How old is too old to start racing? | FerrariChat

How old is too old to start racing?

Discussion in 'Tracking & Driver Education' started by davemqv, Jan 7, 2017.

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  1. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
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    Dave
    Racing in some form or another is a lifelong dream of mine, I took some driving courses in my youth, but I'm now in my early 40's, and when I honestly assess my work, and the rather punishing schedule and feast or famine finances that come with it, I imagine I'll be in at least my mid-later 40's before I can carve out the time to head to the track with any regularity, plus the fact that at this point I'd want to start over from the beginning.

    I don't aspire to be an F1 driver or anything like that, but I'd love to take part in some simple club racing, or be part of a regular track group. I'm still fit and my vision is good.

    At what age did most of you start?
     
  2. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
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    Didn't Paul Newman start in his sixties - I'm pretty sure quite a few of today's gentleman racers only begin in their fifties once they've made enough money to fund the habit
     
  3. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
    3,859
    I think most drivers started young, before their teen years with karts. But not everyone. P.L. Newman didn't start till his 40s. And continued racing into his 70s.

    My only words of caution is that it costs a lot of money. At the club level, there is little to no sponsorship. If you plan to prepare your own car, it takes an incredible amount of time.

    The most bang for your buck is karts. But it requires a higher level of fitness.
     
  4. joe1973

    joe1973 Formula Junior

    Nov 12, 2016
    285
    NJ
    Depending on your budget- investigate from spec Miata racing to Porsche or Ferrari Club racing to SCCA. Dominate and then go up from there. A friend of mine went from Porsche Club racing to Continental Series and he said the transition was like High school varsity sports to Pro. You'll also need very deep pockets or sponsors and lots of time going Pro.
    Best of luck in whatever you choose. Keep us posted. Most of all, enjoy, be safe and learn.
     
  5. Smiles

    Smiles F1 World Champ
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    Nov 20, 2003
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    Matt F
    Oh, no. Around 37 years old when he got hooked on "Winning!"

    I think it gets harder in the mid-40s.

    But it's always do-able.

    Matt
     
  6. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
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    No going pro! Haha.

    Porsche Club racing has always sounded cool to me. That's my ultimate aspiration - racing seriously, but part time and for fun.
     
  7. ProCoach

    ProCoach F1 Veteran
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    Sep 15, 2004
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    Actually, most club level drivers start when they're old enough to afford it. After the kids are grown enough and business is good enough so that racing is not too much of a strain. They begin gently, then the ones that continue spend whatever they can afford to race at the level they want. A few can't control their obsession and it hurts them with their family and with their finances, but most enjoy it and racing fills a need that little else does.

    I have worked with a fair number who started young (late teens, early twenties), quit, raised a family, became successful and came back in their mid fifties, becoming quite successful in the venues they chose. A few are running at Daytona in the Roar Before the 24 test this weekend.

    A majority of the people I work with are between mid forties and early seventies. One of my clients beat a 24 year old pro when he had just turned 78 in front of twenty-five thousand people in August at Laguna Seca, but he races two or three dozen times a year and has since the Sixties. He's not a pro, he's a restauranteur!

    So if you have a hankering, try some HPDE (drivers education events run by PCA, BMWCCA or organizations like Chin Motorsports) or go to a professional school like the Lucas Oil School, Simraceway or Allan Berg on the West Coast, Bertil Roos or Skip Barber on the East Coast and learn the basics. Then, go to some venues you think you'd like to run and ask questions. Rent a car, pick a class and resolve FIRST to have FUN!

    Pro is not fun. It's work. Some people like it, but few stay for very long. I have a client that ran Ferrari Challenge, Lamborghini SuperTrofeo AND an entry level pro class in a Porsche GT4 CS, all in one season, and THAT is not generally sustainable, even if the money is there. PCA Club Racing is cool. Historic racing is cool. SCCA and NASA are just club racing, with all the good and bad that comes with that. I've raced SCCA, NASA, historic and entry level pro for thirty years and I'm still winning. You wouldn't know by looking at me! It's fun, that's all I can say.

    Enjoy it and let us know what you decide to do. But don't let age get in your way.
     
    Nicholasspeece and budracerf1 like this.
  8. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
    26,295
    socal
    I like what procoach has to say. About fun...it is all fun until something breaks and you have hauled your car 100s of miles or even 1000s. Stick to simple cars at first. Some classes have gas and oil cars. Some are so complicated you need a very experienced crew chief to setup the car. An older cheaper car has more annoying things that break. You can always replace stuff as part of your race prep but there is always another older part ready to fail. You want fun kiss is the rule.
     
  9. fluque

    fluque Formula 3

    Jul 30, 2004
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    Fernando
    Why wait? Get yourself into karting which is affordable, very challenging and great fun. Later move on to cars if you want.
     
  10. pfl

    pfl Karting

    Jan 7, 2013
    105
    I started with karts at 24 and transitioned into HPDE after, and while I still do HPDE, I did NASA. NASA was not much fun with their rules and such but was a good experience. I still think at my age being under 40, doing HPDE but in form of a challenge (there are many) has been the most rewarding.
     
  11. JV's89

    JV's89 F1 Veteran
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    Jul 18, 2006
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    This.

    Karting is much more challenging than people know. If you get good at karting, you are going to be fast in a car.

