I know there are quite a few 360 guys out there that have had or are having immobilizer issues that end up causing nightmares or just being a PIA. If it were possible to electronically eliminate the immobilizer through the ECUs, would you guys be up for having it done? I'm working with a group that may be able to do it. I know I am up for it...
I could explain how do to this for the price of a inexpensive cable and access to a laptop with some software on it... .... but wait .... The concern I have is, posting into the public domain an exact "how to do it guide" and say release the appropiate software tool into the public domain renders EVERYONE's immobilizer completely worthless and will likely lead to some cars being stolen... Is this a path we really want to take???
It would only be for those who actually performed the bypass. And........ if you performed the bypass by your own decision............ then you accept the risk that your car is more susceptible to theft. Also I don't believe a potential thief would necessarily know that you don't have a security system. Personally, if I decide to go this route I would then install a super duper security system with GPS tracking like I have on my old Porsche.
That's the issue, it wouldn't just be for those who chose to deactivate their immobilizer, it would render the entire system broken.... Since once disclosed, and more importantly once a piece of appropriate software which automates the entire process is 'out there', it becomes trivial to do, very quick (takes seconds with a laptop and cheap cable) so it thereby renders all cars immobilizers useless, making the car as easy to steal as a 1980's car which had only a steering lock to defeat. Also everyone thinking Trackers are their saviour, think again, GPS is no longer a problem either since you can easily block GPS and GSM. Both jammers are freely available to buy from China.
Just stumbled on a thread today in fchat - ecu doctors in FL offers a permanent immobilizer delete kit and immofix has a service to retrieve your code and make 3 remotes. Both options are under $1k versus $3k at a dealer to replace the ECU and program new fobs. As for the argument about thieves stealing 360's - it's simply not going to happen. If thieves are going to target an exotic, it's going to be a modern car worth $200k+, not a 10+ year car worth as much as a loaded escalade. 99% of all immo issues are due to lost or damaged remotes from legitimate owners.
I'm not as confident as you about this. If it is super quick and trivial to do it makes it easier. Also Ferrari's are also seen as a prize to some thieves, especially so called joy riders... Also since the cars are often worth more in (expensive) parts than they are as a whole it could be still tempting. And Finally let us also not forget that the same immobilizer is used on the Challenge Stradale too which has seen some of the prices already go over $200k+...
What's stupid is that there are at least 2 vendors who can crack the factory system and either extra the original pin or bypass the system entirely, whereas Ferrari claims they cannot and wants to charge $3000+ to essentially get a 2nd remote. For the owner who can 100% prove ownership but for a 13yr old car the pin is lost they should have a way of recovering it. Gouge us and charge us $1k. But having to replace the ecu and charge $3k is too much.
That is always the concern. But don't the pro crooks already invest in these kinds of tools for the tricks of their trade anyway? Isn't the real reason so few Ferraris are stolen is they either don't start just because they are Ferraris, live 99% of their lives in a garage aka garage queen, and driving down the road they scream look at me...not exactly what a crook wants. It is much easier to steal a BMW
If they REALLY want your/our/my Ferrari.. they're going to tow it away. Even the brand new 488. A crap 16 year old immobilizer won't stop them. Luckily Ferrari parts aren't as in demand as Honda parts or Toyota. If a Ferrari is stolen as was the 308 in the North West.. it actually makes the news. What it will do is stop an owner from enjoying their car. At which time putting in another crap immobilizer system or bypassing it altogether. I choose the latter personally.
Those who have bypassed the immo, is that the only thing you lost. Does the central locking with the fob still work, etc?
The ECU doctors product is not an immobilizer bypass, it replaces the immobilizer interface and eliminates the need to press a fob to disarm the system, but the immobilizer is still "in circuit" and the car won't run without it. The fob still works to lock and unlock the door, but if you are prepared to do that, you may as well have it arm/disarm the system at the same time ( ie work as delivered ), so no real benefit in that case M
This is completely unnecessary on these older Bosch units. There is actually a factory defined setting to disable the Immobilizer function built in by Bosch. You just need to know how to access it and re-calcuate the checksums. Then you don't need any immobilizer at all since the firmware is programmed to check if the override is enabled or not. The car alarm which is connected to the central locking function is seperate to the immobilizer and in its own unit. Once the immobilizer is removed in software you can entirely remove the immoblizer unit from the car as it no longer needs to send a message to the ignition computers to allow them to start the engine. I'm thinking I may develop a small device to allow people to do this but to ensure its only used for legitimate purposes lock it to one car and ensure its registered mail sent to the same address as the cars owner. I could make this as cheap as $200 (or less) and I could allow you to enable/disable immoblizer functions at the owners will. Furthermore it could act as a backup unit to clone your existing ecu data and firmware version into a pair of backup (even if they are used and paired!) old Bosch Ignition ecu's. I think you can still get the same unit for very low prices from old Alfa's and such, less than $100 but I just need to try it and see it 100% works as i expect first. This would mean for the price of approximately $400 you could have 2 backup (used) ignition ecu's pre-paired (with no need to use an SD2), just direct swap over and drive away. If I added a touch screen to it and could later extend its functions over the internet software upgrade to do things such as reset trouble codes (even ones which don't go away after a battery reset and normally require an SD2) as well as perform operations such as brake fluid purging and TCU pis set for F1 equipped cars and even remapping to Challenge Stradale fuel and throttle sensitivity maps for a modest power increase (or back to stock) whenever the mood takes you. That would be quite a powerful device for the 360... If there is enough interest I could flesh it out and build a prototype. As you can tell from the prices this wouldn't be a done for a massive profit but to give something back to the community... leave it with me and I'll have a think.. Trev
id be in too and I don't even have a car yet but I will soon. Is this something you can do or will it work for a 430 to
Trev - you are amazing. I'm not smart enough to know why I need back up ecu's, but I'd get some just to support the project.
Hey that would be fantastic. The immo is one of the top problems with these cars as we all know people lose keys over a decade or so. A quick note - immofixer in Australia mentions on their FAQ that the engine ECUs are paired to the Immo. So if you swap or replace engine ECUs you could be forced to replace the immo. Being able to back up the ecus would be an incredible feature. I spoke with Jorge at ECU Doctors yesterday and he says there's 2 separate systems, the alarm and the immo. If you bypass the immo, the alarm still will work. You can use the fob to lock/unlock the car and set the security system off. If you lose the fob, you can still use the car without enabling the alarm system. The ignition will always be hot even if the alarm is going off. He thinks you can also disable the alarm when active by inserting the key into the door and locking/unlocking. After discussing with him, the best case for me is for him to extract the factory pin and create 2 extra fobs so it's like factory. And once you have the pin you can create more remotes at a later time.
