Flavio Briatore in Hospital with Covid-19, condition "serious"

You are so disillusioned!

 

Sincères condoléances ( deepest condolences)

 

I think your timing is a bit off.... Flav did not come in to F-1 until 1990- when Alessandro Benetton got rid of Alex Hawkridge and Ted Toleman .... running the team... Briatore came in as the eyes of Luciano Benetton over Alessandro... and he finally got rid of Alessandro as well in 91-92. Briatore did indeed get the team winning - but he really listend to Brawn and Byrne - and concentrated on the political aspect of F-1 becoming more friendly with Bernie and Max.... and chasing more sponsorship - trying to reduce the cost to the Benetton family. ( eventually pocketing a huge amount him self in the sale to Renault.

As for Briatore not many know about his pre F-1 activity.... he was a convicted Felon in Italy - who's sentence was eventually commuted. He was living in North America ( Bahamas i think? ) when he set up the first Benetton stores. He did well, and Luciano asked him to manage North America operation... so he started to open stores all over the place... so much so that each store was competing against each other... but he took a commission on very opening - which made him rich... I think in 83-85 there were over 800 Benetton stores in the USA... but 2 years later only 200 - all the rest went belly up... but Briatore got commissions from all the stores and inventory.... He's always been on the "edge" .. and usually not in a good way.... he's someone I would regard with extra caution.... even Benetton family severed ties with him....

 

If you can call a con man brilliant - then Flav fits that description.

 

None of that contradicts what I have just said.

 

Copy and paste from Wikipedia:

"He [Briatore] was convicted of multiple counts of fraud in the 1980s, receiving two prison sentences. In 1984, a court in Bergamo found Briatore guilty of various counts of fraud and he was fined and sentenced to 1 year and 6 months in prison. The sentence was subsequently reduced to 1 year by a court of appeal in 1988. In 1986, in Milan, Briatore was sentenced to 3 years for fraud and conspiracy for his role in a team of confidence tricksters who, over a number of years, set up rigged gambling games using fake playing cards. The judges described these as elaborate confidence tricks, in which victims were invited to dinner and then "ensnared" in rigged games that involved a cast of fictional characters and realised enormous profits for their perpetrators. After an appeal in 1987, the sentence was reduced to 1 year and 2 months. To avoid imprisonment, Briatore lived as a fugitive in Saint Thomas, Virgin Islands. He never went to prison and returned to the EU after both convictions were extinguished by amnesty. In 2010, a Turin court ordered Briatore rehabilitated, which by Italian Criminal Code results in the extinction "of any criminal effect of the conviction"

During Briatore's fugitive status, he maintained close relations with Benetton and opened some Benetton stores in the Virgin Islands. When Benetton opened his first five stores in the United States in 1979, he appointed Briatore as director of the group's American operations. Thanks to Benetton's methods of franchising, the chain experienced a brief boom in popularity in the US, where, by 1989, there were 800 Benetton stores. Briatore, having taken a cut of each franchising agreement, became very wealthy. As store owners began to complain of competition from other Benetton stores, the number of stores decreased to 200 and Briatore began to look for a new business. In 1999, the Corriere della Sera wrongfully reported that he had been arrested in Nairobi on suspicion of fraud relating to real estate in Kenya, but further to a libel claim brought by Briatore against the newspaper, this allegation proved to be untrue and Briatore was compensated."


I said I liked rogue characters, they are often quite interesting individuals.

 

Maybe Ferrari needs to get back in the shoes of an underdog and come out of a form of condescension. Reorganise as a team of mercenaries using foreign talent as Todt had done in the past.
Being more humble.

 

Indeed. They did so well in the MS era because the had the best talents available. Very different from the approach of hiring the best Italians.

Reality is that this sport is a British sport. The majority of brainpower comes from Britain, and even there from mostly one region. A non British team is already at a disadvantage (e.g. Sauber, Ferrari).

 

OMG, you are going to rub a few people the wrong way saying that !!!

 

I was just pointing out that it was Hawkridge and Toleman ( Bob and Ted ) that had the team when Benetton bought them.... they did not bring Flav along till 89 - 90

 

It's a reality. I grew up in a town right next to Hinwil (home of Sauber team) and my father knew Peter Sauber. They have the same issue, which is finding enough talented workers. Of course neither the Swiss nor the Italians lack brilliant people but the pool of available talent is so much smaller than in Britain where workers can move between teams.

We have a similar thing going on with NASCAR in the US. A lot of those teams come all from the same area. Just as around Indianapolis a lot of little racing shops/manufacturers are located.

 

Very true. I believe that Briatore was brought in initially to sort out the financial mess the team was in.
Although technically illiterate, he proved to be a good motivator and was made principal.
I think he rewarded well his employer, in view of his complete lack of experience in motor racing.
It was said at the time that the 2 Schumacher titles were obtained with a budget less than half those of McLaren or Williams.
Briatore also recruited the technical team that followed Schumacher and brought so much success to Ferrari years later.

