How stupid do car dealers think we are?

So did you buy one or not?

I bought a car from a Toyota dealership on Monday. They're a new dealership and dropped the ball about 10 times, but it's ok. I'm understanding with that kinda thing. It's funny though that no matter what happens they are "getting you an amazing deal" and you should leave feeling like you owe them your life. Every single dealer I've ever dealt with was like that. Just expect it and you won't be so mad

If you ever wanna buy a Land Rover let me know. A friend of mine is an internet sales rep for one of their dealerships. I got his e-mail address...haha.

 

Lots of dealers like to use that "power" or "control" approach. They feel that if they can control you in the situation that they will always come out on top. It is a shame that they feel that way. It is actually starting to affect more and more people just the way it does you and can turn more business away than what it can ever overcome.

I would always give out any information the customer wanted as far as contact numbers and addresses as long as it did not infringe on the privacy or homelife of our employees. Email address of the internet manager? How stupid is that dealer being if they do not give it out immediately or give at least an email address to the internet dept? I mean, give me a break, the internet dept gets over 30% of all the leads at a dealership with very little overhead. It is a great profit center for the dealership and any dealer that turns someone away because of the way they get pushed around a dealership needs to reexamine how they are treating it.

Stick to your guns............Oh, Gojo does a great job of getting the "slime" off. If that does not work, LAVA bar soap.......

 

Last month I saw a Hummer H2 at a local dealer on Ebay. 2006 15K miles, chrome package, TVs...loaded. ( INTERNET SPECIAL $39,900!!!). I saved it to " My Ebay".
I have been looking and most are in the $48K range. I got up the next morning, no shower, baseball cap, timex... drove to the dealer in my 2003 H2 with 98k miles . Typical non-English speaking salesman rushes out to greet me. I tell him I am interested in a new hummer. He starts showing me the 2008s. $70k. I ask how much he will give me in trade. He has his "manager" drive mine around the parking lot and offer $20k. ( I was hoping for $15K). I play with him a little and get him to $21k.
I then look over and see the SUT I saw on Ebay. I asked about it. He says" Oh, it is used, you don't want it". I pretty much have to drag him out there. The truck is perfect. Headsets and remote controls have never even been taken out of box. It is perfect-not a scratch. Looks showroom floor new. I ask him how much, he say $48,999. I say " Wow, that looks just like the one they have listed on Ebay at $39,900. He says oh no, can't be. We go back to his office and he keeps denying that it is the same truck or that they can sell it for that. He pretty much calls me and the camel I rode in on a liar! He does come down to $48,500, graciously.
I ask to borrow his computer. He says only employees can access internet , something about porn, but I get him to go to Ebay. He types in the search,and no SUT at the parameters he put in. CRAP. I am pissed, maybe too much beer in college has destroyed some neurons.
I started thinking, I do not know the zip code in that area. I wrestle him for the computer and log in to my Ebay and BOOM, there it is. He back peddles , says something to the affect that the " Ebay Department at his dealership" must have put that on there without him knowing it, and that he personally cannot sell it at that price since he is not on the "Ebay team". I look at him for three minutes, no words, and I finally ask to where can I go to find his " Ebay Department"? After much production, a silk shirted gentleman- Ebay Director- shows up and helps close the deal. $18,900 difference. Chalk one up for the buyer!

 

^ you da Man !
I am at the point where I expect to be jacked with. I jack back. Its a little game that needs to be perfected, practice.
Boardwalk Porsche had a $70k 996 GT2 for sale on the Internet that disappeared when I actually had the gall to try to buy it.

 

I'm an internet Sales Consultant at a Lexus dealership. I don't know how others do it, but my direct email address and phone number are in my signature in every email. The problem is that customers have been so turned off by auto dealers that when they speak with me on the phone (someone that can actually be trusted), I still look like the bad guy and it takes some time to break that barrier.

Sometimes something that may seem strange, isn't as strange as you think. Like if a car sells right underneath you, they may not be playing games... they may have actually sold the car. Remember, they are a car dealer and it is their job to sell cars and more than often, you aren't the only one looking at a certain car.

 

I understand your guys pain with these guys, but for a guy that is in the business I can tell you it works both ways. I am not sticking up for all of these slime balls because there are plenty in the car business and the middle level and low end dealerships seem to be the worst. I have never worked at one of these dealerships I have been fortunte enough to work only with exotic's.

