FORMULA 1 ROLEX GROSSER PREIS VON ÖSTERREICH 2020: RACE ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS ▀▄▀▄ | Page 14 | FerrariChat

FORMULA 1 ROLEX GROSSER PREIS VON ÖSTERREICH 2020: RACE ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS ▀▄▀▄

Discussion in 'F1' started by jgonzalesm6, Jul 5, 2020.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    @ingegnere
    @Bas Jaski

    How development freeze will save F1 teams money

    In an attempt to address costs Formula 1 teams have agreed to a system of freezing some components both within the 2020 season and heading into 2021, and the full details of how it will work have now emerged in the updated technical regulations for both of those seasons.

    Within a system of what are now called "homologated components" there is still some scope for development via a token system. In other words, teams can decide which elements they wish to upgrade, but they can only do it with the full knowledge and agreement of the FIA.


    Much of the car remains completely free, including most aerodynamic elements, so teams can still develop in those areas.


    As with the new technical rules, now postponed to 2022, the general idea is to keep open the visually-attractive components.

    The rules for 2020

    Within 2020, there are two possible freeze dates. The first, known as R1-2020, goes from the earliest date between the date of FP1 of the first race of the 2020 championship, or 1 September.

    The second freeze deadline, known as Mid-2020, is the earliest date between the date of first practice of the eighth round of the 2020 season, or 15 October.


    In essence, key components such as the chassis and gearbox that rarely change anyway are frozen at R1-2020, while some aero, inboard suspension and other parts that are usually more subject to development have more flexibility, face a later freeze.

    The list of reasons why certain changes can be made after the freeze dates include minimal changes for safety, reliability or cost reasons, changes for driver comfort, or for the installation of a new driver and those "due to regulation changes, legality fixes or the installation of FIA-mandated components".

    However, any change must have no performance or weight improvement and will require FIA approval.

    The token system

    Teams are allowed to deploy two tokens to modify components after the freeze dates. However, they have to take three steps, within deadlines known as D1, D2 and D3.


    D1, D2 and D3 are different in the cases of R1-2020 and Mid-2020 frozen components – for example D1 for the former is five days after the shutdown (which is within the next week), and for the latter it's "the Wednesday following the third competition of 2020, but no later than 1 October 2020".

    The FIA makes it clear that teams should be sure they really want to deploy their tokens, as there are no second chances if they change their minds on a development route.

    Teams are allowed to revert to the original spec, but those tokens cannot be re-used.

    It's also made clear that if the upgraded component is supplied to a customer team that team will also have deploy its own tokens in order to use it.

    What happens for 2021?


    The homologated component system introduced for 2020 will carry over into next season, with some additions.

    Along with the existing R1-2020 and Mid-2020 freeze dates, there will be a third freeze deadline, known as R1-2021, which is simply the first practice session of the first race of 2021.

    Various items are added to the original 2020 HC list under this new R1-2021 freeze, including gear ratios, driveshafts, outboard front and rear suspension, steering and some parts of the cooling system.

    All the 2020 provisions for making non-performance changes still apply. The two tokens are also still available to be used, but only if the team hasn't already deployed them in 2020.

    Crucially, a team has to set in motion any such 2021 changes well before the end of the 2020 season, by notifying the FIA via the aforementioned D1, D2, D3 deadline system.


    They can only be deployed on parts that were frozen at R1-2020 or Mid-2020. Anything frozen at R1-2021 cannot be changed via the token system and are thus set for the whole year.

    There's special clause for any customers who are currently buying and using 2019 spec components from a partner team – if they want to upgrade to the 2020 equivalents for 2021, they can make that change without use of tokens.

    There is also a provision for McLaren, the only team switching engine supplier as it goes from Renault to Mercedes in 2021 – in order to get a free installation change, the Woking team will have to forego its two tokens.

    The same applies if anyone modifies their engine spec so much for 2021 that it requires a new installation.

    In essence rivals want to be confident that McLaren can't gain an advantage by being the only team allowed to do a new PU installation for 2021.


    https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/how-development-freeze-will-save-f1-teams-money/4797766/
     
    Isobel, ingegnere, DF1 and 1 other person like this.
  2. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    41,299
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    We can only look at the facts...Ferrari runs best when the higher chiefs are non-italian. It seems the Italians just need a less emotional head at the top of the food chain. Aldo costa himself said as much in his beyond the grid interview...the moment Brawn/Todt/Schumacher/Byrne left, the team quickly broke down into disarray. Ferrari is a team of blame culture, also in part fueled by the media. They need non-italians at the top to talk sense and order in.

