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Ferraris at KENO Bros. Auction NY 19 November 2015

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by Marcel Massini, Nov 18, 2015.

  1. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    14,096
    I remember well, a few years ago, Saturday night at an auction on U.S. west coast, some elder gentleman, clearly slighlty drunk and over-enthusiastic, he wanted to impress his gorgeous 18-year old blue eyed long-legged blonde "niece" (you know what I mean, don't you?) sitting next to him, and just didn't stop bidding on a yellow Dino 246 and finally paid more than 500 Grand. Well, guess what, the following Monday morning I got several calls from Dino owners, asking "can you help me selling my car for 500 Grand as well"?? Overnight all prices had gone up by at least 100 Grand.
    Sometimes it is ONE guy that makes the market (no matter if car was good or bad).

    Marcel Massini
     
  2. FarEastFerrari

    FarEastFerrari Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2014
    433
    Hong Kong, LA & NY
    Full Name:
    Thomas Choi
    I heard that in this auction there were real bidders for the 250GTE to 440K but the seller didn't accept the price. I think 440K would have been a great price for a non concourse winning quality 250GTE. The seller is greedy so it was a no-sale. Despite all the issues with this auction if the bids only came to low 300K, I would have to say the market has slowed down but a 440K for a 4/5 car, it's still on the high end. I cant speak for the other cars because I dont have knowledge about their condition/value.
     
  3. Timmmmmmmmmmy

    Timmmmmmmmmmy Formula 3
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    Timothy Russell
    I love that story, absolutely true to so many places, times and markets.... Don't you have a magic wand that works on cars and prices Mr. Massini?
     
  4. BIRA

    BIRA Formula Junior

    Jun 15, 2007
    889
    Well there is a strategy behind, you need to find nieces and offer some booze so long both are legal,,,I am sure he kept the Dino longer than the blonde and the car cost him less...
     
  5. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
    14,096
    I am still trying to find out her chassis number, the one of the Dino is well known to me!
    Clearly she hadn't been restored (yet) and showed zero patina at all with the body looking pretty straight.
    LOL

    Marcel Massini
     
  6. PAUL BABER

    PAUL BABER Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2006
    1,058
    London. UK.
    Full Name:
    Paul Baber
    Funny story but so very true..........I also note that after the Gooding 250 GTE made GBP 500K plus every GTE owner I know believed his car had doubled in value overnight.......
     
  7. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
    14,096
    The person who purchased the blue GTE at Gooding's in Pebble Beach 08/2015 is the FORMER owner of the red GTE offered last week in NYC.

    Marcel Massini
     
  8. LARRYH

    LARRYH F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 3, 2011
    6,564
    virginia usa
    The dream of every auctioneer ,
     
  9. Cargirl_

    Cargirl_ Rookie
    BANNED

    Jan 31, 2008
    37
    Media PA
    Full Name:
    Kelly
    Give her some time. She'll be back on the market again. But totally over restored. So shiny you'll need sunglasses.

    ok - that was totally off subject. Now I have to get back to work.
     
  10. Timmmmmmmmmmy

    Timmmmmmmmmmy Formula 3
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    At Monterey some years ago the question was asked which has more plastic, the cars or the women?
     
  11. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
    14,096
    Vetroresina is ok.

    Marcel Massini
     
  12. tx246

    tx246 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,556
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Shawn
    I think this should be the F-chat quote of the month!!
     
  13. BBBBBBB

    BBBBBBB Formula Junior

    Jun 6, 2015
    345
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    Ben
    Imho it was not that bad for the first auction of a brandnew auction house.

    It always takes time to build up a new company...

    Usually many potential customers will only have trust into that new company after a couple of (auctions or) years.

    Ben
     
  14. Entropy

    Entropy Formula 3
    Owner

    Jul 10, 2008
    2,151
    a few thoughts - as an observer who is still in the education process. I was able to participate in the Goodings event at Pebble this year, and also tried to participate in the Keno auction recently.

    Even as a rookie, my sense was that cars I might be interested in were a combination of "less than perfect, for more than perfect prices".

    One (additional) critique about the event; I participated online. First time ever. I could not get the video or audio links to work, and even after sending live messages to the moderator, no response. The automobila auction had some interest given it was Werner Pfizer's collection; I won 2 lots but took well over 36 hours to even reach someone at the auction to finalize settlement and arrange shipment - and the "chaos" on their end was quite noticeable.
     
  15. BBBBBBB

    BBBBBBB Formula Junior

    Jun 6, 2015
    345
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    Ben
    That has been reported by friends, they by-passed it by opening two parallel windows on the screen:

    first window: live.proxibid.com (Bids, removed bids, sales data, etc.)
    second window: youtube (Audîo and Video)

    Ben
     
  16. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 18, 2004
    7,337
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    Juan
    I was thinking of your story about the Dino and this gentleman. We were mere feet from this drama. Was that his niece? Such entertainment.
     
