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Jag V12

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by Nickt, Feb 1, 2008.

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  1. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Thanks Grant,
    The starter and flywheel are a big concern. I am also trying to source stuff on the cheap. I did well with the Gearbox, I used www.goofbay.com and got a whole transaxle for £25! The guy had spelt it wrong ;) Normally they sell for £150 ++
    The engine btw is out of an XJS produced in December 1979, the Jaguar Classics are being V helpful!

    BTW the GT4's Aircon is up for sale if you want it? I need the cash for the steel and the mk3 Granada donor car.

    I have also been thinking about carbs, there is a Linx XJS on ebay with 6 webers, but he wants £1500 and I would rather get the project off the ground. There is a US company that sells dual quad choke manifolds for the XJS, for a marine application but it is quite reasonable, and two 4 barrel holleys would be cool!



    Thanks Paul. I will keep this thread going as long as the mods don't mind? (I guess its a little off topic for a Ferrari forum).
    Today I need to sort my garage out, I have a lathe which takes up quite a lot of room so it needs to be moved so i can get the chassis laid out correctly and the Dino in the same room :D

    I have ordered 50 metres of 38mm 1.5mm wall steel tube and 1m2 of 12mm aluminium plate (adapter plate) :eek: no going back now

    Cheers
    Nick
     
  2. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran

    Sep 5, 2007
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    One Stupid SOB
    Really? Wow, like the old Chevy 348/409/427. Is the deck 90* to the bore, or is it canted like the old W-block Chevy?

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill
     
  3. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Hi Chaps - a long shot but does anyone know the diameter of an XJ40 / XJ6 flywheel?
    Cheers
    Nick
     
  4. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    sorry Nick
    can't help with the flywheel size and also the aircon as i have just got an estimate for the Daytona rebuild and i am going for a lay down.
     
  5. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    That's alright! not to worry.

    on the flywheel conundrum.. Do you think all jag flywheels use a similar pitch for the teeth on the starter ring gear? If so I have the original auto flywheel which has 170 teeth at 6.5 mm spacings. I know also that the xj40 3.6 has 101 teeth which would make a diameter of 20.6cm. Seems a tad small but at least I lmnow it will fit in the bell housing! I also read that the XJ40 starter is a V high torque one so with some mods should fit. (I hope)
    Cheers
    Nick
     
  6. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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  7. barabus

    barabus F1 Rookie

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  8. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    #33 Nickt, Mar 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    This week I have carried on accumalating "bits". 2 x E-type jag engine mounts, Dizzy cap, 38mm milling hole cutters to make the 2 x 6 branch manifolds, aluminium plate for adapter, 150mm x 50 aluminium bar for the drive shaft adapters, drills, clutch plate and loads of stuff! The post man is loving delivering to my house!

    The engine has been stripped down, all that is left is the block with its heads and cam covers, everything else has been taken off and sand blasted. So far the only thing wrong with the engine is one of the cooler pipes that runs the length of one bank has rusted through.

    I have made the adapter plate from 13mm thick aluminium and the gearbox mounts up really nicely. I still have to tidy it up, but its on there and it fits" I have orderd an Audi quatro clutch pressure plate, starter and flywheel to mount to the jag lump. The flywheel will have to be machined by someone else as my lathe is not big enough. On the pic below you can see my MDF template hanging on the lathe

    The Jaguar herritage have come back to me with details of my engine, it is out of a Dec 1979 XJS.