    As for the last part, stereo types exist for a reason, that's why they're stereotypes...they're not always true, but tend to be! ;)

    Of course i don't hold it against Ferrari to try and get the best driver at all times, but they place too much value on it almost. Whilst yesterday was a highlight, with some superb driving from Leclerc, we can't ignore that Ferrari was also a bit lucky. But the team looks dejected right now...moral must be at the lowest it's been in many years.
     
    ferrariformulauno, Isobel and DF1 like this.
  3. moretti

    moretti Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 1, 2003
    58,225
    Australia
    Full Name:
    John
    Spot on mate, he caused trouble wherever he went
     
    ingegnere and Bas like this.
  4. moretti

    moretti Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 1, 2003
    58,225
    Australia
    Full Name:
    John
    Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me
     
    Bas likes this.
  5. Isobel

    Isobel F1 World Champ

    Jun 30, 2007
    10,533
    On a Wave's Chicane
    Full Name:
    Is, Izzy for Australians
    Watched the lousy first half then had to run and missed the joy y’all experienced.
    Dog emergency, Monsieur Korr.
    Those freeloaders always manage to come first even if they ignore team orders ;).
    Love a high DNF count and I miss this one......
     
  6. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    Thanks for that Joe! So engine pretty much not affected (less major installation change) but if Ferrari were really planning a wholesale change on the car’s aero, there may be limitations.

    Too bad they chose this year to make what seems to be their worst car in the last few years.
     
    jgonzalesm6 likes this.
  7. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    For sure the Todt era was the high water mark for the team though right at the top of the organization was Luca don’t forget. And Luca himself as team principle was not too shabby in the 70s.

    The problem with the narrative of Ferrari being too Italian is that they’re always beaten by a British or British-run team—but it’s not always the same team! Just as Mercedes are whipping Ferrari’s butt in this turbo/hybrid era they’re also whipping every other British team, Swiss team and Japanese and French engine supplier. What’s their excuse?
     
    DeSoto and Bas like this.
  8. Agent Smith

    Agent Smith Formula 3

    Apr 20, 2002
    1,569
    Then why won’t anybody hire him?
     
  9. freshmeat

    freshmeat F1 Veteran

    Aug 30, 2011
    7,257
    McLaren hired him twice. Ferrari hired him. Renault hired him. Toyota hired him for Le Mans. Only top works team that hasn’t is Mercedes. Seems like a nice resume, definitely better and more diverse than most...
     
  10. subirg

    subirg F1 Rookie

    Dec 19, 2003
    4,186
    Cheshire
    What a random race that was! After a boring first stint watching Merc run and hide, and the sheer disaster that is Ferrari, all hell broke lose and the race became an epic!

    Lets be clear - the Merc is on a different planet. Game over for wcc.

    Poor redbull. Albon should have won that race but inexperience put him in a risky over take he didn’t have to do. Fair penalty for Ham even though there wasn’t much he could have done about it at the time.

    Stand out performer has to be Norris. Amazing finish to grab the podium. Well done lad.

    Even Williams is much improved and could have had points if Russel’s car had been reliable. But Latifi looks a bit rubbish - don’t expect much from him.

    Overall though, it’s clear that without safety cars the mercs would have been miles ahead at the finish. Their pace was so much faster that on a clear race they could have lapped the entire field. Such a shame to see ferrari so far off the pace with no hope of closing the gap. Another year lost (and a repeat coming up in 2021)...
     
    DF1, jgonzalesm6, Bas and 1 other person like this.
  11. Patrick Dixon

    Patrick Dixon Formula 3

    Mar 27, 2012
    1,083
    UK
    You don't make much sense - if he couldn't have done anything about it, how could it be a fair penalty?

    Mercedes missed a trick: after the penalty they should have had HAM run 4.5 secs ahead of Bottas to the finish.
     
    Terra likes this.
  12. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    @jgonzalesm6

    I guess I read it wrong but Binotto conforming engine is frozen. Pretty discouraging:

    "Of the second, three-tenths in cornering, in what I was just speaking about. But then there is still seven-tenths on the power unit on the straights.

