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Ferrari's at Scotsdale '17

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by Timmmmmmmmmmy, Jan 14, 2017.

  1. msn

    msn Formula Junior

    Jan 22, 2011
    250
    Hi Joe firstly Best regards to you and your family for the New Year. Yes a world record I believe for an F50, it seems the Holy Grail of Ferrari Super cars are adjusting in terms of importance and significance, this can be seen already with the F50 ( Grade A cars of course ) costing more than and Enzo, It will not be long before these cars are more expensive than the LA Ferrari.. and this will continue. These auctions can be summed up as: If it is unique, significantly important, the best of its type, very hard to replace then these cars are in demand, everything else is soft and deservedly so.
    Nothing has changed in the 25 years I have been collecting.
    Collectors want the best available and are not interested in the rest unless its price reflects.
     
  2. ASK328

    ASK328 Formula 3
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    Thanks for the list.

    Those results must be sending a shock wave through the dealer's that have many of these cars listed much higher then these auction results.

    "Adjust in progress" sounds like a falling knife to me. Thanks Marcel.
     
  3. ARTNNYC

    ARTNNYC F1 Rookie
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    anyone know what Lot 156 at Gooding sold for? 2005 Porsche Carrera GT
     
  4. ByeEnzo

    ByeEnzo Formula Junior

    Nov 29, 2008
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    Your old car! I think bidding stalled at 575k as I recall. I was watching the Internet live feed. Maybe sold post block.
     
  5. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm just glad I had the opportunity to drive a 330 GTC for a while. At these prices, I'll never own another one. I'm guessing these cars will be sitting in collections and maybe driven once a year?
     
  6. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    #81 cnpapa24, Jan 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2017
    The quality of the Ferraris that I viewed at auction were very disappointing overall. The prices are reflective of that. Perhaps the push for lower reserves by the auction houses has precipitated this.

    It seemed a general clearing of lesser cars: no provenance, no service history, quick maintenance prior to auction, no "restoration" documentation, missing accessories, and less than original. Buyers today are too smart to pay up for this and will adjust their price accordingly.
     
  7. ARTNNYC

    ARTNNYC F1 Rookie
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    Yes my old car....guess the provenance was not good enough....sigh
     
  8. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
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    I generally agree. However, the gorgeous 500 Superfast at Gooding, the spectacular pino verde 275 GTB/4 at Gooding and especially the silvergrey 275 GTB alloy at Gooding were outstanding. I also loved that silvergrey 599 SA Aperta. On the other hand I was very disappointed by the quality of that black F50 at RM Sotheby's, while the silvergrey 330 GTS Spider was very good. The Hilfiger Enzo was good but the F40 less so, it has brand new seats and the inner front had been repainted but some carbon piece in the underbody is broken, right front. All Berlinetta Boxers and all Dinos (except the early red one at RM!) at all the auctions were poor. Some of the Daytonas had incorrect steering wheels, strange interiors, poor leather, wrong mirrors.
    Another thing is presentation. When will the AZ Biltmore finally replace that horrible carpet in the ballroom?
    Just my 0.2 cents, of course.

    Marcel Massini
     
  9. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    #84 cnpapa24, Jan 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2017
    I had a couple friends bidding who felt $575k plus the commission was at or above market. Perhaps Seller felt he could yield more net of fees.

    RM car did very well at $725k. Not sure what the difference was be the two mileage wise, etc.

    Correction: your CGT sold for $621,500 all in. Seems to be at market.
     
  10. kmeighannj

    kmeighannj Formula Junior
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    Yes, stalled at that price.

    I was at Gooding for a while on Saturday. Really weak bidding in general. Not really that many people there. The last few years at the auctions it has been hard to find a chair. At least yesterday afternoon, that was no issue.


    Kirk
     
  11. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    Funny you should say this. I felt the same. Gooding's stage presence and use of varying light based on the color of the vehicle is top notch.

    RM still searching for a suitable replacement for the well admired Max it seems.
     
  12. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    Agreed on the 275s - the Verde Pino car was stunning. Current pricing on Aperta makes no sense to me, but it's not what I seek for my collection.

    For the most part the Boxers were extremely weak. I took a run at the 365 BB but it needed a full restoration and was missing all accessories and some other bits that I had to factor into my price.

    On the Dinos - I thought the yellow car at Gooding although not 100% correct was a good value based on Euro spec and original Azzuro Dino color. The other two Gooding cars were very tired and are due for restoration. Even the L engine compartment tidiness and undercarriage left me thinking one would need to restore the car once they got into it.
     
  13. Zarathustra

    Zarathustra Formula Junior

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    Hey Chris,
    Do you know what happened to the Lancia Stratos, Lot 55?
     
  14. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    It sold for right around $450k. It was overall a fairly nice car and great color. Not 100% original but a good Stratos is difficult to come by, especially stateside.
     
  15. Zarathustra

    Zarathustra Formula Junior

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    Thanks for info and I completely agree.
     
  16. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie
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    330 GTS that was recently black and suffered a small fire while on a rally was restored locally here in Chicago. I believe it's the same car...
     
  17. amenasce

    amenasce Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Which one of the 365?
    Red or black 365?
     
  18. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    Black one. The red one had many things incorrect.
     
  19. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    The black one is #18001 (365 GT4 BB) and came from a man in Los Angeles. Same car did not sell at RM Monaco 2016.

    Marcel Massini
     
  20. vvassallo

    vvassallo F1 Veteran
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    yes I think that was the only injected BBI they had.
     
  21. Edward 96GTS

    Edward 96GTS F1 Rookie
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    hopefully some of the lesser quality cars are sold post block and receive a quality restoration.
     
  22. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Gooding corrected that and offered much more chairs and tables this year than in the previous years.

    Marcel Massini
     
  23. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Oh yes, absolutely.
    It makes a HUGE difference.

    Marcel Massini
     
  24. freestone

    freestone Formula Junior

    Feb 8, 2005
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    West Coast USA
    Which was the nicer 275: the green or the alloy silver?
     
  25. Prancing 12

    Prancing 12 Formula 3

    May 11, 2004
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    The long way home
    Same for same, it's very likely a black Enzo with 2,000 miles would go for a fair bit more than the F50 at RM.

    It's also worth noting that there are a dozen or so black Enzos, while according to the RM listing, this F50 is essentially the only US-spec F50 in black (the other car has 60 some thousand miles, a salvage title and IIRC, a replacement engine).
     

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