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is the bubble due to burst?

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by PFSEX, Jan 18, 2013.

  1. pilotoCS

    pilotoCS Formula 3
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    May 19, 2019
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    Willis B.
    Is it really "crooked financial advice" or simply salesman's puffery?
     
  2. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    Aug 22, 2002
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    Mmmh i know alot of rich people. Everyone who was rich in 08 is richer today.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. Bradwilliams

    Bradwilliams F1 Rookie
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    Is it salesman puffery when a salesman working in a boiler room solicits you to buy a stock that they're about to dump/short?
     
  4. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    5,915
    Looks like they had a run up to $500K then have dropped since 2015 to what ? $300K for an above average example?
     
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  5. hagen111

    hagen111 Karting

    Feb 25, 2006
    61
    A low mileage Facelift e46 M3. Superhard to find. They fetch top money in Europe. Try finding a manual, coupe, <50k kms, Facelift E46 M3 in great condition under 40k EUR...good luck!

    This is a postercar for my generation, and Chris Harris rates it as one of the best sportscars ever...
     
  6. Bradwilliams

    Bradwilliams F1 Rookie
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    #3506 Bradwilliams, Apr 6, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
    And it's already fallen to 19k USD. Sounds like you should buy this car and ship it over. Or you could just wait a few more days and buy it for 13k. What are you waiting for? Follow Chris Harris' orders and come get this rare poster car :)
     
  7. Platini 289

    Platini 289 Karting

    Sep 21, 2015
    81
    IMHO Brad Williams has some valid points and arguments, hidden in the constant bickering with TTForce fed etc etc etc . Jeez guys chill out. Check this article out. Well put together and credible from a reliable source. https://karenable.com/supercar-market-update-q1-2020/
     
  8. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    Aug 22, 2002
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    It’s been 11 years
     
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  9. Platini 289

    Platini 289 Karting

    Sep 21, 2015
    81
  10. Bradwilliams

    Bradwilliams F1 Rookie
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    #3510 Bradwilliams, Apr 8, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
    Wayne Carini is not credible and not a financial planner, no matter how much he wants to convince himself that he is. Just another broker/dealer who has made a very good living with his passion, good for him. However he clearly suffers from a fantasy/identity complex. Which is where he thinks that he's a 1 percenter simply because he sells cars to them from time to time. He isn't. You see this sometimes with people who sell high end cars, and I've seen it a few times in yachting as well.
     
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  11. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    correct what? that article says nothing. when were 355s trading at 100k? 11 yrs isn't a correction - a business cycle is 5 years...totally laughable...11 years equated to 4000 days one cld have left this life without owning a ferrari...ur telling me there have been no entry points over the past 4000 days???
    i dont need to read - i have bought at least 25 cars over the past 4000 days...keep reading...

    if my f40 goes down 50 percent im still up alot...but i bought the f40 because i love it as opposed to telling other people what they shld and shldnt buy and when...i have friends here who bought at multiples of what i paid and guess what - they arent sellers if the f40 goes down 50%...
     
  12. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,091
    France
    One sentence grabbed my attention - "when the stock market is tanking, that's when you see cars starting to go up".
    Experience tells a different story - when the stock market is tanking, the people with cash should buy stocks and not cars - and after a few years, the market recovers, they cash out and can buy cars.
    Last stock crisis was what, 2008 - and cars values went up in 2014/2015, when people having bought shares at the lows of 2008 realised their gains (OK it's a simplistic analysis, but at least as valid as the article :) ), and before that after the internet bubble crash of 2001 cars did not go up for a long time.
    After the 2015-2016 peak the car market was on a mild correction, but now it will crash because the world is entering a recession - but since it's less liquid than the stock market, it will take more time (the market will freeze for some time because all owners will believe for a while that they can wait - but some will then face the fact that they cannot) and in the same way as for stocks, the best time to buy will be during the crash (I'd say whereas it's now time to buy stocks, it will be time to buy cars 6 months to one year from now).
    Unfortunately the opportunities to buy stocks and then cars are for people with tons of cash - others with limited cash (my case), will only marginally benefit from the situation.
     
  13. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    5,915
    I don't believe we are done with the stock market,we just seeing a few dead cat bounces.Let me know when the S&P 500 hits below 2000 with a real capitulation .

    Does anyone think we will just flip a switch when Covid is 'under control' and everything will be back to normal?
     
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  14. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    Aug 22, 2002
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    i dont think that the valid question...look a the title of the thread. the more relevant question is if you haven't bought a ferrari in the past 4000 days, when will you buy one? very simple.
     
  15. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    5,915
    You tell me , my comment was about stock market.
     
  16. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    fair question - after 3500 posts im not sure why i continue to revisit this thread...
     
  17. albkid

    albkid Karting

    Jul 1, 2016
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    Jim
    Hobby? I could do without the scratches to my arms after working on the engine. The fun I get is when I tell the nurse at the ER I was laughing as the blood squirted out.
     
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  18. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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    romano schwabel
    what is ER? emergency room?
     
  19. Platini 289

    Platini 289 Karting

    Sep 21, 2015
    81
    Whether there was, is or will be a bubble depends on your entry point into the market. It is as simple as that. Some will experience a bubble, some won't. Whether a 50% drop in a car's resale value is palpable is an entirely different matter and depends on the owner concerned.
     
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  20. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
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    Dave Powers
    Yes, exactly.
     
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  21. wolfchen75

    wolfchen75 Karting

    Aug 7, 2004
    117
    Bridgehampton
    nothing but used car salesmen trying to talk up their business , A Ferrari has no intrinsic worth, just what it can be sold for on any given day/location . No one know where anything in the economy of the entire world is going right now
     
  22. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    Aug 22, 2002
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    This is true for all assets, cash and gold included.
     
  23. 19633500GT

    19633500GT F1 Veteran
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    Nov 9, 2010
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    Ken S
    the only truths I've been able to see through and live by since 2010 or so in the vintage car world is: good cars, with good provenance, and no stories, will always bring good money.

    "good" may be subjective as markets go up and down, but the point remains, as wolfchen alluded to above, the world surely does not know where it is going, and for 95% of market offered cars, that's not a good thing. For the other 5% that fit into my above mentioned category, it's business as usual for really good cars, and they'll continue to sell (without a COVID adjustment, for the moment at least). A few of my friends who do high end brokerage have all said the same thing, and discreet buyers are still buying, for good prices, we just don't hear about 99% of the sales.
     
  24. italiancars

    italiancars F1 Rookie

    Apr 18, 2004
    2,534
    Hershey, PA
    While there caveats with everything, if there is one car that can tell you the general direction of the market it’s the Daytona. If Daytona prices are rising so is everything else and vice-versa.
     
  25. wrxmike

    wrxmike F1 Veteran
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    Mar 20, 2004
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    Michael
    It must be hard to enjoy the ownership experience for those who seem to be preoccupied mainly with the "value" of their car - constantly worrying about wether or not they should sell it when prices are high or wondering If they missed the boat ? Pondering is now a good time to buy ? Or do you wait for 3 , 5, 8, 10 years.
    It's pathetic.
    I've observed that Ferrari prices go up, Ferrari prices go down. Sometimes prices are stable.And I've also observed that it generally costs money to have fun, regardeless of what it is, and so why should owning a sports car be any different.
    Now if you want a Ferrari and can afford it, just buy it and enjoy without guilt. Sell it if you want something else or if you no longer enjoy it. You're not smart waiting - the clock is always ticking, there are no guarantees in life - no one knows how long they are going to be around for. But one thing is for sure, every day that passes is one less day you could be enjoying the ownership experience.
     

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