Like I said this does work both ways! Many people will wear out a salesman over $100 bucks and still never buy a car! I mean what should ethical profit be on a car??? 1% of the price of the car ??? I mean most people will pay 80 to 90% mark-up on say a shirt or shoes and never think twice about. Just because there is a negotiation process in the car business and almost nothing else we buy, dosen't make it right to want a dealer to make zero profit!

I personaly get stroked daily by people that call me and then will never call me back---- Try to buy a 100k car and have never had a loan before---- Try to buy a car for any where from 5,000 to 50,000 under auction and NADA value and still want clean retail for there trade-in. The list goes on and on!

This truely does work both ways, I get lied to every day from clients.
I wish this was not true and there was a simple fair way to make car buying and selling a easy and fun process.

 

Try Carmax, they may not have as many brand new cars, but they've got plenty with very low miles and you pay what the sticker says, no wheel and dealing.

I was in and out in less then 3 hours.

One of the best experiences I've had in car buying to date.

 

+1,000,000. Couldn't have said it better myself. There are bad dealers out there but there are also great dealers out there. I too get phone calls all day from people looking for numbers, that say they are coming in and never show up. I then find out that they took the info. that I gave them to another dealer. If you are honest and admit that you are shopping then that is fine but when you say you are coming in and I go and get a salesperson ready and a car ready then it does get a little annoying. Dealerships do have a right to earn a profit; I've gotten to a point where I'll say to someone "don't we deserve a profit" and they will say yes but then go on to tell me they want to be $500 under cost and it isn't there problem that we are losing money.

I really don't understand why there is a negotiating process with cars, there isn't one with anything else except homes. IMO, they should all decide to stop negotiating and tell the customer (you don't want to pay this price then go buy something else).

 

How true! I must also say I just bought a car from Lamborghini of Dallas. Great experience. I can't say enough nice things about them. Scot was great and went above and beyond the call of duty. If anyone is considering purchasing a car from them, I give them two thumbs up.

 

Carmax, they may not have as many brand new cars, but they've got plenty with very low miles and you pay what the sticker says, no wheel and dealing.

I was in and out in less then 3 hours.

One of the best experiences I've had in car buying to date.


I got screwed by them big time. Do not use thier financing. Carmax are bunch of crooks. .

 

Mind giving us a few more pointers on your knowledge about the system, for us younger guys?

 

Dale, they have to feed an entire dealer network off you. Except for the spiffs, holdback, and ad subsidies. Oh yeah, the ADP for CSI.

I usually ask dealer I know to give me GM name/used'em up manager name. They usually all talk/know each other. Go downhill from there, becomes a "house deal" or a manager's pet deal. You get jacked, walk, and let pipeline know.

If new dealership/brand, I start with service dept. Ask random customers how service is, notice how many look annoyed. Ask Writer/svc mgr. to see CSI #'s. Money is made in back of store, so if that is well run, front is adequate at least. If they squirm, walk. Local BMW dealer lost me after 11 cars over 8 years. They lost their ADP (add'l dealer profit, usually 10% of gross receipts of service) due to lousy CSI.

1 Email. Not answered, call and ask for new car sales manager or GM. If answered, work deal in 1-2 max, or call GM. If GM blows you off or doesn't hook it up, punt. Do a few dealers at same time, locator will show who's looking at what. Lord, it's a Toyota, don't they sell them in kiosks at banks?

 

Dale,

I wish I had had the opportunity to work with you when I was in high-end auto sales (BMW then Ferrari). I did not use a greeter system and did not have a bunch of guys standing out on the lot ready to pounce on the first person who enters the lot. Our guys were instructed to let people stop, get out of their cars and look around for a couple of minutes. One of our sales people then were to walk up introduce themselves, ask the customer if they could point them in the right direction for the type car they were looking for or would they rather be left to look around for a few minutes. Most people liked the low pressure approach and would go ahead and tell the salesperson what they were looking for.

All our salespeople had the ability to take the deal completely through from greet to the final signing. They knew the limits on where they were allowed to take a deal and did not have to "go talk to my sales manager". People like that also. Plus it gives the salesperson more credibility.

I always told them to treat the customer the way they would want to be treated themselves. It seemed to work as we had very little turnover and had many, many repeat and referral customers. I had gotten to the point where I did not take any floor traffic and only worked with referrals and repeats. That is where a salesperson wants to end up. Each sale becomes easier and if the customers are given a fair deal each time, they will come back.

