

I'm not the one making a ridiculous claim and posturing an opinion as fact. I'm merely pointing out that you are.

You're contradicting yourself. Your initial premise (or fact as you like to call it) was that children made people more successful and you used the Forbes list in an attempt to back that up. Now you're suggesting that wealthy people start thinking more serious issues, like having children. That's an entirely different argument.

Now you're making completely stupid arguments. Look around America and tell me that any the men on Forbes' list are more capable of having children than the men on welfare. The least successful people in America tend to have children.

The last part about selfish hedonists living in poverty doesn't even deserve a response. It's that far beyond stupid...

Ok. Again, you throw out a random statement that has absolutely nothing to do with the discussion. Having children is no more a guarantee of having a crowded death bed than not having them assures a lonely demise. That's just complete nonsense.

 

For all you wealthy individuals who don't have families, please donate all your proceeds to my kids when you die, then you know for sure your money was not waisted.

 

The government takes at least half of it (and I'm sure they'll find a way to up it).

 

That book looks like it's really good. I like Felix Dennis (The Hugh Hefner of the UK).

 

Thats fine, the way Obama adminstration is on spreading the wealth, I will get the money one way or another!

 

Agree.

If you work too hard your kids suffer and never see you so what really should be your priorities?

In my opinion if you are going to have kids you should be there for them, not working all day and night, just to make money. Kids don't want money they want their parents time. And yes we asked our kids when my wife was free enough to start working again, and they all said they would rather have their mum than the extra money and treats, etc.

BTW: They wont ever thank you no matter which choice you make, but you will miss the fact that you were never there for them if you choose to work all the time. Plus kids need to learn how to make their own way ... handing out money does not work.
Pete

 

One story he tells in it was having multiple women in different hotels around the world he could visit when he took a notion. PIMP!

(no kids though)

 

It is very difficult to manage your own business and a family, especially in services businesses where time IS the commodity. There is no respite from your work, no just going home and forgetting about something. Rest like naps are from passing out in exhaustion, not a "oh, I suppose I'll have a nap because I have nothing to do." If you don't say, "today is for my family," and focus on giving them time, you can easily fill that time with work.

Also, the worst bosses and coworkers are those who are recently divorced, because they have nothing to do and work like bastards to make money and take their mind off of their social lives. I did some work with a lawyer who was recently divorced and he seemed to take schadenfreude pleasure in trying to force me to forsake weekends and holidays to get his projects done faster.

I'll add that if your spouse is very 'security' oriented, shunning the lockstep salary of the worker and assuming the risk of the entrepreneur/capital owner can also add stress to the home. Especially when you're in a field like law, when for the first years of a new practice your peers at big firms out-earn you and there is less steady income.

 

I'm with you on that boat.

Its hard as hell finding a girlfriend out here though because all the girls out here already have kids! and its like your only 22 and have 3kids and its like WTF?!?!?.

I will never put work in front of my personal life I like money but I enjoy privacy and free time much more

 

I'll be picking it up. Reading the reviews on Amazon, it sounds like it actually has some useful info (and not a "get-rich" type book).

He is certainly not a very attractive dude. How does he met these women? I'm guessing he has to spoil them pretty well.

 

I also get the "you will when you're older" line nearly every time the subject comes up.

 

I never wanted children, my wife and I traveled the world, bought toys, homes and had a blast without kids.. We had an accident at age 34 and my son was born, I was a bad husband and didn't really support my wife's pregnancy and was even a jerk after my son was born. Not abusive or anything just not excited as my wife and family.

When he smiled at me and crawled to me and wanted to be with me, when I bathed him, fed him and he would run to me when I came home opened armed, I realized what happiness was. The next two pregnancies were a wonderful experience.

Now I have three kiddos and I am 40. I am the happiest I have ever been, they are great, well behaved kids and we still travel, sail, and have fun. I would have more if I wasn't 40. Not because I am a breeder but for the wonderful experiences they bring to our lives. I would never have children I couldn't afford or support on my own.

We have friends our age with no children, they travel with us and have a blast with our kids, its fun for them because they feel they have the best of both worlds which is fine with me.. I am happy for them and never push children on people who choose not to have them, I hated the pressure to start a family..

To wrap this up, if you haven't any children you cant claim to know what its like to have them.

 

Same thing happened with me. My first child was an accident and I was not to thrilled with having a child. I felt I hadn't done everything I wanted. Now after two children, I have to admit, they are the best thing that has ever happened to me. The things I have and do has some meaning to it. Not trying to sound all emotional here, but seriously it gives you an new perspective on life. For instance, I took my son karting for the first time on Sunday and he kicked butt. I can't even describe how happy I was on how well he did. Its like buying 5 Ferrari's at one time, thats feeling you get.

 

Agreed. Correlation does not mean causation!

 

Hm, I didn't know "manning up" meant going against your own values in order to please others.

 

Ahh, the 'beaten dog' look!

And to reference a wayy earlier post in this thread: how did you get to go to the zoo (was cited as a way to be a kid again) without kids?!

 

amen to that, do not have children if you feel that strongly, be the cool uncle..
J