    I have also managed to find a "give away" mk3 Granada, which will provide hubs, steering, electrics etc.. I have gone for the mk3 as it has disks all round and ABS.
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  9. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    #34 Nickt, Mar 9, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Today I bought the donor car, a 1990 Ford Scorpio 3.0 Ghia Auto, picking it up tomorrow!
    The chassis is coming along well, about a 1/3 finished, the audi flywheel has gone off to be modified to fit the V12 and I have a new heavy duty clutch to fit on its return.
    I have bought myself a 12 tonne pipe bender to make the v12's headers and the curved part of the chassis (windscreen surrounds etc..) Its actually beginning to resemble a .....(not quite sure) but it looks meaningful anyway. The engine mounts nicely in its cradle.
    The only real problem is the size of my garage, the Fezza is nearly hard up against one wall and the chassis the other. Today I had to move the freezer out to make enough room to make the drivers side of the cockpit.
    So far I have used 30m of 1.5" steel tube, and the chassis is still amazingly light!
    I got the Audi starter to fit the V12 but because the flywheel is a fair bit smaller than the jag one, a fair amount of cutting has to be done. With the starter hard up against the block I recon I am as close as I can get to spot on.
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  10. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    #35 Nickt, Mar 29, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The chassis is now finished! All that remains to do is weld the underside and go over all the welds properly to make sure they're good.
    Last night I took the engine out and moved the chassis onto its side - MAN its light!
    I have fabricated all the front suspension bits using transit track rod ends and Cortina ball joints. The drive shaft adapters are finished, basically its all coming together nicely.

    By the end of next week it will have wheels on, and I should be able to start doing more interesting bits, like the engine, electrics etc... Last night I bought some carbs for the old V12, a pair of rover 3.5 SUs, i figure its got to be easier getting it running on those than messing around with the injection.

    I have decided to go down the 4 barrel Holley route (probably) and use 3 of them in a row, cheaper than DCNF Webers and I recon easier to set up.

    The gearbox/transaxle has its new flywheel fitted and clutch, I have still to make the spigot bearing, I have bought a bronze rod so will knock one up out of that.

    I am still troubled with the starter; the Audi flywheel is MUCH smaller than the old jag's. I have cur away a lot of engine and can just get the Audi starter to line up with its flywheel, hopefully it will be a lot easier to "do" when i have wheels on the chassis and the whole thing is more mobile.

    I am reusing the Granada's front all electric seats, I will obviously have to get them re-covered, but they fit nicely. When in the car, it feels right, although it has no wheels, doors, or body, if you sit in the drivers seat the car seems to wrap nicely around you, and look back over your shoulder at the expanse of V12 and it all seems worth while!

    Next week the following bits should be coming. 6 metres of steel for the V12's exhaust manifolds, gearstick, carbs, and the final drive shaft. I didn't realise that Scorpio's have different length shafts, which meant I had to buy another one anyway grrrr...

    I have managed to use just about every part of the scorpio, even the tailgate's hinges and gas struts will be used to make the scissor doors, the electric windows are being reused, as is the whole wiring loom and dash (for the moment). I have bought a tool to remove the windscreen but I have no idea if I can get it out. I would like to use that too, although I would prefer a more curved one. - If anyone know where I can get a better windscreen please shout!

    I hope you like the pictures and the update..
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  11. spidermanUK

    spidermanUK Formula 3

    Feb 26, 2005
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    It's a great project, I'm full of admiration and look forward to seeing the finished article!


    But I bet the neighbours love the donor car in the driveway........look Mummy, a pikey with a Ferrari
     
  12. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    Looks like you certainly have been busy!

    What happened to TIG welding?

    It looks like you are using flux-core MIG.
     
  13. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    I really feel sorry for them, they've just moved in :eek:
    Hopefuly the shell will be taken away next week once I have the final bits out of it.


    Yep, my trusty MIG. I started using CO gas then tried the flux'd wire and it worked so well and its much cheaper! The welds seem neater as well.
    I do need to find someone with a TIG for the wishbones though. Otherwise it won't get through the SVA.
     
  14. Hud

    Hud F1 Veteran
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    Jan 26, 2005
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    Fantastic thread Nick, thanks for sharing so far :)
     
  15. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Thanks Rob!
    If I ever finish this beast it will be a seriously quick car.
    I have had the engine off the chassis today and did the final underneath welding. Also fitted the seats, and started working on the rear suspension. I also got a bag of rover 3.5 carbs off a guy on ebay try and fire up the old beast next week.
    For the first time itrs all up on axle stands, next the wheels go on...

    The 12 branch manifolds turned up today, flatpacked :eek: basically 12 flanges and 6 metres of pipe.

