LiFePO4 battery / weight saving / Ferrari FF | FerrariChat

LiFePO4 battery / weight saving / Ferrari FF

Discussion in 'FF/Lusso' started by KNOKKi, May 2, 2021.

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  1. KNOKKi

    KNOKKi Karting

    Jul 20, 2015
    66
    Amsterdam
    I have long been thinking about replacing my battery with a Li one, but was very much inclined to wait where Super-B ( www.super-b.com ) would come up with. Finally, it has become so much more simple and cheaper than I thought. I just ordered a battery at cs-batteries.de ( https://cs-batteries.de/Lithium-LiFePO4-Auto-Starter-Batterie-12V-60Ah-1200AEN ) for 600 euro ex VAT and installed it yesterday. Same dimensions etc., but then 8,5 kg instead of 25 kg for the standard one. The cells are from A123 systems, just like the cells in the Czech sourced Pista battery.
     
  2. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    Thanks for the information. The weight saving will have made re-installation easier for you even if it's insignificant to the overall weight of the car :D
    It'll be interesting to see how long the battery survives the heat of the engine bay as I'm increasingly convinced that the battery issues we all get in our FFs, Lussos, F12s and 812s are all to do with engine bay heat (which gets up to 60c at the battery even with the thermal jacket on).
    Lead acid chemistry hates heat and the battery's life is severely shortened at higher than ambient temperatures. How tolerant is LiFePo technology to heat?
     
  3. FerRrari

    FerRrari Formula 3

    Jan 11, 2009
    1,169
    WA
    Full Name:
    Fernando
    Seems like this would be a better fit?

    Temperature range (discharge): -20 ° C to + 65 ° C
    Temperature range (charge): 0 ° C to + 50 ° C
    Temperature range (storage): -20 ° C to + 65 ° C
     
  4. FerRrari

    FerRrari Formula 3

    Jan 11, 2009
    1,169
    WA
    Full Name:
    Fernando
    Now, this is interesting:
    Note 3: Never use a trickle charger or standard lead-acid battery charger on a LiFePO4 battery.
     
  5. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    It's better than SLA but a bit marginal given the replacement cost of the battery!
     
  6. vraa

    vraa F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2003
    3,495
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Mr. A
    You have to use a trickle charger that is compatible with that lithium technology, most modern noco and ctek are compatible just check the specs first
     
    FerRrari likes this.
  7. AEHaas

    AEHaas Formula 3

    May 9, 2003
    1,458
    Osprey, Florida
    Full Name:
    Ali E. Haas
    I have tried Several of these batteries in several cars and gave up. They do not last. Maybe, in part, because the charging systems of the cars are not designed for these other chemistries. I am sticking with quality, normal car batteries.

    AEHaas
     
    ANOpax likes this.
  8. dgoldenz94

    dgoldenz94 Formula Junior

    Apr 13, 2020
    542
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    David Gold
    The antigravity batteries have a 5 year warranty with full replacement in first 3 years. That’s not too bad.
     
  9. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    I should hope so given that they're about 6x the cost of a SLA. If the SLAs only last me 2 years apiece then the antigravity needs to last 12 years for me to break even. I don't see that happening somehow.
     
  10. dgoldenz94

    dgoldenz94 Formula Junior

    Apr 13, 2020
    542
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    David Gold
    Doesn’t the dealer/Indy have to reprogram the computer when the battery is changed? I would think the added cost for that would make it much closer, plus the convenience of not having to keep it on a battery tender all the time and ability to monitor battery health and jump start with Bluetooth is pretty sweet.
     
  11. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    No, they don't.

    Changing a battery is a DIY job which can be accomplished in less than 20 minutes with practice (and with the rate at which SLAs die, you'll be well practiced!).

    Again, 6x the cost is a high price to pay for the convenience of something which can be achieved with a $50 dongle and use of the battery disconnect but I can appreciate that there may be situations where a tender is not available and disconnect is not feasible either (such as parking on the street in a city).
     
  12. FerrariFF_ZZ

    FerrariFF_ZZ Rookie

    Jun 29, 2021
    3
    Austria
    Full Name:
    Emil
  13. vraa

    vraa F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2003
    3,495
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Mr. A
    What country are you in? That just looks like another AGM compatible battery.... I think everyone says Varta for EU and Interstate for US
     
  14. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    Yes. I have that battery (see one of the threads on FF battery replacement). It has lasted 2 years and I’m about to replace it with the non AGM version as my FF doesn’t have stop start so I don’t need the AGM which is 4kg heavier and 30% more expensive.
     
  15. FerrariFF_ZZ

    FerrariFF_ZZ Rookie

    Jun 29, 2021
    3
    Austria
    Full Name:
    Emil
    Thank you for the advice ;)
     
  16. papou

    papou Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    May 18, 2012
    1,567
    plantation Fla
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    daniel ross
    My car doesn’t have stop/start so does that mean I don’t need AGM replacement battery.
     
  17. ANOpax

    ANOpax Formula 3

    Jul 1, 2015
    1,126
    The Netherlands
    If you don’t have stop/start then you don’t need the AGM.
    The non AGM is lighter on your back when replacing the battery (22kg vs 26kg) and lighter on your wallet too!

    My new battery should arrive today so I’ll update the FF battery replacement thread once I’ve put it in the car.

    The Varta Silver is only €110 delivered and I’m capable of swapping the battery out myself. For that kind of money, changing it every two years is simply a matter of preventative maintenance. I’ll provide more detail on the FF battery thread but my conclusion is that the heat in the engine bay is responsible for killing our batteries. Expecting them to last more than 2-3 years is simply not realistic. And it won’t matter whether you have an exotic LiFePo or a lowly SLA, the degradation is significant. Charging practices also have an impact and my habit of immediately connecting the tender after a drive has, unfortunately, hastened the demise of my battery.
     
    Nospinzone likes this.
  18. vraa

    vraa F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2003
    3,495
    Texas
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    Mr. A
    It's definitely the heat
     
    ANOpax likes this.
  19. papou

    papou Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    May 18, 2012
    1,567
    plantation Fla
    Full Name:
    daniel ross
    100% I live in South Florida all my pals have battery life issues..
     

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