  17. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    Dec 6, 2002
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    Bubba
    #92 BigTex, Nov 24, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2015
    His picture has been posted, look in the thread on Napolis P3/4...
    EDIT: I see he has posted it up, here!

    His personal research and he also has inherited (at cost) the works of Gerald Roush (deceased) in the USA.
    I think he also has the info, from our Ed Niles.....

    I guess his apprentice would be "CarbonMcCoy", here who uses Gerald's database, after brief employment (and current VINs as well)....

    *joking*
     
  18. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    Dec 6, 2002
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    Bubba
    THIS is a real shame.....I looked thru all the art and memorabilia.....on the website.

    You would think they would understand selling the Helck...

    There has to be an "excitement" to a successful auction, IMO.
    Arrogance, and greed, are real buzz kills....

    They act as if they are doing YOU a favor, to relieve you of your money, and truthfully these prices have next year's escalation and maybe the next FIVE years, built in.
    Markets do not go up, up, up.....those that think so, are due for a reconciliation...

    I did notice the aftermarket parts on the F40, but....give them $1.4M, anyway...
    :D :D :D

    "Just because....."
     
  19. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Rossa Subscribed

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    Juan
    #94 Juan-Manuel Fantango, Nov 24, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  20. BBBBBBB

    BBBBBBB Formula Junior

    Jun 6, 2015
    345
    Full Name:
    Ben
    News from KENO:

    http://www.kenobrothers.com/assets/files/Results-Rolling-Sculpture-NYC-2015.pdf

    "Rolling Sculpture
    PRELIMINARY RESULTS

    Unsold lots are not shown. Keno Brothers LLC. is not responsible for typographical errors or omissions. All prices include Buyer’s Premium and Commissions.
    Total: $8,334,398

    New York City, November 18th - 19th, 2015

    LOT 100:
    1969 Lamborghini Miura P400 S
    $974,400 USD

    LOT 101:
    1960 Lancia Appia Zagato GTE
    $92,400 USD

    LOT 102:
    1972 Maserati Ghibli SS 4.9 Coupe
    $320,000 USD

    LOT 104:
    1940 Alvis 12/70 Special
    $117,600 USD

    LOT 105:
    1965 Aston Martin DB5
    $950,000 USD

    LOT 106:
    1958 Porsche 356 A Coupe
    $123,200 USD

    LOT 108:
    1968 Bizzarrini Strada 5300
    $1,010,800 USD

    LOT 109:
    1939 BMW 327 Sport Cabriolet
    $100,800 USD

    LOT 110:
    2013 Lamborghini Aventador 50th Anniversary
    $504,000 USD

    LOT 111:
    1972 Nissan Fairlady Z432
    $170,800 USD

    LOT 114:
    1961 Jaguar E Type Roadster Outside Bonnet Latch F.F.
    $380,800 USD

    LOT 120:
    1972 Ferrari 365 GTC/4
    $313,600 USD

    LOT 121:
    1968 Toyota 2000GT
    $683,200 USD

    LOT 122:
    1983 Porsche / March 83G-4 IMSA Racecar
    $509,600 USD

    LOT 123:
    1997 Porsche Turbo 993 S
    $442,400 USD

    LOT 126:
    1957 Fiat 1200
    $72,800 USD

    LOT 133:
    1929 Bugatti Type 40
    $464,800 USD

    LOT 135:
    2005 Ford GT
    $285,600 USD

    LOT 138:
    1973 Porsche 911 S
    $201,600 USD

    LOT 139:
    1999 Lamborghini Diablo GT
    $616,000 USD"


    The other cars been informed to being still available for sale.
    Ben
     
  21. BBBBBBB

    BBBBBBB Formula Junior

    Jun 6, 2015
    345
    Full Name:
    Ben
    Perhaps interesting to negotiate for a "steal of the year" ?
    Ben
     
  22. jollygood

    jollygood Formula 3

    Oct 24, 2005
    1,094
    Full Name:
    jollygood


    I too found it very strange that so few people were watching it on the live.proxibid site. Can't remember exactly but yes, it was a two digit number only.
    Wonder if the Keno Bros are just jumping on the bandwagon here and are trying to collect on the auction hype?
    There seems to be at least a couple of collector car auctions going on every month these days.
     
  23. Ferrari 308 Vetro

    Ferrari 308 Vetro F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 12, 2012
    4,392
    Austria
    Again, I was there and the Kenos really tried there best, never seen so many Details for Clients like this auction.
     
  24. jollygood

    jollygood Formula 3

    Oct 24, 2005
    1,094
    Full Name:
    jollygood

    On what basis are you saying that some hammered cars didn't actually sell?
    Which cars would that be?

    And yes, that British auctioneer was reeeally bad, how could they even think of hiring him?
    I was trying to count how many times he said an exact phrase in a row but lost count... Embarrassing indeed.
    Is he coming from another auction house?
     
  25. Ferrari 308 Vetro

    Ferrari 308 Vetro F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 12, 2012
    4,392
    Austria

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