    The car is exactly the same dimensions as the C12 so things are hotting up :D
     
  16. YellowF50

    YellowF50 Formula Junior

    Feb 15, 2007
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    Wow!

    looks like a great project you have created for yourself, you are doing a great job with the detailed commentary, and pics, keep up the good work.

    Have you just started this project ? , I ask because it seems as though things have progressed very quickly, or did you have the chassis made prior to deciding to go ahead, and you are simply modifying it to accomadate the jag engine ?

    Either way its looks very promising, and cant wait to keep checking back for progress reports.

    Good Luck !
     
  17. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Hi Kris
    I started 4 weeks ago (seems like a lot longer). My starting point was an idea to make a "Zonda spyder", an old jag engine and a pile of steel tube.
    I did some research on the web, found a blue print website, and website for the ultima GTR and parrallel designs, and picked parts of their chassis for my topless number. Printed off tonnes of Zonda images and scaled them up to get the right proportions.

    Everything in the pictures is under a month old - My wife now wishes i had taken up golf, she thinks she might see more of me

    Last night the Granada was taken away, so at least the front of the house doesn't look like a scrap yard.
    Cheers
    Nick
     
  18. Wheels1

    Wheels1 F1 Rookie
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    Hi Nick
    That's amazing progress.
    If you go down the Holley route, make sure you use a good fuel filter, I had a holley in my MGB roadster v8 and i had a nightmare with the jets getting blocked, so much so i carried a rebuild kit with me in the car. [and i had to use it on the M2 hard shoulder on a trip to France, very scary. In the end i went the SU route, not as sexy but for me much more reliable.
    Keep up the good work.
    Grant
     
  19. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2006
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    Thanks Grant!
    Got the 1st wheel on to night, the rear passenger side one :D
    Interesting though thinking about the rear suspension... If I could use the original scorpio front struts inboard like the do in the f430s and Zonda. If I lay them on top across the bellhousing they seem to end up at the right point near the hub...
    As for the carbs I bought some (4) 175 cd Strombergs off a couple rover 3.5 V8, I was pondering whether i could do what the mad biker did with his V12 jag and stick two peugeot diesel turbos on it and use these carbs? Should be OK for 400 bhp? http://www.visordown.com/motorcyclenews/view/v12_drag_bike_for_sale_on_ebay/1564.html

    I am also thinkiing of using the Mtech V3 dirrect ignition ECU - but I have to sweet talk the missus for that ;-)
     
  20. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    Those Strombergs are similar to what the Etypes and early XJ12s came with, nothing to brag about. If you find some big SUs you will get somewhere, not quite like a Weber setup but a big improvement over those Strombergs.
     
  21. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

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    #46 Nickt, Apr 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I would love to go the weber route, but at that cost it would be easier and cheaper to go modern ECU injection. Here are some pictures from tonight, as you can see the chassis is now a fetching shade of red oxide - nice!
    The picture of the front hub shows the "plug" and transit trackrod end the lower plate is a cortina balljoint.
    I have run out of MIG wire so had to call it a day.
    I like the picture of the back of the car, kind of looks right
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  22. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

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    #47 Nickt, Apr 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    OK, its not a good picture but would this work?
    If I took the front Macpherson struts and mounted them as in the picture. I would have to modify the struts to fit abush at the top instead of the 3 bolt plate but - is it a goer?
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  23. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    #48 2NA, Apr 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  24. Nickt

    Nickt Formula 3

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    #49 Nickt, Apr 1, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Yes, I have looked at this type of setup on the GT40 website. Just trying to think of way to recycle as much of the donor as possible. I also wanted to keep the design as close to the C12 as possible. The springs should be OK, they kept an iron 2.9 V6 from scraping on the tarmac. I guess the only way to be really sure is to weigh each corner and see what springs I need?
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  25. trevsked

    trevsked Karting

    Jun 20, 2007
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    Nick,

    Just looking at the picture I would say you will not have enough movement of the shock to provide effective damping. Move the bottom of the shock in towards the pivot and on a 90 degree arm.

    Regards Trevor.
     

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