 

I think Bryne was there during the Toleman years - and maybe Brawn as well... Cant remember. Briatore was the marketing guy searching for money- as Benetton wanted to reduce the expenditures... . if you look at the cars from 1990 to 1991 you'll see a lot less Benetton vs. other sponsors.... I think in the end however when they sold up to Renault ... The family was slightly swindled from Briatore ... who also owned Ligier at the time ... but we are talking money between ultra rich folks. when I was at the races in 1990 - I used to hang around the Ligier team - I knew their hospitality folks, and Alessandro Benetton used to come by for lunch preferring Guy's chefs to Benetton's food... so I got to know him a bit... I'm still friends with his cousin Lorenzo

Flavio used to hang at Allsport 's suite... or at Agip & sometime Ferrari... for food.

 

while Formula One was created by the French - dominated early on by the Italians - its 100% British... for the past 30 -40 years. that's why Mercedes are in the UK, as well as most all other teams... i do wonder however what brexit will do to getting people back and forth?

 

Good point. I always thought that Brexit was economic suicide but it seems they're still going strong. Then again I believe the full Brexit hasn't happened yet. They drew that out so long I gave up following the story.

 

@william
@spirot
@tifosi12

I had this debate with someone else regarding the talent pool in Britain compared to the talent pool in Italy and the response I got was:

"Ferrari tried it once *(Barnard-->GTO) and it did'nt work!!"

"Ferrari F1 isn't all Italian!"

 

I remember the Barnard GTO project. Yes, that worked about as well as Toyota out of Germany.

Ferrari F1 isn't all Italian, true. But I would bet the majority of the folks employed are. I know they aren't all Italian. In fact I have a friend who used to be one of their aero designers. He is American. No longer works for Ferrari but for another racing team outside of F1.

Fact is that during the successful MS years the key positions were not held by Italians. Except Montezuma of course.

 

I didn't know there was a lack of engineering talent in Switzerland.

I follow Brexit day by day, my family being on both side (UK and EU).
Brexit is done in fact, we are living through the transition period where both sides are supposed to negotiate a "deal" about future co-habitation.
At the moment it's heading to a NO DEAL, the deadline being December 31.

I think we will find the details from next year.

 

Well THAT kind of engineering. THAT meaning F1 technology. They got plenty of highly educated engineers in that country, but since there is no racing industry whatsoever to speak of (remember racing is still banned in the country) the talent pool of people from the trade is super small.

Ok, that's kinda what I thought. We're in a limbo in between phase, so the big hammer hasn't fallen yet. And apparently still no deal in sight. Not much has changed since two years ago I'd say. Except that they keep moving the deadline.

 

Well, the deadline for the end of the transition period has been decided by the British side.
To keep things moving, the government here has obtained from our Parliament a law that it must end at 12 o'clock at night on the 31st of December 2020.
So from 2021 there should a new era in Europe.

 

More movie material

 

Thanks. I refrain from commenting as it would belong to the P&R section.

 

Oh please, somebody make that movie/documentary already. Would be highly entertaining to say the least. Flav is a scumbag but at least interesting. As that old joke goes: Where do you want to end up after you are dead? Heaven or hell? For sure the more interesting people are found in hell.

 

I admire Flavio for all the young well built girls he got to rub themselves all over him. If he survives, they should put him in charge of F1. The motto of the sport should drink, have sex, and go racing.

 

Actually the Barnard GTO did work... a la the 1989 - 1990 Ferrari that was developed there. But the main problem was that Barnard did not get on with Piero and Piero's faction... and when the Mr. Ferrari found out he banished Piero over to the road cars side ( effectively taking him out of any form of control or influence ) ... then Mr. Ferrari died. .. so there was huge confusion and Angelli was not completly involved yet ( that's how Montezemolo got re involved again... )

Montezemolo got himself so involved in Italian politics that he felt he had to make Ferrari "tutto Italiano".... which was a Major mistake ... he turned against Brawn, Todt, and Byrne ... and now you can see the mess that created.... the reality is no team can function as a 100% block - you have to get the best talent you can... and support them. The problem with Ferrari is its so famous, and so highly regarded in Italy people make emotional decisions about it at the highest levels. When Mr. Ferrari did not care what the press said - the team did well... when he got all caught up in the press politics... it went to crap.

Clearly Ferrari are completely leaderless... Camileri does not have enough personna to drive Ferrari... there is CLEARLY no single person in charge... Ferrari does well when they have a dictator ... Enzo, Montezemolo, or Marchionne.... its not a committee sport... we see that everywhere - McLaren, Williams etc... when business and committees get involved... the teams don't win.

Personally I would like to see Piero take over... but that is never going to happen:
1. He's now too rich to care
2. He's not assertive enough
3. He's stuck in the older ways - pay too close attention to press etc...
4. Elkan will not allow it.