    "I think that one will be very much difficult, because the engine is frozen for the season.


    https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/150374/ferrari-losing-07s-per-lap-in-power-unit-performance
     
    jgonzalesm6 likes this.
  13. itschris

    itschris Formula 3

    Sep 15, 2011
    1,465
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Chris
    It's sad that it takes two penalties to keep a Merc of the podium. I honestly keep my own spreadsheet now where I recalculate all the points based on the pretend circumstance that Mercedes doesn't run. With the freeze this year.. the FIA all but assured their continued dominance and Hamilton's 7th Championship. They did the same again for next all but guaranteeing another Constructors and WDC. For me, to even make F1 enjoyable anymore, I have to pretend Merc doesn't race. Then it becomes interesting. The way things are, the delay of the new cars... all it did was guarantee Mercedes and Lewis two more years of Championships. I mean, good for them... they clearly are the best... but it doesn't make much for quality racing.

    But how exciting was it to see Norrris, Albon, Perez, and others in the mix. Imagine what it would be like if races could actually be that way from P1 back.
     
    paulchua likes this.
  14. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Oct 3, 2002
    48,581
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    Great race, lots of actions. Surprised about the reliability issues and given that they have to race again so soon, hopefully we'll see more of that. Loved all the penalties, kept things interesting.

    Bravo to Leclerc and McLaren. Bummer for Max.
     
    william and DF1 like this.
  15. Giallo 550

    Giallo 550 Formula 3

    May 25, 2019
    1,836
    NY
    Full Name:
    Jim
    Just stop with the straw men and whataboutism, and actually try to disprove my original point.

    Alonso is nearly 39 and the average age of the grid is 27. Teams are looking to get younger, not older.
     
  16. Flavio_C

    Flavio_C Formula 3
    BANNED

    Sep 7, 2012
    2,445
    Insubria
    Out of curiosity: are you the moderator who blocked me on the Hamilton thread?
     
  17. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447

    When I tried to post on the Hamilton thread this morning, all I got was:

    "You have insufficient privileges to reply here"

    Yet I posted on that thread yesterday afternoon, and I can't see what rules my posts #228 and #230 contravened.

    Could you, please, explain?
     
    Flavio_C likes this.
  18. Agent Smith

    Agent Smith Formula 3

    Apr 20, 2002
    1,569
    What is there to disprove? I didn’t say he couldn’t drive. I said he never brought Ferrari a championship, he’s a toxic presence within whatever team he’s with, and even though he was making noise about wanting to return to F1 nobody wants him despite his driving talent.
     
    jgonzalesm6 and william like this.
  19. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447
    Hear ! hear !!!
     
    jgonzalesm6 likes this.
  20. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Brundle had this about Vettel is his post race report on SKY F1. I wonder if he leaves 1 race early like Yas Marina and Sainz drives that one - https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/12022388/martin-brundles-f1-verdict-new-season-old-school-racing-action

    Seb Vettel had a miserable weekend, qualifying his Ferrari only 11th, and via a clumsy spin up against Sainz's McLaren he finished only 10th after fighting oversteer the whole race, seemingly convinced his car had changed since Friday.

    It's probably just as well it's going to be a short farewell season time-wise between Ferrari and Vettel because that has all the hallmarks of an uncomfortable and even acrimonious parting of ways.
     
    tifosi12 and william like this.
  21. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447

    The atmosphere must be quite tense at Ferrari at the moment.
    Being dropped for next year even before this season had started is a terrible humiliation for Vettel.
    Having to work with Binotto and the rest of the team knowing they support Leclerc now must be hard to swallow.
    I don't see why they didn't part immediatly once the decision was made.
     
    paulchua and tifosi12 like this.
  22. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    He is on the other end of the team working closer with him over Mark at RedBull but also he had to see Ricci being well received as well at Red Bull. This might be a shock but he has seen it in other teams. His humiliation is his lack of change to his style in my opinion. He is consistently making major error and not well timed. No sense he was willing to change his approach to racing.
     
  23. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    Norris' First Podium, Leclerc's Celebrations And The Best Team Radio | 2020 Austrian Grand Prix

     
  24. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 1, 2013
    15,978
    Menlo Park, CA
    Full Name:
    Paul Chua
    I assume Yin for P&R posts. Okay to criticize any driver for their performance on track (as I have been doing) - comments about their sexuality, P&R, race, etc - no go outside the P&R forum.

    Hi William, your posts seem live? 228 and 230?
    If it's 231, I don't see anything wrong, but was removed probably because of the P&R post you were replying too.
     
  25. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 1, 2013
    15,978
    Menlo Park, CA
    Full Name:
    Paul Chua
    30 million reasons why.
    :)
     

Share This Page