How long can you leave synthetic oil in car

Adding synthetic oil to the 328 is probably a waste of $. The std oil for all those years will have deposits that will contaminate the synthetic. Save the $ and use std oil in that car.

I have 4 cars with synthetic oil. I change the oil every 5K miles or less than 1 year which ever occurs first. My 360 was changed in April, and I will change it again in August or September. It has 5,500 miles on the clock, and with the high revs and high heat, it needs clean oil regularly.

With standard oil I changed it every 3,500 miles, and never did any major engine work to any of the cars I have owned. My last BMW had 264,000 miles on the clock when sold, and did not leak or use oil.

Regardless of what oil people promote, frequent oil changes are the least costly way of extending engine life and service.

Do save your $ on the synthetic in the 328 as you will not reap any great benefits for doing so.

 

IMHO, no. You should change your oil at least twice a year regardless of the mileage or what type of oil you use. I use Castrol 10w60 synthetic and that's what I do with my BB512i that I drive about 3k miles a year.

 

FYI, a 328 came with synthetic oil from the factory and it is recommended in the OM...Agip SINT 10w50 I believe....and I trust Ferrari knows a little more about the engines it designs and builds than you or me...

 

Yeah thats good advice.

The oil in your engine does a few jobs that you might not be aware of. All oils not only contain lubricating properties for your engine to run smoothly protecting it againt wear, corrosion and foaming, it also contain detergents which also keeps your motor internals clean but while this is added from the OEM after a while your oil Viscosity Index drops and you also lose the dispersion properties of the oil which help transfer friction heat thus darkening of the colour.

For a few dollars for some new oil and a new oil filter its not a big ask to replace it keeping in mind that if a bearing picks up in the journal of your engine compare a engine rebuild for a few litres of oil.....I know which i'd rather be replacing

 

Perhaps I'm not quite cut out for Ferrari ownership after all.
Oil sitting in your sump isn't oxidizing at a rate anyone can measure. It's not being temperature cycled, never gets hot, doesn't get cold enough to form waxes. It's your money, throw it away if it makes you feel better.

 

"FYI, a 328 came with synthetic oil from the factory and it is recommended in the OM...Agip SINT 10w50 I believe....and I trust Ferrari knows a little more about the engines it designs and builds than you or me..."

My assumption was that at that period of time the oil was standard quality.

Is synthetic only recommended or was it actually used in that model?

 

Not much to say about oil, I think 3 years is a long time not change oil.
Also, DON I think your name indicates a lot Mr. Jablowme.

 

Agip SINT 2000 is actually a synthetic BLEND. I use it at my shop in customer's F-cars as well as in my own. It's not easy to come by, have to get it specially brought in but if that's what Enzo's engineers recommend, that's what I use.

Cheers,
Aaron
'82 GTSi

 

Synthetic oil should be changed the same as mineral based oil, yearly. Oil needs to be changed for several reasons:

1-With use oil thickens from oxidation. This is a main reason oil is changed and is related to miles used and oil temperature during use. On the race track for example oil will hit higher temperatures and start to oxidatively thicken sooner. Synthetic oils can withstand more heat for longer before thickening.
2-The other main reason oil must be changed is that it runs out of acid neutralizing ability. This depends only on additives not base oil make up.
3-Oil gets diluted with gasoline especially if the oil is not run at full operating temperatures for long periods of time. It takes 20 to 30 minutes for oil to come up to temperature whereas the coolant may heat up in as little as 2 - 3 minutes.
4-With the normal cycle of heating and cooling each day, water condenses in the engine. Oil can handle a certain amount of this if it washes the inside of the engine from time to time. Corrosion from acids and water takes its toll and is one reason why “garage queen automobiles” are trouble.
5-During winter weather waxes form in oils permanently thickening the lubricant.

In stop and go city traffic oil never heats up enough to boil off water or fuel limiting oil longevity. Trucking firms run vehicles under appropriate loads for long distances hence the oil stays at the right operating temperature and therefore lasts longer. Frequently the oil filter is changed a time or two before the oil need to be replaced.

Oil is cheep insurance, change it every spring. I believe semi-synthetic oils are the best bang for the buck.

Some good reading can be found here:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000427

aehaas

 

Dr Haas,

How hot does the oil need to be to cook off the water & gasoline?? I am installing a 180 degree F thermostat from Mocal. Is this the way to go or should I install a 210 degree F unit?? Those are my choices from Mocal. I recall you mentioning that the 355 or 360 had a 180 degree thermostat - but they are fuel injected cars. From the smell of it, the old carbed cars have a lot of unburned fuel leaving the pipe, (and probably diluting the oil).

I am coastal, so humidity is high.

I have a carbed 308, hence a lot of gas in the oil when cold.

Most of the driving is for trips, so the oil gets to a good operating temp for a long time, but i still do a few, 15-30% of mileage as short trips, probably seriously fouling the oil.

So, do you think 180 is the way to go or do I need to get it up a bit higher, (210 degree F ), to get the job done.

For what it is worth, i will also be installing a 440
CFM thermostatically controled fan on the "out" side of the cooler. If i recall correctly, the Mocal controll unit has a 180-210 degree, variable fan controll unit.

My use of the 308 is primarily trips with the wife, but also a few pedal to the metal track days are planned.

thanks,
chris

 

I went from 3 percent fuel to 1 percent driving The 575 for 3 hours at 75 - 80 MPH.

