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Hello Harley

Discussion in 'Motorcycles & Boats' started by boxerman, Oct 22, 2018.

  1. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Agreed, its what we call MBA tards. Managed to sink Boeing too..

    Harley would be so easy to fix its not even funny.,
     
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  3. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Many, many years ago, I said I’d buy a Sportster, if they made one that didn’t vibrate. Well, I didn’t. I shoulda brought an XR but didn’t. Maybe I should.


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  4. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    The vibration is largely engineered in. The way rods were balanced in the 40s misunderstood the needs of balancing fork and blade rods. Harley knows it is wrong and only continues to do it on street motors because it is expected.
     
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  5. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    the vibes and sound are a brand USP. I thought it was for ease of manufacturing and price way back when that it came out that way and now its just their thing poor as the architecture is. Decades ago yamaha built a properly balanced Vtwin, it didnt sell.

    Someone once described a Ducati vtwin as having a cadence that reminded one of the mothers heart while in the womb. Trumph enginered a crank throw into its retro paralel twins to have a cadence. Bent V8s have a sound and cadence flat plane ones do not.

    Evocative Motors are weird things not always logical.

    Probably they would do well to make some other liquid cooled Vtwins with better angles cranks etc, the new range seems to have these?

    My sortster 48 is like a Morgan, a modern antique that starts with the push of a button and
    works. The air/oil cooled harleys just need to be taken in context.
    Harley needs other product to expand their bandwidth.But even in the air/oil cooled segment they could have built a great tracker and cafe racer. The management is just useless when it comes to product vision, so even with modern liquid cooled vtwins to tap other segments theyl probably flub it.
     
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  6. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    The stock holders need to clean house. Expecting the same board to exercise better judgement in selection of a new HMFIC than last time is just stupid. Yet another great and storied American company has been placed in the hands of morons. GM has a great deal of inertia and assets. That all that is keeping them around. Harley has no such luxury. Is there any family left to buy it back?
     
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  8. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    the problem with many boards is they are like clubs, all vetted professionals for consensus. Shareholders, any shareholder of scale is an institution run by the same type of person. Can ypu just see them all, wenened to expand our market share to other segments, so they by buell, we need to expand our customer segment so they buy MV and invest in it. But because they dont actualy have passion or understnd bikes outside of MBA analysis and the set harley formula they dont know what they have or what to do with it, so they mess about and bail

    Then we have Indian, a come from nowhere brand that is really doing the job in harleys backyard, so i guess some corps are not run by nitwits.

    GM Harley, Boeing, all managed by MBA and all management failure.
     
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  9. NORTY

    NORTY Formula Junior

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    I've had 3 HD's over a 30 year span. So far, only the current Dyna LowRider has the fewest miles of any HD I've had. It doesn't seem to be "catching up" either. It sits more now than it ever has. (I rode the Husqvarna today.) I would have ridden the HD today, but it needs work again, and I'm just getting fed up with it. Looking at Rumbleon more and more, everyday.
    CHP just dropped HD as a supplier. They're going back to BMW's...
     
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  10. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    The carnage continues. Wow thats a really ugly tracker. Maybe if the aftermarket does a great exhaust, but whats all that ovoid crap on the front. Tis what happens when your best designer goes to Indian and does the FTR.
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  11. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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  13. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #60 Rifledriver, Apr 1, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
    Those are both terrible. I was not a huge fan of Willie G's creations but at least he had some talent.

    Those look to me to be the creation of a committee.
     
  14. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    CHP went to Harley then to BMW based on cost only. No company makes a bike that meets their specification nor will any build a custom bike for any department. In the case of the Harley, Oakland Harley made a winning bid on custom made motorcycles. In the case of the BMW Long Beach BMW made a winning bid. Thats all there was to it.
     
  15. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    lol you know the joke about a camel being a horse designed by a Comittee.
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Or mule. Exactly.
     
  17. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Now here is a picture of a Harley tracker. Whats so hard? They already designed it.

    Headlight, tail light, turn signals, 3 disc brakes and a starter....Done.

    It needs a little bigger fuel tank.


    Talk about a hooligan bike. The guys who made street bikes out of these invented the term.
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  18. Island Time

    Island Time F1 Veteran
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    I like their clothing line. Well made.
    (The only trouble with it is, it all says HD on it)
     
  19. Wade

    Wade Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Here's another, but with a larger tank. I'd do without the heat shield.

    https://silodrome.com/harley-davidson-xr-750/

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  20. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ
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  21. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    lord save us from the ‘rewire”plan that is going to form the backbone of the “hardwire 5 year plan” to please “stakeholders”
    MBA’s great at plans
    how about some frickin great motorcycles,
    morons.
     
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  22. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Agreed! It's mind boggling to me - I understand that you fall back on what you know, but if that's not working you MUST shift to other tactics.

    Very frustrating.
     
  23. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    I was thinking about this whole quandry this am.
    The old GM had a balance of pwer between styling(product design) Engineering and accounting. That was the Harley Earl Bill Mitchell era. They made great evocative and desirable cars. After styling lost its power GM made inferior appliance cars and the result is plain to see.

    The old Gm had great styling, good engineering, and then beancounters who did great costing and MBA's who ran things effciently. Each dicipline had its place and the forces were balanced, but they nevcer lost sight of product. Alfred P slaon was a beancounter, but also smart enough to understand the primacy of styling and engineering.

    Harley is well run from a operational perspective, MBAS are great at that. What it lacks is vision, I dont mean comitte/consultant created vision, but real vision, the one that sells dreams. The one vision they have is the classic vision, but that they cant even see how to evolve.

    Storz did a great line of street trackers from sportsters, cafe racers are in, those could have been of existing hardware and appealed to youth. Buell could have gone after sportbikes,and they had MV to do nakeds and hard core sportbikes.

    The Bronx will fail its stylisticaly blah and speaks to what.

    Like Triumph Harley could have grown out of the classic line into sportsbikes tourers and Pars Dakar style bikes. Triumph really got it right off essential 2 platforms, a classic and a modern, Triumph is led by one man of vsion, John Bloor.. But to get somewhere harley needed to actualy understand motorcycle/passion and it does not. So a comitee decides they need to go after different niche, they make the technicaly ok but otherwise uninteresting 750, and then decide theyre going after nakeds with the Bronx? Clueless. MBAs and comitees do not make appealing machines, if they understood emotional appeal they wouldnt be MBAs. You cant comitte Art.

    All the pieces are there though to build great bikes, so sad.
     
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  24. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Other tactics thatw ork requre vsion. Harley is lookign for otehr tactics, they did Buel, they did MV and theyre doing whatever hdge podge theyre doign now, but this cannot be vreated by comitee it needs peopel of vision
     
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  25. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Yes of course - that's been gone since the Wandell days.
     
  26. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    Harley could really be something and something 2x its current size.
    How do we take over so as to execute the vision?
    Could be big.
     
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  27. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I need money for that!! :)
     
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  28. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    me too
    Or a group Of is red to take over l
     
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