Hysol EA9360 or Loctite 603 High Strength. | FerrariChat
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Hysol EA9360 or Loctite 603 High Strength.

Discussion in '612/599' started by Autodetailing, Mar 19, 2023.

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  1. Autodetailing

    Autodetailing Karting

    Oct 5, 2021
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    John
    #1 Autodetailing, Mar 19, 2023
    I will soon be replacing the upper and lower ball joints on the 599 and I am curious to know if anybody has used Loctite 603 High Strength bearing fit instead of the Hysol EA 9360 epoxy glue.
    As a time served engineer, we always used Loctite bearing fit on assembly of bearings onto shafts or housings where added strength was needed.
    Believe me, once cured, the only way the shaft or bearing would come loose was with the aid of a blow torch and an hydraulic press.
    Curiously when working on Italian equipment, we always found that most parts were not "interference fit ", and we had to use bearing fit to keep the bearing in place.
    The Loctite has advantages over the Hysol as it cures at normal room temp within 10 minutes, it does not require any baking at all.
    As i am going to use the Hill Engineering stainless ball joints, and as they specify Hysol i will use it, but i just wondered if anybody had used Loctite as an alternative?
     
  2. Autodetailing

    Autodetailing Karting

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    John
    #2 Autodetailing, Mar 29, 2023
    Quick update. I have been talking to a motorsport race mechanic about replacing the ball joints on the 599. He informed me that he and other mechanics have always used Loctite High Strength Bearing Fit / or similar when installing new ball joints etc and have never had any failures with ball joints coming loose in their housings.
    Once fully cured the only way the bearing can be removed is via a blow torch and hydraulic press.
    There are many benefits, firstly the curing time is vastly reduced being around 10 to 30 minutes, its just as strong as the Hysol if not stronger, and there is no mixing required with a gun, plus its only around $20.
     
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  3. Onzeeoffensive

    Onzeeoffensive Rookie
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    Feb 21, 2023
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    Derek
    #3 Onzeeoffensive, Mar 29, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2023
    Hysol EA 9360 is actually Loctite EA 9360 Aero Paste Adhesive. Loctite EA 9360 is also a room temperature cure. For reference, the 9360 is essentially an aerospace product.

    https://www.e-aircraftsupply.com/MSDS/74829EA 9360 AERO.pdf

    My understanding is that 603 is for bearings. I wouldn't use it when there's a perfect product made for this.

    So to summarize:
    Loctite makes two products you're discussing.
    Don't be lazy and use the wrong one.
    It's a three day cure at room temperature for best result, BEFORE you put them load them. (It's actually a week, but no one waits a week).
    Talking about "only $20" makes me seriously wonder why you're on a Ferrari forum.
     
  4. Autodetailing

    Autodetailing Karting

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    #4 Autodetailing, Mar 31, 2023
    I am not going to get into a tit for tat exchange with you Derek.
    The main point of the thread was to ask if anybody out there had used a different product for securing the ball joints in place - answer NO! simple lets move on.
    Seriously why am i on a Ferrari forum, or why is anybody on a Ferrari forum? - i simply love my 599 and also my previous Ferraris, Astons and Maserati cars.
    Its about sharing a common interest and love for the marque not how much money i spend on my car.
    Note - i needed a new rubber damper on my fuel cap:
    Original OEM part from Scuderia Parts was £9, from Ferrari dealership £13.95.
    There is an old proverb Derek " a fool and his money are soon parted "
    Ps normal people spell Derek with a C as in prick!
     
  5. Onzeeoffensive

    Onzeeoffensive Rookie
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    #5 Onzeeoffensive, Mar 31, 2023
    Confucius says: Just because people do something in a stupid way and says it's fine, doesn't mean your ball joints won't fall off while you're driving.

    You want to know whether or not stud and bearing loctite for rebuilding engines is for ball joints, and the answer is no.

    You're the second idiot I've run into this forum.
     
  6. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    John Zornes
    #6 Skidkid, Mar 31, 2023
    Reel it in, no name calling. That will get you banned.

    You asked a question. Derek answered it. You said 'I have anecdotal evidence that it is fine.' Derek said 'Bad idea, they are different products for a reason.' From there the thread fell apart. I agree with Derek, if you want to do it another way (non sanctioned way) and take your chances have at it but don't complain if it fails. And yea, $20 on a multi $1000 repair is in the noise so complaining about it sounds a bit odd.
     
  7. brogenville

    brogenville Formula 3
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    Robin
    #7 brogenville, Apr 3, 2023
    On a related note... if you use Prekom ball joints instead, you don't need to use the fancy 2 part epoxy at all. Thats just how its sold, and has been well proven now. Quality is fantastic, and they're all stainless steel like Hill's.

    The thing is.... do you really, really think the adhesive is as critical as Ferrari make out? Reason I say that is that getting a consistent bond quality from an adhesive is quite tricky, and frankly it would be a brave person who stakes the lives of thousands of customers on the basis that the garage will get it right every time with regards to surface prep, bond temperature, humidity, cleanliness etc. Trust me, there is a lot that can go wrong, and thats with rigirous QA/QC processes in place. Also, I've removed half a dosen or so Ferrari ball joints, and some of them did not take that much to press out at all AFTER the circlip was removed. I.e. the glue, whatever they used, was doing next to **** all.

    My point is that its the circlip that's doing 99+% of the heavy lifting here.
     
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  8. Autodetailing

    Autodetailing Karting

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    #8 Autodetailing, Apr 4, 2023
    You are 100% correct Robin, i never posted the complete conversation with the race mechanic but you have echoed is thoughts on the subject.
    The ball joint ( spherical bearing ), is pressed into the control arm and secured either side with a circlip, it also has a bolt going through the middle of it as well.
    I hate to say this but the fit and tolerances of Italian engineering leaves a lot to be desired, i speak from experience as i have repaired and maintained German, English and Italian beverage machinery.
    In most all instances when replacing bearings in Italian equipment, we had to use bearing fit as the bearing simply pushed in with your fingers!
     
    brogenville likes this.

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