A 180 thermostat is fine.

aehaas

 

change your oil after every drive..........even if on a daily basis

 

Why wait that long ... change it DURING every drive...

 

You too, I run around with a IV drip on my Ferrari when I go out for a lap

Doesn't everybody?

 

that performing too many oil/filter changes is a bad thing? My oil filter is upside-down, meaning it takes a few seconds to make pressure starting from 'dry' (pretty much instant otherwise). So by changing the oil/filter 3 times a year the engine effectively runs without oil for 20 seconds PA...

And another thing, why are we so bothered about oil leaks? When I was a kid I managed to perform the 'holy grail' of continuous oil changes by having to top up every journey. The underside of that 74' Escort also remained rust free. Shame about the rest of it..and my parent's driveway.

 

After starting your engine in 70 F temperatures the oil takes around 2 minutes to lube the upper end. Also, oil on the parts already can lube the whole engine for much longer without any flow or pressure. That initial 15 seconds under no load is no worry.

What kills engines the most is revving it up before full operating temperature is reached. Large chunks of bearing material are removed if cavitation occurs from thick oil during the start up period.

This is why some engines with few miles can be ruined. The worst thing you can do is start it up and immediately rev it up to show off the car to somebody. Engines have been killed in as little as 1,000 miles by this method.

aehaas

 

It has nothing to do with a Ferrari...you should do it with anything that has an engine... I change the oil in all my cars, motorcycle even my golf cart at least twice a year regardless of miles...

 

And yet, I have the oil analysis results for the Mobil 1 in my Mercedes at 26,000 miles and shy of 3 years that shows it's holding up just fine...
In the interest of resale value, though, I do change the oil on my 308 every year, need it or not!

But for once I thought AEHass and I could agree on something. Note that I offered input on the same issues he did, although with differing results.
AEHass, how much is the oil oxidizing sitting in the sump parked (<1000 miles per year)? Likewise, at <1000 miles/year, the oil won't be accumulating much acid as there isn't much combustion going on. Nor will it be diluted much. Finally, I made an assumption that this 328 would be stored indoors (climate controlled or not) so there shouldn't be much condensation from temperature swings, much less exposure to wax-forming temperatures. Yes, no? I know you type these same thoughts a lot online, perhaps you just skimmed the original post and didn't pick up on some of the details of this specific application (I wouldn't doubt you have a 'bot' that goes online and finds posts to reply to!)


As for ckracing, what's your malfunction? "I don't have much to say and won't back up my opinion with reasoning, but I'll try to slam someone that offers a considered opinion anyways."

 

Dude! Three years without an oil change? I dont do that to my lawn mower. You could not legally fly any airplane in the USA without at "least" one change annually. And by any book, you would have to change it at 100 hours minimum, and most do it at 25. May not sound like much but thats a long time for an airplane.

Damn, my old 83 Mercedes that has not really been driven much in over two years still gets an annual oil change. Thats 10 quarts of oil I never really used, but I still change it. I may not agree with some people's thinking on oil viscosity or oil type, but I think most agree you need at least an annual or bi-annual oil change no matter the mileage.

Of all the things we want oil to do, not the least of which is to keep all the expensive bits inside from ever touching each other and costing us $$$$$, one of its other jobs that is probably almost as important is corrosion resistance, or "rust" protection. Once that motor is stilled, the oil runs off leaving a very thin film. The film protects the metal parts from moisture. After about 30 days, the strength of the film may have weakened below a safe point and the engine should be turned over or started until oil pressure registers. Lacking that, everything should be done to limit its exposure to moisture if it is not going to be run. But the oil itself, just lying in the sump will break down over time and lose many of its important properties. Gasoline goes sour after a few months. Fuel oil after about a year or so, and engine oil breaks down too. And an engine is like a big sponge that seems to pull water right of the air and muck up the whole inside of your engine. Change the darned oil dude!

 

1) The oil in the bottle is sealed from the air whereas in the engine or oil tank it is not. 2) Even if you only drive the car a few miles a year that is still enough to contaminate the oil by some amount and if you do not change the oil those contaminates have more time to damage the engine. If you are too cheap to change your oil and filter at least once a year, consider selling and using public transportation.

 

Motor oil and brake fluid for example are fairly hydrophilic, they attract water. If your car is sitting in a 40 percent controlled humidity, constant 70 F garage then the oil will be OK for a few years for sure. Waxing should not be an issue. There should be no oxidative or acid based problems, and rust will be minimal. There will be fuel dilution though if you start the car up and just run it for a few minutes each month without a full engine warm-up. This can have some negative effects.

Humidity is an independent factor for engine wear. SAE engine wear tests now specify exact temperatures AND humidity for the tests.

In practice most garages are not that well controlled hence the myriad of problems with “garage queen” cars. One really needs to heat up the engine / oil from time to time and change the oil yearly for the BEST care of the car.

Note that Ferrari also recommends a filter change every year. I wonder if filter elements become gummy over time or degrade in some other way.

aehaas

 

YAY!
I knew we'd agree on something eventually!

Because I agree on not letting filters sit in oil for a rediculously long time. Mostly because I'm not that I'm sure about those issues one way or the other.

I'm not sure I agree that motor oil is hygroscopic, though...? Of course DOT3/4 brake fluid is, but it's a mineral oil, I thought that was quite different than petroleum oil. I know that when it rains on my oil spills they don't seem to mix too well... I believe there's a difference here that brake fluid will absorb (or is it adsorb?) water in that they're miscible, whereas motor oil needs agitation to entrain water.