Our guys on the floor never interfered with the internet guys but could sell anything that we advertised on the internet if a person came to the floor with the info on the vehicle. Some of those dealerships out there are pretty low life and unfortunately many salespeople have developed very poor work and integrity habits. This seems to be pretty widespread. But if you look at the most successful salespeople it is those who develop good integrity habits and usually they are the ones who have been at a particular dealership a long time. The ones who treat you like crap are usually the ones who flit from dealership to dealership and never seem to stay at one very long. They leave when the lies they have told begin coming back to haunt them.

There are also many times when the customer lies more than a salesperson ever would. I told our guys that if they began to lie like some of the customers I would fire them on the spot. "Just be straight and honest about all aspects of the deal and they will happen", is what I would tell them in our Saturday morning meetings. Some deals did not make but our guys always went away knowing that they were doing it right.

Unfortunately I have been gone from automobile business for 4 years now and I do miss it. I do not miss the lying and misleading from both sides but I do miss the relationships that I developed in the 23 years I spent while doing cars..............

 

We've bought three times from dealers over the years and only ever had 2 contacts per - the salesman and the "finance" guy who tries to sell the warranties while you sign the carbon sheet which forms the contract that binds you but ironically not the dealer who can change your financing terms after that. The Subaru dealership was the best and easiest.

 

The guys in the car business trying to defend themselves by talking about lying customers are hilarious. Dealers set up this system that promotes dishonesty and then complain when customer try to work them? If you REALLY wanted to straighten this out, you would go to a true no haggle system. But the truth is people are stupid and they get easily confused then fleeced. If those designer clothes had to be haggled for, it would create the same warped system.

This is the business model dealers love, and they become slimeballs by choice. I always feel dirty buying a car....yuck.

 

I am currently driving my 8th vehicle that I purchased (leased) brand new. In these 8 transactions I have only been TO'ed once and that was on the first one. In all of the remaining transactions I was UP-ed (either by walk-in or over the phone), demoed, sold and signed by the same individual.

8 vehicles, 7 different brands, 7 different dealerships, 7 different salespeople and only one F&I turnover. Maybe things work differently in the metro Detroit area.

 

You sir need to work in the car industry for a while. I stated in my earlier post that some dealers allow this and actually encourage it. They are the slimeballs. I also stated that the real culprits are shortlived in the dealerships and move around a lot.

I never minded a customer working me for their best deal. I always tried to make that the shortest part of the deal but being in the car business, it was a part of it. But customers do lie:
1. "Oh, it is is factory fresh condition, never wrecked"-then why is it the front fender does not match the rest of the car?
2. "It is a very low mileage car"-then why is the brake pedal worn out after only 21,000 miles???
3. "My credit is perfect"-with a score of 510 on Experian?? And a repo??
4. "Been on my present job 3 years"-verification says two months and still on initial three month trial period.

I take great offense at what you just stated above. I did not allow it at the dealerships I managed and would fire anyone who I found out was acting this way. Not all dealers are into dishonesty and I do not think you should make a blanket statement when you really have no experience in the area. You may have bought 10 or 12 cars in your life. Does that qualify you to judge all dealers? I think not. I have sold roughly 2,500 cars myself and I cannot count how many have sold through the dealerships I managed over the years. I believe that better qualifies me to make statements about what goes on in the car industry than you. And I agree that some dealers taint the good ones but your overall statement says that there are no good dealers out there. That sir is a mistake and even though I am now out of the car business I have many friends still in it who are sincere, honest and people of integrity.

I am sorry you have had a bad experience when purchasing a car. Do you go into the dealership on the defensive and attack the salespeople? You know, you have the right to change salespeople if you do not like the one you are with. I have had to do that before. If you feel you are being lied to, misled or mistreated, walk out, go to the sales manager and let them know why you are leaving. They will want to know. If they do not, this is one of the "slimeball" dealerships you spoke of and you do not want to do business with them anyway.........just leave..........But do not judge all dealerships by the few you have had bad experiences with.

And I notice you have been on Ferrarichat for three years and choose not to subscribe or share anything else about yourself to us. Is there a reason why you are so open to voice your judgment about others but choose to remain in secrecy about yourself? Just curious........

 

oh, maybe I didn't come across the way I meant to. I totally support your decision to do the E-purchase thing. The point that I was trying to make was that not every dealer subscribes to the same old slimey tactics that were the norm in years past. Even if I was to buy a car over the computer I would still have to drive the thing and inspect the car that I was buying before I signed for it...still going to have to spend some time at the car store.