    As for age; I started in my early forties about ten tears ago. I won my class (Yamaha Senior) this year.
     
    Bas likes this.
  12. ducrob

    ducrob Formula Junior

    Nov 20, 2011
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    Started when I was 34. Try a TAG kart (electric start two stroke). You had better be in decent shape though, these are violent machines and if your prone to nausea, bring some medication....
     
  13. JV's89

    JV's89 F1 Veteran
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    I would recommend something a little more tame for a beginner. In my experience, people that start in TAG tend to develop bad habits. The lower hp karts (four stroke or Yamaha) force you to run the proper line and maintain momentum in order to be competitive.

    I've also seen more than a few people quit due to rib injuries incurred while trying TAG karts.

    I love TAG, and still run them, but they are not for novices.
     
  14. ducrob

    ducrob Formula Junior

    Nov 20, 2011
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    Yeah, your right....I started in Yamaha with direct drive then went to a heavily tuned Yamaha with a clutch that was set on kill. The Yamaha series was much more expensive to be competitive in than Rotax and is dead around these parts now. The four stroke stuff is competitive but just doesn't give me that little shiver of fear....
     
  15. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
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    Dave
    Thanks everyone for the input.

    I may try karting until I can get to the track for classes again. It's a little confusing. For instance there are "go-kart" tracks around NYC but is that the same as "kart racing"?

    I drove some go karts when i was a kid and while they were fun, they weren't what i would describe as fast. It was more a "fun for the whole family" kind of a deal. But maybe that's a different hing and it was a long time ago, sooo?
     
  16. JV's89

    JV's89 F1 Veteran
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    Racing karts are much different than concession (fun) karts. Even the rental karts that are available at most kart tracks are challenging compared to fun karts.

    Englishtown has a real racing series, but I think it's a bit of a compromise, as it's set up in the parking lot. Not sure if they have a rental fleet.
     
  17. sainthoo

    sainthoo Formula 3
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    Procoach nailed it.
    Start smart with some HPDE or a school. You will appreciate the knowledge and progress faster inmho.

    I started with Skip Barber, did a bunch of HPDE, then went club racing, started in late 30's. I got into a car that was not forgiving, which was embarrassing and humbling at first (Ariel Atom- oversteer in spades, brutal), but I learned a lot.

    I have since gotten into BMW sedans which is like a Cadillac on a Sunday drive by comparison. Costs of racing are not too bad if you chose wisely. For me having someone to race against/ with is the part that I enjoy. Being comfortable and not spending a fortune is nice too. Outright pace of vehicle is not important to me- making a "slow" vehicle fast in the corners, race craft are the thrilling moments of racing. The final, perhaps most important key for me, is having a good group to race with- people do get hurt and being able to trust those people around you is essential to enjoyment. The moments I was racing against hot heads was much more stressful.

    I think if you want to start with a school and some HPDE, start now, do 1 event a year, 2 if you can make it. When you get more time, then jump in. There is LOTS to learn, no reason to try to learn it all in 1 year.
     
  18. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
    3,859
    Not about work at all. It's about money, cheaters, and crooks.
     
  19. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
    3,859

    There's many different levels of karting.

    E.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5j0F0fhNnU&t=374s
     
  20. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    Sep 3, 2002
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    To answer the OP's question it is never too old to start racing. You can have a lot of fun and even race, be competitive, and win in some major international races if you have (in order):

    1. MONEY - #1 most important thing to go racing and progress. Even if you start in your 30's and you are brilliantly good (I mean full on pro good) you will always be seen as a pay driver in race circles and will never get paid to race. A total reality of the game and know there is no shame in being a pay gentleman driver if you deliver the goods on race day.

    2. Desire and work ethic - To do racing well takes hard work and extreme dedication. I believe this even comes ahead of talent as getting better requires a diligent grinding away over many years. Nobody is awesome straight away.

    3. Talent - Some modicum of talent is required but money and work ethic will most times trump it. Forget for a moment that talent will eliminate or reduce in any significant way the need for cash.
     
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  21. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    There is not much that can be made safer than a bmw sedan. As you go from 30 to 40 to 50 to 60y/o the body can't take as many wacks. If you race it is not if but when will you crash. It is also easier to get out of a sedan and very normal to see cool suits vs. The studs in open wheel cars in black carbon helmets black suits and black cars cooking on a 90 degree day. The office is hot and that takes its toll on the aging too. Add in a little arthritis and fun can become not fun very quickly.
     
  22. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
    3,859
    It doesn't really matter when you start. You could start at 5 years old, and you still aren't going to be paid. The idea that drivers get paid is probably THE biggest misconception about racing. The driver is the one who pays everyone else. You don't have money? You're not racing !

    Sponsorship? Sure you might get sponsorship from a commercial enterprise. If your family owns that commercial enterprise ! You might get some free stuff like brake cleaner, or spark plugs, or tires. Free tires does help. But you are going to be financing the bulk of the racing costs yourself. That's the reality of it.
     
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  23. spicedriver

    spicedriver F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2011
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    Open wheel cars don't need cool suits because that 150 mph breeze cools you down just fine.
     
  24. sainthoo

    sainthoo Formula 3
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    Cooking mid race is not a problem, but sitting on the grid waiting for the start it sure is.
     
  25. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    And you fancy boys have umbrella grid girls! All we tintop guys have is crew chief with greasy fingernails.
     

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